Bishop Of Kerry speaks out

J

Joe Nonety

Guest
He said people who don't attend mass regularly shouldn't be allowed use the church for their weddings. He's completely right. I know loads of hyprocrites who only go to mass a couple of times a year, but then for some reason when it comes to the wedding they want to include a church mass as part of the nuptials. There's such a waiting period for churches now it'd really lighten the load if only regualr church goers were allowed use the church while the rest were sent to registry offices.
 
As an atheist I'm inclined to agree with this although I can appreciate the counter arguments such as (a) it's hardly Christian to exclude people no matter how causual or a la carte their religious beliefs may be and (b) the children of lapsed or part time practitioners should be entitled to inclusion in the religious environment of their parents/extended family. The hypocritic token exploitation of religious institutions for the marking of certain lifetime events does annoy me but then I'm not part of the club so it's really no business of mine.
 
He should apply the same rules to funerals. There's nothing worse than sitting through a long funeral mass when the poor sod in the box mightn't have the slightest bit of appreciation.
 
This story was covered on the Lunchtime news on Newstalk 106. If the parents are not practising Chatolics then an active catholic is required to sponsor their children for the sacraments of baptism, first communion and confirmation. They will marry people but unless you are active there will be no mass as part of the ceromony. There will be no change of policy in regards to funerals.

I think this is a good thing.

Nogser
 
Funerals are a bit different though

As an atheist none of it matters much to me. I don't believe in making a fuss about my atheism so I go to weddings, funerals, communions etc. rather than upset my friends and relations although I certainly wouldn't play a role and wouldn't want any of these ceremonies for myself. However, I can understand that if I keeled over tomorrow my parents/loved ones, as practising Catholics, might wish to have the full Church works. And if that's what they want, then that's fine by me because I won't know anything about it anyway. In the end, I reckon the funeral is more about the people left behind than the person in the coffin.

Rebecca
 
im sorry to have to mention this but the Church has always been one of the greatest capitalist money making machines of all time!

if people who do not regularly attend mass cannot marry in a church they cannot pay the church fees

i believe these are running at something like 500-700€ per wedding, therefore with the average chruch having 3 weddings a day at the weekends this is a loss of €2100 to them every saturday!

now what owould the bishop say to that?
 
Just to give you a perspective on this one. I will be getting married (hopefully) in well over a year. I am not a church goer (probably only 5-10 times a year) and am not too fussy about getting married in a religious ceremony (I'm Catholic by the way).

However, I know for a fact my family and especially my partners family would love to celebrate this momentous family occasion in the house of god. Religion plays a very significant part in their lives and even though this is my partners and my day, we do realise the broader "joining of families" and creation of our "individual family unit". While I do not see religion as a significant part in my life I do respect it and know I would encourage any child I may have to attend church and give him/her the option of having it in their lives.

Maybe I'm coming across as a hypocrite - but thats my side of the story, just for a little balance!
 
Re: Funerals are a bit different though

In principle, he is dead right.

My only concern (and this is a hot topic at home right now) is that if we don't get our daughter baptised, this will seriously restrict the choice of schools open to her in a few years time.
 
Re: Funerals are a bit different though

Maybe I'm coming across as a hypocrite - but thats my side of the story, just for a little balance!
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I would say that you are but then again I'm just very opinionated to feel free to ignore me... :) I think that, in the case of marriage, the couple need to suit themselves first and foremost. After that you try to accommodate others. However in my experience many people who simply don't have the courage of their own convictions to stand up for what they believe in (or don't believe in in this context) and ritualistically partake in religious ceremonies (involving holy sacraments in the eyes of believers remember) which they don't believe in in order to mark certain lifetime events/milestones and to keep others (usually family) happy are simply being hypocritical. While I obviously attend religious ceremonies (weddings, christenings, funerals) for family, friends and acquaintances I too would never actively participate in them (e.g. attend communion or play any other active role) as I feel that it would be an insult to those who do believe and a betrayal of my own (non) beliefs. In fact my brother got into a big snot with me for refusing to act as godfather to his child on the basis that it would be hypocritical due to (a) my atheism and (b) his lack of active participation in the church. That was fun! :\

My only concern (and this is a hot topic at home right now) is that if we don't get our daughter baptised, this will seriously restrict the choice of schools open to her in a few years time.
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Surely not! Is this true!?!
 
?

I've paid my dues (money) to the Catholic church over the years, like many other people.

