Faulty cladding

P

Plainjoe

Registered User
Messages
14
Hi,

Can I please ask for people's opinions on this.
We recently completed most aspects of our house, a bungalow conversion with an extension. The rear of the extension is clad in burnt black siberian larch. We were informed when choosing this by our architect that it was a very long lasting durable material that would not need treatment and would maintain its appearance for decades.
One year into our house the cladding is completely worn and peeling away in literally hundreds of places.
I phoned the supplier (they are a large nationwide company) who informed me that this should not be happening anywhere and then refused to talk to me any further saying he would only speak with the builder who ordered the wood. This was 6 months ago and we have heard nothing back from the builder bar that the supplier is playing hardball and saying the product wasnt faulty that it must have been how the builder stored and handled the wood.
Apparently the supplier told our builder that they have a clause in their terms and conditions that says they are not responsible for any faulty materials and have no responsibility to reimburse or replace any products.
Has anyone any advice on this?
Has anyone experience with this type of material and problem?
Can the supplier say he wont speak to us and tell our builder that he has no responsibility to stand over the product?
is there anything we can do in this situation? Is there an external body we can talk to to get an opinion or advice on our product and how to proceed?
Thanks for any help/advice.
 
Plainjoe said:
Apparently the supplier told our builder that they have a clause in their terms and conditions that says they are not responsible for any faulty materials and have no responsibility to reimburse or replace any products.
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They can't contract out of their legal responsibilities.

It appears your builder sourced the material and so your path is to pursue the builder directly. They can in turn go after the supplier, but your contract was with the builder. You may need to involve your solicitor to encourage action.
 
Leo said:
They can't contract out of their legal responsibilities.

It appears your builder sourced the material and so your path is to pursue the builder directly. They can in turn go after the supplier, but your contract was with the builder. You may need to involve your solicitor to encourage action.
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Thanks Leo, that’s helpful. Our builder is a good fella but may have to lean on him to get this sorted I feel.
 
Plainjoe said:
We recently completed most aspects of our house, a bungalow conversion with an extension. The rear of the extension is clad in burnt black siberian larch. We were informed when choosing this by our architect that it was a very long lasting durable material that would not need treatment and would maintain its appearance for decades.
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Strange that as one of Ireland's longest established suppliers of timber and other building products states: "Larch - Class 3, moderately durable softwood cladding, Kiln Dried". Did you or the builder misinterpret what the architect said? Did you see the invoices from the builder's supplier?
 
Who ultimately chose the cladding and based on what advice from whom? Is the builder necessarily liable if the customer insisted on a particular material regardless of its suitability? I wouldn't have thought so. Seems to me that that architect might be more liable here than the builder or supplier if they recommended an unsuitable material?
 
According to here it should be plenty durable:

For the purposes of external cladding Siberian Larch is a naturally durable timber, Class 2/3 according to BS EN 350-2. Resins and extracts in the wood create a high resistance to decay and rot, the high density of Siberian Larch means that it is more difficult for decaying organisms to penetrate the wood. With a lifespan in excess of 50 years, Siberian Larch is one of the toughest and most durable softwoods available.

Douglas Fir Cladding | Ireland

Douglas Fir Cladding is a good choice as cladding for a wide range of projects from large-scale construction to small self-builds.
www.corell.ie www.corell.ie
 
Plainjoe said:
We recently completed most aspects of our house, a bungalow conversion with an extension. The rear of the extension is clad in burnt black siberian larch. We were informed when choosing this by our architect that it was a very long lasting durable material that would not need treatment and would maintain its appearance for decades.
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That's peculiar. "Wood = maintenance" was a commonplace saying when we built our house 20+ years ago. Any wood cladding I've ever seen sooner or later gets at the very least visibly weatherbeaten.
 
if the product is faulty and it was sourced by your builder as part of the works then you need to pursue the builder.

If you purchased the product directly you need to pursue the suplier

If the product was not intended for use as cladding you have been misinformed by your architect. Pursue your architect and or your builder who also should have known.

If the product was not intended for cladding and you were at any stage advised this might be the case you don’t really have a leg to stand on
 
mathepac said:
Strange that as one of Ireland's longest established suppliers of timber and other building products states: "Larch - Class 3, moderately durable softwood cladding, Kiln Dried". Did you or the builder misinterpret what the architect said? Did you see the invoices from the builder's supplier?
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We did expect some decay over time Matt but this is falling off at an alarming rate. I posted pictures on another group and people were shocked at the state of it after one year.
 
