Bag of Chips. Price increase.

odyssey06

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Since we got Nespresso machine with milk frother, our purchases of coffees out and about have dropped about 75% I'd say.
There's even a Nespresso machine in work here. A lot of the supermarket pods are plastic, and machines can have trouble puncturing them. I find the l'Or capsules don't have this issue and make a nice cup.
So it's only if we're looking for a coffee 'stop' we'd pay for a coffee out.
 

TarfHead

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.. Now the coffee beans need to be digested and passed through a monkey before being hand harvested.......
It depends on the genus of monkey :p

I have a clear memory of the first time I had a Starbucks coffee. From the 'Soup Nazi'-like engagement with the barista, to the taste and the after-taste, it's a memory I hope will stay with me a long time. Suffice is to say every subsequent encounter has failed to live up to that first one.
 

newtothis

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I don't like Starbucks. I don't like the layout of their shops. I don't like their food. I don't like the way for they ask for names and the fake American politeness. I don't like how they spring up everywhere. I don't like how they make a mockery of planning laws. I don't even like their coffee much.......
That's a bit unclear - go on, tell us what you REALLY think of them! :)
 

Monbretia

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Would you really deprive yourself of your little treat over 50c? It's really not that much. And given the minimum wage went up 25c an hour (which would apply to most staff in a cafe) and VAT went up too, these are really increases in running costs that are being passed on to customers.
I would! I can make nicer ones myself anyway but trouble is I'll eat more than one :)

50c is not that much for a one off but it mounts up if you were to tot it up over the year, the old spending diary and all that jazz :)
 

noproblem

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Both cups of coffee and bags of chips were mentioned in the original posts.

It's not extortion: nobody's forcing anyone to pay anything. It may be your opinion it's very expensive, but that's something entirely subjective.

The evidence is that the price reflects the costs of providing it, unless you believe a typical net margin of 5% or less is excessive.
If the net margin comes in at 5% i'd suggest they find another way to make a living. I'd be more inclined to believe coffee shops and the like should be working off a gross margin of between 70/75% and take down their costs from that figure. A lot of the problems with people going into business is their belief they have to open a snazzy place, expensive furniture, fancy cups and cutlery, etc, and their last thoughts go into the actual product. A lot of people in small business's are nice lads and girls but as far as running a business is concerned they haven't a clue. Don't bother coming back to me telling me I don't have a clue, that's just a knee jerk reaction from someone who just does not get it. If you're telling me that a coffee shop owner is working off a net margin of 5% and at the end of the day, providing he doesn't have accidents and the like, all he takes home from every €1000.00 is €50, then he doesn't need me or anyone else to tell him he's wasting his time. There's a lot of places that would do well to turn that over in a few days, anything less is working for nothing but they still class themselves as business people??????????
 

SBarrett

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tra
Yeah I agree. I don't like Starbucks or how they operate but their coffee is not worse than the small independent shops. I agree about Café Nero. There is a certain level of misplaced snobbery creeping into coffee just like it has with beers as well.
Starbucks are constantly beaten on their growth model of basically being all over the place. Are they unlike any other chain in the US in that regard?
As an employer, they look after their staff pretty well, giving their employees lots of opportunities to progress and giving ALL employees health insurance.


Steven
www.bluewaterfp.ie
 

Purple

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Same here. Lavazza is my poison of choice - a fiver in Tesco but sometimes they reduce it to 3.50 and I fill the basket!
Same here! I have one of those little aluminium hob top coffee perculators that cost a tenner. I like it better and prefer the coffee I get from it to the big expensive machine I used to use.

I don't like the whole brand pretentiousness that goes with Nespresso. When they sell their capsules in Tesco and Dunnes I might buy one of their machines.

I don't like Starbucks for the same reason I don't like Nespresso, "Proudly serving Starbucks Coffee"... give me a break. It's just coffee. I don't see much difference between their offering and McDonalds Cafe coffee.
 

Purple

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If the net margin comes in at 5% i'd suggest they find another way to make a living. I'd be more inclined to believe coffee shops and the like should be working off a gross margin of between 70/75% and take down their costs from that figure. A lot of the problems with people going into business is their belief they have to open a snazzy place, expensive furniture, fancy cups and cutlery, etc, and their last thoughts go into the actual product. A lot of people in small business's are nice lads and girls but as far as running a business is concerned they haven't a clue. Don't bother coming back to me telling me I don't have a clue, that's just a knee jerk reaction from someone who just does not get it. If you're telling me that a coffee shop owner is working off a net margin of 5% and at the end of the day, providing he doesn't have accidents and the like, all he takes home from every €1000.00 is €50, then he doesn't need me or anyone else to tell him he's wasting his time. There's a lot of places that would do well to turn that over in a few days, anything less is working for nothing but they still class themselves as business people??????????
If it's aa net margin of 5% after you pay yourself that just means you have a good accountant.
 