Could it not be classed as discrimination if they allow some people to marry in (the catholic people's) church, but not others? Is some people's money better than others?

How much tax does this business pay anyway?
 
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Don't every parish church have to give an amount per head to every pupil in the local primary schools?

If he is going to enforce the no go no show on people, he should stand up and really be counted and refuse to fund the local schools as well as its really none of the churches business......
I mean that from the point of view that it should be the stupid bloody government to do it.
 
atheism

I'm slightly confused by atheism. Is it a practice of non-believing or is it actually a personal distaste for all things religious.

Do atheists just decide that they are atheists or do they go away and study all available religious literature and decide that its all a load of mierde del toro.

I'm fascinated by it all to be honest. I'm beginning to believe atheism is a cop out. my friends tell me they're all atheists, but when questioned why exactly, they all shy away with non-answers.
 
..

Where do atheists get buried in Ireland? Is there an atheists graveyard somewhere? Or do atheists mostly get cremated?
 
Roll call

Clock in to mass every sunday? i always though everyone was welcome in the house of God.
 
Re: atheism

I'm slightly confused by atheism. Is it a practice of non-believing or is it actually a personal distaste for all things religious.
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Well - I personally simply don't have (the?) faith (i.e. I don't believe in a God or other higher spiritual being or creator...) so I am an atheist although I was raised a Catholic. I recognise the importance of religion to humans throughout the ages, and am very interested in the study of the historical and social impact of different religions as well as the relevant "holy" books (e.g. I'm reading the New Testament these days as it happens - a bit ironic since that's more than many Christians do in my experience! :) ) but ultimately view it as institutionalised superstition. I don't have any fundamental(ist) distate for religions or the basic theology of many religions (much of which, the mytical bits aside, I would not disagree with) whatever about the practice in SOME cases. I respect other people's right to freely practice and express their religion without shoving it down my throat and would try to do the same with my (non) beliefs. I honestly believe that one's personality and character (e.g. honesty, trustworthiness, lack of hypocricy etc.) is more important that one's belief system although, I guess, one informs the other.
 
Re: ..

The Bishop is absolutely right in what he says.
There's a sentance I never thought I'd write. :)
Apparently his spokesman has come out and said they are not imposing a ban, so not sure if anything will change.

My only concern (and this is a hot topic at home right now) is that if we don't get our daughter baptised, this will seriously restrict the choice of schools open to her in a few years time.
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There's serious pressure in this country to have kids baptised. Whether it's for school reasons (which is outragious, but we've had that discussion already), or for family reasons.

I'd like to think I'd hold out against it, but who knows when the time comes. I'm amazed that Catholics have no problem with me getting up on an their alter and lying, but if I refused to get up and lie it'd be a scandal.

A Bishop speaking up like this is to be welcomed, hopefully it'll do some good.

Rainyday, best of luck in your decision. It's a tricky one. But the only way things are going to change is if enough people are brave enough to make the touch decision.

-Rd
 
Re: Bishop of Kerry..

So one of Eamon Casey's successors is calling people hypocrites...hmmm


BTW does anyone else see a parallel between this and the use of Croker for nasty British sports? It's their building and they can leave whomever they want use it.


Nat
 
Re: Bishop of Kerry..

BTW does anyone else see a parallel between this and the use of Croker for nasty British sports? It's their building and they can leave whomever they want use it.
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State aid aside, I would tend to agree with that even though I am a supporter of the domestic football (soccer if you must :) ) league who has no time for the GAA or Gaelic football or atavistic nationalist tendancies.
 
Re: ..

A friend of mine claimed to be atheist until I reminded him that he had been baptised which made him a member of the Catholic Church and as he hadn't been excommunicated or left the Catholic Church by an other means, it meant he was still a Catholic, which displeased him immensely!
Although in fairness to him he has removed himself from the Catholic Church in the mean time so he's trying to take his atheism seriously.

He still celebrates Christmas so he's obviously not a complete atheist though.
 
Re: ..

He still celebrates Christmas so he's obviously not a complete atheist though.
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Years ago I worked for a company who had Winter Solstice rather than a Christmas parties. Mind you the company was owned and run by Scientologists rather than atheists. I attended the Scientologist funeral of the main man a couple of years ago which was a little unusual. Maybe if I didn't associate with such weirdos I would still be a nice Catholic boy? Or at the very least a compliantly hypocritical one? :lol
 
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