Another Tiger Kidnapping

dodo

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It amazes me that a bank does not have a system where access to the building is only allowed from certain times otherwise the alarm would go off. Our building at work is operated on an access card only system with the access times limited by a computer. So even if someone got into the building via a window etc the alarm would just go off. If I went to the building at 7.59 my card will not work I must wait until 8.00.At that time there are many employee already waiting to get in.
 
It amazes me that a bank does not have a system where access to the building is only allowed from certain times otherwise the alarm would go off. Our building at work is operated on an access card only system with the access times limited by a computer. So even if someone got into the building via a window etc the alarm would just go off. If I went to the building at 7.59 my card will not work I must wait until 8.00.At that time there are many employee already waiting to get in.

I think there may be more to this story than originally meets the eye...
 
Are you implying an inside job?

If so you'd better have some more backup before posting that on a public forum

Agree with dodo though. I can't access my office before 08:00 and only a few members of management have 24/7 access.
 
Are you implying an inside job?
You're the only one that's said that on this thread. Certainly I never thought that, but I found it incredible that a single employee was able to remove over seven million in cash from his branch.

Today's Indo has the headline "Bank sanctioned €7.6m handover", and says that Gardaí believe senior officials approved the removal of this money after being informed of Shane Travers' plight - the poor guy was sent in with photos of his (beaten) girlfriend and her family - including a five year old nephew - with pillowcases over their heads and guns pointed at them.

This was a horrendous experience that could happen to anyone associated with a bank worker. I don't know what the solution is, but on a human level it would be very difficult for senior staff to tell an employee, whose family's life is in danger, that they can't have the money a criminal gang have ordered them to get.
 
But if the bank sanctioned it when then was our Minister of Justice on TV complaining that procedures weren't followed and the gardai were not informed immediately?

I'm not saying it was an inside job.
But I'd like to know if senior officals didn't bother to inform the gardai until after it happened.
Even if they were worried about the hostages being hurt due to garda intervention, that's for the gardai to decide to proceed. There ERU are the trained professionals after all
 
For the largest theft in the history of the state, the facts reported to date just make it feel like there's something missing. Maybe as we are told more it will make more sense but certainly the reporting in the 24 hours after the event was unusual, every report made me wonder what we weren't being told.

If they recovered over half of the money after the event, what could they have done if they knew it was going on?

Also anyone know why some news sources weren't reporting the arrests yesterday? I use breakingnews.ie as my homepage and generally get the major news stories but I checked several times yesterday (having seen it in the Times websiste) and it wasn't mentioned.
 
There ERU are the trained professionals after all

Trained professionals that the ERU are there is little point in having them involved in this unless they know where to go!

I think the only way things like this will ever be stopped is if the courts start handing down 30 and 40 year sentences.
 
But I'd like to know if senior officals didn't bother to inform the gardai until after it happened.
From yesterday's Indo, [link to article] -
Dermot Ahern said he was concerned agreed procedures hadn't been followed.
Gardai were not alerted until Shane Travers walked into Clontarf Garda station.

I think the only way things like this will ever be stopped is if the courts start handing down 30 and 40 year sentences.
That would probably help a lot, but I think some sort of procedure also needs to be put in place that no matter what is going on, senior officials cannot (as in "are not able to, even if they wanted to") help out a colleague who has been put in this dreadful position, and that this fact is advertised everywhere.

Am I right in assuming that if the rest of the money is not found, that it will be covered by insurance, which then the rest of us will effectively pay for in increased premiums?
 
I cant understand why they put so much money in the bags. Why so much?

Just one of the many questions. Two main ones being, why were proper procedures not carried out (they are there for everyones safety) and secondly, where did the the gang get its intelligence from? There was inside information passed on and there is no doubt about that.
 
I'm very glad for Shane Travers family that some money was handed over. I too don't understand why they don't have either dummy money or a vastly lessor sum to handover. Well done to the Gardai for recovering a lot of money already and they seem to know who did it.
 
I cant understand why they put so much money in the bags. Why so much?

Just one of the many questions. Two main ones being, why were proper procedures not carried out (they are there for everyones safety) and secondly, where did the the gang get its intelligence from? There was inside information passed on and there is no doubt about that.

I agree with both these points.

My guess is that somebody within the cash centre in BoI either offered up or was pressured to reveal operational details about the bank. The kidnappers would have been aware of the average holdings / lodgements at the time and probably would have demanded a minimum payment and would also have threatened harm if the gardai were notified before delivering the cash.

I could imagine that the conversations went something like "Get the ***k into the bank, we know there's at least 5 million there so bring that or your girlfriend and family are shot. If you or the bank tell anyone your girlfriend and family will be shot. If we see gardai anywhere your girlfriend and family will be shot etc etc".

Panic and fear can be infectious and reasonable procedures made and agreed in a time of calm can seem completely unreasonable, or forgotten, in a time of crisis.

At a guess, based on the limited info I have read, is that somebody at supervisor level in BoI made a mistake in not notifying his / her superiors and the gardai that a raid was underway - and probably made that mistake under pressure or for what they thought were good reasons.
 
At a guess, based on the limited info I have read, is that somebody at supervisor level in BoI made a mistake in not notifying his / her superiors and the gardai that a raid was underway - and probably made that mistake under pressure or for what they thought were good reasons.

I understood that the raiders had photos of the houses of some of the other staff members at the bank, and gave these photos to Travers when he went into the bank. This obviously sends a clear message to the other guys that they will be in trouble if they don't cooperate.

It is very, very difficult to find a solution to this. Once you have people that can access the money, there is always a way to put pressure on those people.
 
Timelocks would solve this surely?

Not really is a cash facility like the one in 2 College Green - they take in and process large commercial lodgements and organise the cash deliveries for some branches and ATM's.
 
They should have put a small tracker in some of the money bundles - the sort that are used by wildlife services to track birds etc. These things are so small nowdays that they wouldnt be spotted.
 
I understood that the raiders had photos of the houses of some of the other staff members at the bank, and gave these photos to Travers when he went into the bank. This obviously sends a clear message to the other guys that they will be in trouble if they don't cooperate.

It is very, very difficult to find a solution to this. Once you have people that can access the money, there is always a way to put pressure on those people.

I've heard they had pictures of the managers houses and their families as well as photos of the hostages they were holding

If a guy walks into a bank with a shot gun, bank staff have always been told not to be a hero and give them the money. In many respects, this scenario was little different

the real scandal will be if some of the perpitrators were out on bail at the time, not the bank handed over the cash. It's only money and it's not worth a child's life
 
They should have put a small tracker in some of the money bundles - the sort that are used by wildlife services to track birds etc. These things are so small nowdays that they wouldnt be spotted.
Would you put the tracker in, knowing that they had pictures of your house and family?
 
Panic and fear can be infectious and reasonable procedures made and agreed in a time of calm can seem completely unreasonable, or forgotten, in a time of crisis.
Absolutely agree, if any one of us were to find ourselves in this horrible situation, we do not know how we would respond.
 
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