ClubMan said:
Who ultimately chose the cladding and based on what advice from whom? Is the builder necessarily liable if the customer insisted on a particular material regardless of its suitability? I wouldn't have thought so. Seems to me that that architect might be more liable here than the builder or supplier if they recommended an unsuitable material?
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The architect recommended the material, we suggested the company having see it online and asked the builder to check it out and purchase if he felt it was a good product.
 
ClubMan said:
Who ultimately chose the cladding and based on what advice from whom? Is the builder necessarily liable if the customer insisted on a particular material regardless of its suitability? I wouldn't have thought so. Seems to me that that architect might be more liable here than the builder or supplier if they recommended an unsuitable material?
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The architect recommended the material, we suggested the company having see it online and asked the builder to check it out and purchase if he felt it was a good product.
Blackrock1 said:
According to here it should be plenty durable:

For the purposes of external cladding Siberian Larch is a naturally durable timber, Class 2/3 according to BS EN 350-2. Resins and extracts in the wood create a high resistance to decay and rot, the high density of Siberian Larch means that it is more difficult for decaying organisms to penetrate the wood. With a lifespan in excess of 50 years, Siberian Larch is one of the toughest and most durable softwoods available.

Douglas Fir Cladding | Ireland

Douglas Fir Cladding is a good choice as cladding for a wide range of projects from large-scale construction to small self-builds.
www.corell.ie www.corell.ie
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That was the information we received. The wood itself seems durable but most commenters including lots of trades people say the burning process was too shallow/rushed or that the wood had not been fully dried based on the appearance. Another possibility is that it should have been treated after putting up but the builder states the supplier told him this wasn’t necessary.
 
T McGibney said:
That's peculiar. "Wood = maintenance" was a commonplace saying when we built our house 20+ years ago. Any wood cladding I've ever seen sooner or later gets at the very least visibly weatherbeaten.
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We expected decay but not this soon and to this extent.
 
rustbucket said:
if the product is faulty and it was sourced by your builder as part of the works then you need to pursue the builder.

If you purchased the product directly you need to pursue the suplier

If the product was not intended for use as cladding you have been misinformed by your architect. Pursue your architect and or your builder who also should have known.

If the product was not intended for cladding and you were at any stage advised this might be the case you don’t really have a leg to stand on
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Thank you. The wood was recommended by the architect and purchased by the builder. Its intended use was for external cladding which we used it for.
 
Plainjoe said:
Thank you. The wood was recommended by the architect and purchased by the builder. Its intended use was for external cladding which we used it for.
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Pursue the builder so. Don’t contact the supplier as his contract is with the builder. Your contract is with the builder and architect. The builder should rectify any issues whether it’s a fault with the product or with poor installation. Good luck with it
 
Class 3 larch would often be the inner heartwood and least durable, Class 2 is also widely available but at a premium. The burning or charring process increases the durability further along with offering increased protection against insect attack. Larch of good quality can last outdoors for more than 50 years without any treatment. What details did the architect specify (grade, dimensions)?

When you say peeling, what do you mean?
 
Leo said:
Class 3 larch would often be the inner heartwood and least durable, Class 2 is also widely available but at a premium. The burning or charring process increases the durability further along with offering increased protection against insect attack. Larch of good quality can last outdoors for more than 50 years without any treatment. What details did the architect specify (grade, dimensions)?

When you say peeling, what do you mean?
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I have asked the builder for details on the product and warranties etc so will no more when I get that.
Peeling means that the charring is coming away leaving the exposed wood underneath without char. Hard to explain fully without pictures. This is happening in patches all over the cladding from a few cms to patches 5-10 inches wide in places.
 
Ah
Plainjoe said:
Peeling means that the charring is coming away leaving the exposed wood underneath without char. Hard to explain fully without pictures.
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I get what you mean. That might suggest issues with that process so, but as above, the builder should be the one chasing that.
 
Leo said:
Ah

I get what you mean. That might suggest issues with that process so, but as above, the builder should be the one chasing that.
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Agreed, that’s the way we’re going about it now to start with.
 
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