Civil service - pros and cons

D

dubinamerica

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Need some info about the ins and outs of working for the Civil Service and I'm trying to think of pros / cons .. Can anyone add to these and comment on what I have below ? I am being called for i/view for a position in Castlebar in the Dept of Justice. I'm definitely overqualified but thought that it may be a good way to get into the Civil Service.

Any additional thoughts most welcome !!

Pros:
Possible work sharing options
Flexibility with time off (up to five years I think)
Job for life - does that still hold?
Pension
Health Insurance

Cons
Clerical officer pay is extremely low .
For the particular job in question it's shift hours.
 
To add to this:

Pros:
Possible work sharing options
Flexibility with time off (up to five years I think)
Job for life - does that still hold?
Pension
Health Insurance
Number of holidays are great - especially as you move up Grades.
Family Friendly - Term Time is an option(for the Health Sector anway) 10 or 14 weeks off in the Summer if you have kids


Cons
Clerical officer pay is extremely low .
For the particular job in question it's shift hours.
 
Before this thread develops can I ask posters to stick to the topic?
Civil service - pros and cons
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OT posts will be deleted. Please post generalised rants in LOS.

Thanks
aj
 
if you find you are overqualified - you might find the job really boring - and this can cause stress levels ot increase.

You might become cheesed off due to the wages being so low as although i would like, in theory, a state job i would find it hard to get by without the wealth i am used to.
Is there any option for overtime - maybe this could bring the allowance up?

The job "might" move and as far as i know you could be reassigned to another area.
Is there any option for overtime - maybe this could bring the allowance up?
 
Hi - not sure about the availability of overtime but to be honest it's not soemthing I would want to really have to do. The job I'm about to interview for is based in Castlebar so I think it's v. unlikely that it's going to move.
I've heard it's possible to get time off from the civil service - anyone know if you have to be employed a certain amount of time to get this ? Same question for flexi-time or job sharing ?
I've also seen on line some jobs restricted to people serving in the public sector - does this happen much ? Any info would be appreciated and thanks for the help so far!
 
Hi Dia,

When you say 'Public Sector' do you mean the Civil Service, the Public Service (the Civil Service plus Local Authorities, Guards, Health Executive, Non Commercial semi state Agencies such as Fas, Bord na Gon etc) or the entire Public Sector (the Public Service plus the commercial semi state companies such as ESB, Bord Gas etc)?

For the particular job in question it's shift hours.
Click to expand...

What type of shift rota will you be expected to work. Will you get a shift premium? Will your superannuation (pension) be based on your basic rate or on some uplifted rate which takes shift working into account.

aj
 
If its shift work then I don't see how flexi time would apply. Also, the civil service does not provide health insurance but some departments run a group scheme with VHI and/or BUPA which means you can get a 10% reduction. (This option is open to all organisations over a certain size e.g. 10+ employees)

It is unlikely (but not impossible) that your job would move in the future, given that its in an already-decentralised location.

As regards career breaks, you need 2 years service before you can apply and you can only take the equivalent of your service i.e. you need 5 years service to take a 5 year career break.

Edited to advise that Job for life does not still hold for new civil service recruits. Its much easier to get rid of staff now than it was in the past.
 
it's for the dept of justice in castlebar . There is additional pay for working shift but this bit is not pensionable. even with the additional money salary is still v. low. Wow - 10% discount on medical insurance - surely they can do better than that !
That's interesting about the 2 year thing . Does anyone know if that also applies to request for flexi time (say working term time only).
 
dubinamerica said:
additional pay for working shift but this bit is not pensionable
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I wouldn't worry too much about that. If you become a life-time civil servant, your final pension will be 40/80ths of your final salary inclusive of the state pension (with 1/80th for every year worked).
 
How do you mean over qualified? You may be surprised at the level of education now expected, for example i know alot of clerical officers in the local authorities with Honours Degrees.
At clerical level the work can get mundane, which is a killer motivationally. Also there are slight differences between the civil and public sector. For example in some areas of the civil service you can earn a day and a half flexi time a month if you work full time, whereas in the local authorities that is only one day a month because you get more annual leave. Also, new people into the service now have to work till 65yrs. Also, it can take years to get promoted as it goes a lot on length of service and experience in different areas, if you can go where the promotions are you ve better chance of climbing the ladder but this is nt always ideal! Its also worth stating that term time, shorter working weeks mean less pay and affect your overall pension....

Also the number of applicants can be very high these days, so do plenty of preparation in advance and good luck!!
 
