There's that phrase again intrinsic value.He [Warren Buffett] capped his criticism by saying that "[t]he idea that [bitcoin] has some huge intrinsic value is just a joke, in my view."
That really is silly. A motor car has huge intrinsic value, so too a house, clothing, telephones, computers, health care, holidays etc. These days "survival" is not the only contributor to human value but advanced as we have beyond the caveman instincts for survival we have not reached the stage where a digital entry on a SmartPhone representing nothing but that digital entry has any intrinsic value.There's that phrase again intrinsic value.
Other than Air,Water and Food : which we all require for survival; what has any intrinsic value?
Not silly at all.That really is silly. A motor car has huge intrinsic value, so too a house, clothing, telephones, computers, health care, holidays etc. These days "survival" is not the only contributor to human value but advanced as we have beyond the caveman instincts for survival we have not reached the stage where a digital entry on a SmartPhone representing nothing but that digital entry has any intrinsic value.
Yeah? And my judgement and that of all the very smart ones is that the value of bitcoin is 0.00000.Value is Subjective.
Bitcoin fits nicely into your personal intrinsic values as bitcoin offers a way to transact with another in a censorship resistant way, that requires nobody's approval, no KYC or other personal identifying information, no ID restrictions, requires no trusted parties, no amount transfer limits, anywhere across the globe in seconds to minutes.That really is silly. A motor car has huge intrinsic value, so too a house, clothing, telephones, computers, health care, holidays etc. These days "survival" is not the only contributor to human value but advanced as we have beyond the caveman instincts for survival we have not reached the stage where a digital entry on a SmartPhone representing nothing but that digital entry has any intrinsic value.
I bet if you and all the very smart ones happened to find any bitcoin you would give it away right? Since your judgement says it's value is zero and all that...Yeah? And my judgement and that of all the very smart ones is that the value of bitcoin is 0.00000.
I bet if you and all the very smart ones happened to find any bitcoin you would give it away right?
Something doesn't sound right about this.You are confusing value with price.
It's value is clearly zero.
It's price is $13,100
If you give me a Bitcoin, I will take it and sell it on instantly.
Brendan
ut value is what you predict the price will be at some undefined point in the future, for no specific reason?
Value is subjective.
A second hand car comes onto to the market with any amount of prospective buyers. The average market value for the same car, model, year, condition etc is €10,000.
The car eventually sells for €12,000.
On the face of it this represents bad value. However it subsequently transpires that the purchaser, being offered a new job, is required to provide their own transport for the job. To the buyer, outbidding everybody else and securing the car for €2,000 over the market value will secure him employment in a job worth €35,000 pa. To the purchaser, this additional €2,000 paid to secure the car represents real intrinsic value, to everyone else, he overpaid.
On the face of it bitcoin represents bad value. Its market value is about €1 per coin. But each sells for €11,000 today. It subsequently transpires that the purchaser, realising the devaluation of fiat currencies through QE, conscience of market manipulation in stock, commodities, metals etc, aware of the on-going change to cashless societies, conscience of bank bailouts, bank fraud, enlightened to the concept of trustless financial transactions (blockchain) and wanting an option to move wealth from fiat system to trustless system (bitcoin) has driven the price up to €11,000.
Whether €11,000 represents value is for any prospective purchaser to determine. If you believe that the financial fiat based system is systemically diseased by fraud and corruption to such an extent that it is effectively dying a slow death (like all other fiat systems throughout history) and, is primarily dependent on US military and its allies to uphold its ‘value’, as I do, then €11,000 bitcoin represents real value.
If you think that the fiat based system is working fine, that it is robust enough to withstand current levels of fraud, and that there is nothing signaling to you that its demise is inevitable, that this time is different, then €11,000 is poor value.
That doesn't make sense. Your example of the car only makes sense if that is the only car on the market that the person can buy. At the end of the day he bought car for 12,000 that is only worth 10,000. Doesn't matter if it turned out that he bought it because it allowed him to get a job or it reminded him of the first car he got laid in.
So you have made up your mind. Until now you have protested agnosticism as to the value of bitcoin. But now you have decided that €11,000 "represents real value". It is not obvious what made up your mind since the reasons proferred look remarkably similar to the Shortie Syndrome of your earlier thinking.If you believe that the financial fiat based system is systemically diseased by fraud and corruption to such an extent that it is effectively dying a slow death (like all other fiat systems throughout history) and, is primarily dependent on US military and its allies to uphold its ‘value’, as I do, then €11,000 bitcoin represents real value.
I see, now the burden of proof lies on the bitcoin side.Not really.
It's not really up the non-believers to prove that a bag of air is worth nothing.
It is up to people who believe that it's worth $14,000 to show some basis or calculation. I have yet seen any.
Brendan
The truth is that it has no value. It's possible that it might have a residual value of a few cents, but even that seems very unlikely to me.
Indeed, but you've sidestepped the question: what do you mean by "value"?
By the way, I just checked and according to my dictionary value is: "the amount of money that can be received for something", which makes your assertion "The truth is that it (Bitcoin) has no value" somewhat questionable. You can play with semantics, but what I believe you are saying is "Bitcoin is in my opinion overvalued", which is something else entirely.
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