Firefly

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I don't like the whole brand pretentiousness that goes with Nespresso. When they sell their capsules in Tesco and Dunnes I might buy one of their machines.
Maybe it was the machine I had, but I always found Nespresso coffee just bland and watery.
 

Sunny

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Starbucks are constantly beaten on their growth model of basically being all over the place. Are they unlike any other chain in the US in that regard?
As an employer, they look after their staff pretty well, giving their employees lots of opportunities to progress and giving ALL employees health insurance.


Steven
www.bluewaterfp.ie
I am sure they are a good employer in the States. I have more of a problem with the Starbucks model in Ireland. I don't like the way they have set up numerous stores without planning permission and then just go 'Oh well' An independent coffee shop wouldn't get away with it. I don't like the way they cannibalise streets and shopping centres by setting up outlets at each end. And because they are owned by the same franchise company, they are not worried about damaging the business. They just want to crowd out the competition in the middle. Which is fine but I just don't like it.
 

Jimmy Dee

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FYI
Seashell of Lisson Grove, (not a bad option and comparison):
A regular bag of chips is £2.20 (large is £2.90)
A regular cod is £7.60
 

Cervelo

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FYI
Seashell of Lisson Grove, (not a bad option and comparison):
A regular bag of chips is £2.20 (large is £2.90)
A regular cod is £7.60
A bit far for me to travel to, they'd be a bit on the cold side by the time I got home :D
 

Jazz01

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Geezzz all - I've having cravings for "chipper chips" followed by a mug of coffee... not a good time to be reading these posts ... stomach is talking to me :D
 

newtothis

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If the net margin comes in at 5% i'd suggest they find another way to make a living
I’m fine, thanks. What do you think it should be?
I'd be more inclined to believe coffee shops and the like should be working off a gross margin of between 70/75% and take down their costs from that figure.
For coffee, that’s about right for a gross margin, though for other items (e.g. bought in food or cold drinks for resale) it would be much lower. The problem is the fixed costs are high and you have to sell a lot of what is at the end of the day a relatively low-value product to cover them. That, and/or charge a reasonable price, which currently works out at around €2.50 to €3.50 for a cup of coffee.
A lot of the problems with people going into business is their belief they have to open a snazzy place, expensive furniture, fancy cups and cutlery, etc, and their last thoughts go into the actual product
Have you been to any independent cafés lately? Most are pretty basic in terms of décor and fit-out. Partly this is because of a design aesthetic that calls for a stripped-out industrial look (no plaster on the walls never mind paint, concrete floors etc.), but partly it’s because they can’t afford or don’t want to spend money on “snazzy places” and would rather focus on the actual product.
A lot of people in small business's are nice lads and girls but as far as running a business is concerned they haven't a clue.
Thanks! I'll try not to take that personally. I’ve no doubt some are like that, but a bit harsh to write off an entire industry, no? For the record, I’ve owned and run several businesses across a couple of industries (technology and hospitality) and have found that whilst the industries are very different in all sorts of ways, there’s a mix of competencies in both. One thing I do know: because of the structural costs, it is very hard to achieve high net margins in the coffee business.
Don't bother coming back to me telling me I don't have a clue, that's just a knee jerk reaction from someone who just does not get it.
I wouldn’t say you don’t have a clue (a bit harsh), but I think it’s likely you are making a lot of assumptions that are not valid.
If you're telling me that a coffee shop owner is working off a net margin of 5% and at the end of the day, providing he doesn't have accidents and the like, all he takes home from every €1000.00 is €50, then he doesn't need me or anyone else to tell him he's wasting his time.
But that’s exactly my point: a 5% return on a business investment is not a good one, hence it’s not a good industry to enter if you think there are riches to be made, despite what you think. It depends on what you mean by “all he takes home” as well; if the owner is working in the business as well as investing in it their wages are a cost item. I think it highly likely that this is how most owner/manages cafés are run: essentially, the owners invest in them to give themselves a job in one. If it really was such a (potentially) lucrative business as you seem to believe it is, there would be a lot more businesses in it that would scale and exit, whether by going public or trade-sale. The fact that this is such a rarity in the industry is an indicator that your assumptions are incorrect.
 
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