Not too sure how the flexi time works with regards to shift work, but you can go on flexi time immediately. To get term time/work sharing you must become an established civil servant, which I think is 2 years satisfactory service (certainly used to be, though it may have been changed to one year more recently). With the medical insurance, this is a group scheme and civil and public service bodies are treated no different from any other group scheme, hence the 10% discount
 
additional pay for working shift but this bit is not pensionable

I wouldn't worry too much about that. If you become a life-time civil servant, your final pension will be 40/80ths of your final salary inclusive of the state pension (with 1/80th for every year worked).
Click to expand...
I disagree, It is worth considering the pension implications of a move to the CS in full. Especially if you are on low earnings with potentially high shift payments or overtime payments which are not reckonable for superannuation). Also you will need to work for the full 40 years in order to get the full benefit. Thirdly the civil service superannuation is coordinated with social welfare. (Effictively this means that the Contributory Old Age Pension is subtracted from your pension).

In summary, if you retire on relatively low superannuationable salary and are shy of the full 40 years you could be left with a very small pension indeed when the COAP is subtracted.

On the positive side CS pensions are indexed against the current rate for the job and opposed to CPI or just discretionary increases from time to time as is the situation in the Private Sector or some semi state bodies.

aj
 
Are you sure you want to take a job where your main concern is taking unpaid time off? As far as I know the time off can't be spent working, it needs to be for college or something.

It boils down how you like to work in my opinion.

If you are used to working in a field where your hard work is appreciated and rewarded you will be unhappy.
If you like to see things get done and get done quickly you will be unhappy.
If you are used to working with a team of people whose job is on the line if they don't pull their weight you will be unhappy.

If on the hand, you don't want to work too hard, want to do things at a very leisurely pace, if your happy to get promoted on your ability to talk bull at an interview, get lots of holidays, work with largely decent people, know that your job is always there, get a pension, no penalties for having babies, the option to jobshare, go for it. At least the crap salary will go a bit further in castlebar. Bare in mind, lots of holidays aren't so great when you've no money to go anywhere.
 
Thanks for all the information on this - the whole area of pensions does not appear to be a great selling point whatsoever.At the moment (as I have a 2 month old) flexibility is important to me . I have worked in the IT sector that I have enjoyed for over 10 yrs (where a 9-5 job can mean quite a bit more hours and pressure and on the plus interesting work) . I have been interested in moving to the public sector and this is a chance (if I get offered the position) but it is far from ideal and quite a drop in money from what i'd expect to get in the IT sector, but if I can arrange flexible hours it could suit for a while and then I can figure out if it's going anywhere and if there's a chance for this to lead into a better position - I suppose I won't know til I try . Anyhow - have the i/view next week so let's see how that goes first. I appreciate all the info regards pension and other areas on this and I am definitely taking the i/view seriously. Spent a couple of days preparing and tweaking the answers to the standard form.
 
I heard an economist on the radio (can't remember which one) say that a 30-40% difference in pay was about right for like for like jobs in the private and public sector. He said this was due to issues such as job security, pensions and conditions. Personally it seems a bit much to expect anyone to take a 30% or 40% pay cut for doing the same job in the public sector, and I'm a card-carrying public sector basher.
You could take the number of applicants going for jobs in the public sector at the moment as an indication that it is, on balance, a good place to work.
I think moneygrower's post is good advice, a bit black and white but in general terms about right.
 
The salary is definitely significantly lower than what I would expect to earn in the private sector . I am concerned that a clerical officer job is really aimed more at someone coming straight out of school or someone who is trying to get back into the work force after an extended break. I know it was mentioned in one of the earlier posts that a lot of people now have honors degrees but it seems overkill for the type of job but I am thinking that would be just a step in the door. The flexibility definitely appeals to me although that would probably still be available in the IT area anyhow but IT is definitely not such a big sector in mayo from what I can find. At the moment because of personal considerations I thought that it would be a good idea to apply and see what happens. I read in the paper that there was over 2000 applications for 45 positions in Castlebar so there must be something in it alright . I'll see what happens anyhow next week and if I get offered something see when they are looking for people to start and so on. The first month is training so that would give some indication anyhow as to how things operate.
 
I had an interview last week and heard that some received notification on Friday last - just wondering if you have heard anything back?
 
My Missus is with the Health Board, I'm a Solicitor. She's at the Galway Races, i'm stuck at work....nuff said!
 
On another note, there can be a huge cultural change between the Private sector and the public sector. Particularly if you are used to working in a fast moving high tech industry. From my experience, often there is a lot of red-tape arbituary budgets and wastage both time and monatory. It takes a long time to initiate change and the current buzz term Value for Money (VFM) often leads to decisions that are good on paper but hard to put into practise. I know I was left feeling very frustrated after my short exposure to the Public sector. I found it hard to settle into public sector working and after two years moved back into the private sector and so far enjoying it. Gave up some great benefits e.g. 'Permanent' position, 35hr week, flexi time, 30 days hols etc etc. but wouldnt look back. If it suits your personal circumstances go for it, it can be very family orientated.
 
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