curious about someone being described as Jewish

D

dollyclare

Guest
When reading about someones parents it said-the father is Jewish,the mother is Nigerian.Is that not telling us the fathers religion,not his nationality..It would be like saying -my mum is catholic,my dad is Italian or whatever.any comments?
 
Re: just curious

Some might argue that "Jewish" can also describe ethnic background. I know of people who would describe themselves as "Jewish" due to their ethnic background but who do not practice Judaism.
 
Re: just curious

Sorry, but I am with dollyclare. It is unusual, and says something about the way we are conditioned. I dont know whether it is good or bad, perpetuated by Irish people or the Jewish people. Is the implication therefore there that if a person is born Jewish in Ireland, then I am Irish but they are Jewish?
 
Re: just curious

It is unusual, and says something about the way we are conditioned. I dont know whether it is good or bad

I don't see how there are any obvious value judgements (good or bad) to be made here if these are statements of fact (i.e. that one parent is actually Jewish - in terms of ethnicity or religious practice or both - and one is actually Nigerian). It might be a bit odd to juxtapose one person's ethic/religious background with another's nationality though but that's all. I don't see how it obviously betrays any particular mindset or anything like that though. Maybe a bit more context about the original comment might help?
 
Re: just curious

Judaism is a religion
Jewishness is a race
"Israeli" is a description of citizenship or nationality.

It's a bit odd to describe the father as Jewish and the mother as Nigerian. But it is probably not as odd as describing someone's father as Catholic and their mother as English.

Is "Nigerian" a reference to race? I would have thought not, but it could be. I am sure many Irish citizens of Nigerian extraction, describe themselves as Nigerian. But then they are probably referring to their nationality as distinct from their race.

Did they mean Israeli when they said "Jewish"?

Irish Jews do find it odd that they are described as Jewish as if they are someway other than Irish. They are fully Jewish and fully Irish.

Brendan
 
Re: just curious

There is also the issue of ethnicity/ethnic background which may impinge on all of the above (nationality, race, religion).
 
Re: just curious

Not all Israelis are Jewish, there are about 1m arab Israelis, most of whom are muslim, although a few are christian arabs
 
Re: just curious

Fair point. I believe that there are even some atheists in Israel too. :) However I don't think that Brendan said or implied that all Israelis were Jewish above.
 
jewish

If its any help, Ive worked on projects in healthcare and the standards in terms of data entry are...

ethnicity is the likes of (nigerian, english, irish, american, european, african,isreali etc..)

religion is (Jewish, RC, protestant, hindu, etc)

race is (black,white,asian,hispanic,indian,american indian,etc).

I have the full list of all if anyone wants a term clarified. I would say that it looks like some grey areas in there in that asian is race but european is ethnicity.
 
Re: jewish

it looks like some grey areas in there

Pale African American areas surely! ;)
 
Don't think that's quite right

I've looked into this before too and as I understand it, it is not correct to use ethnicity as seperate to race and religion. One's ethnicity may be derived from racial, religious, cultural, and/or linguistic characteristics. Car's classification of ethnicity is based soley but loosely (some countries, some continents) on geography or nationality and this has no foundation. If geography was the criteria, then there would be no ethnic Hungarians in Romania, for instance, since their ethnicity would be based on their location/birth in Romania rather than their cultural identification with Hungary. Your nationality and your religion are subgroups of your ethnicity. So technically, it is perfectly correct to chose to identify more closely with your religion or race than your nationality or geographical location.

Due to its subjectivity ethnicity can be seen as a particularly slippery term, open to manipulated by both the defined and the person doing the defining. However, it is its very versatility that makes it useful in avoiding over-simplifiying and classification of world with a population in perpetual flux.

Race is passed on genetically, so is easier to pin down. Since Jewishness is matrilineal, it is a racial term, as mentioned by Brendan. We could say that the jews are more jewish than the irish are irish.

Rebecca
 
race

Hi rebecca
The standards posted had come from some table insert statements I had from a medicare organisation in the states. I think theyre used for, amongst other things, looking for trends in medical conditions.

When using the terms in a descriptive context in conversation, Id liken it to telling a story about 2 people you meet and describing 1 as being tall and the other from belfast. Theyre just 2 different descriptive terms being used. Its up to the listener to make their own mind up on what the term means. I could have a particular view on what a person from belfast is like but also may have a different view on what tall is as Im not the smallest myself. Same goes for the terms jewish/black/irish/american etc. Its open to interpretation based on previous knowledge of that term which will invariably differ from person to person.
 
Re: race

I was going by the definition of the terms from a few different dictionary sources (penguin, cambridge, collins (yuck!), dictionary.com). Organisations in any industry may choose it ignore what the terms actually mean but their meanings and definitions remain. IMHO misuse of these kinds of sensitive terms only serves to further muddy the waters and confuse. In fact, I fail to see the relevance of many of these kinds of descriptive terms in many instances (not car's in particular) and feel they invite prejudice.

Rebecca
 
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