Advice needed regarding Ward of Court and family problems.

J

Jaynedoe

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Joe is a ward of court and lives with his sister Ann.

Joe owns half of the property and has a mild disability. Brenda who is another sister owns the other half of property through joint ownership with Joe.

Due to family fall out with Ann she is prevented and has been threatened to leave the property and stay away.

For many years and for peace for Joe and his well being she has stayed away.

(Brenda and Joe had great relationship for years Brenda was Joe's carer)

Brenda has her own mortgage now and couldn't afford to pay her half of the mortgage on the property owned jointly by her and Joe.

Brenda has tried to move back and start repayments but Ann threats stopped her. Ann is Joe's committee has access to his money and has refused to pay Joe's half also. No mortgage been paid in long time. Ann pays nothing towards house.

Thanks for getting this far.....

Ann tried to vilify Brenda with false allegations all unfounded. Banks involved and repossession not happening due to the the wardship. Brenda spends big money on solicitors to try resolve this including mediators but Ann will not leave the house. Brenda tried in vain to get access to Joe but all attempts failed and Brenda vilified again. Arrears building and Brenda blacklisted. Brenda and husband assaulted when tried to call to house. For mental health they stay away, time passed and arrears build. Solicitors useless don't want to deal.

Brenda tried to sign over house to Joe to get away from it all but at time not an option. Contact made months later to said ward office may consider this. Joe is getting old and is in ill health. If poor Joe passed Brenda gets house due to joint ownership. However Ann has said she will not leave if this ever happens and will be staying in the house.

Along come more false allegations from Ann, everything dismissed.

If Brenda signs house over to Joe(Brenda waiting for more info on this) and Joe passed will the house be split between the siblings? Joe is a ward of court.

Would love any insight into this minefield.
 
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I'm sort of wondering why Brenda cares what happens to the property.

Sign it over, get rid of it & get on with your life.
 
Then do nothing and wait.

Based on what you have said, once Joe passes away, the property is Brenda's in full.

At which point Brenda issues a notice to quit to Ann. It will take a while & will cost money for court orders etc., but Ann was living there as Joe's guest & has no rights of residence.

Re-reading your post again, Brenda hasn't paid her share of the mortgage for how long?

Between arrears & likely lack of maintenance, how much truely would be raised if the property was sold.

Forget the sibling warfare & do nothing.

IANAL
 
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Yup, walk away and when Joe passes away surrender the house to the bank. Let them get Ann out and the house sold. Maybe pay a token €5 a month into the mortgage as acknowledgement that Brenda owns the house jointly with Joe, and has not relinquished that ownership.

Otherwise let it go and don’t engage with Ann at all.
 
Jaynedoe said:
Ann is Joe's committee has access to his money and has refused to pay Joe's half also. No mortgage been paid in long time. Ann pays nothing towards house.
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I know nothing about the law...

1) The first question is whether Ann is acting in Joe's best interest? Can you get Ann removed from the committee?

If Joe is not paying his mortgage when he can afford to do so, there is a risk that he will lose his home. Surely that is not acting in his best interest.

2) How much is the house worth and how much is outstanding on the mortgage?

Ah, there is €200k equity in it.

Does Brenda own a separate property with a separate mortgage?
Jaynedoe said:
Brenda has her own mortgage now and couldn't afford to pay her half of the mortgage on the property owned jointly by her and Joe.
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What has that got to do with Ann? If Brenda has borrowed too much, then that is her problem.
Unless it was intended that Joe pay the full mortgage and Ann was just named on it.
Jaynedoe said:
she has put over 90k into it before she was forced out.
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3)
Jaynedoe said:
Brenda and husband assaulted when tried to call to house.
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Did you report this to the Gardai? You should do so. It will stand to you later when you try to get the house back.

4)
I don't think you should sign over the house as you will own it in full when Joe dies.

5)
Jaynedoe said:
However Ann has said she will not leave if this ever happens and will be staying in the house.
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She can tell that to the judge.

6) I think you should make a monthly payment of a token amount - maybe €100 on the mortgage to show that you are not walking away from it.
You should also send a full statement to the lender setting out the issues and that you are seeking to sort them out but are finding it very difficult.
 
Jaynedoe said:
Brenda has tried to move back and start repayments but Ann threats stopped her.
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Does Brenda not have her own house?

How can she move back into a house with a violent sister? If Ann is the Committee she probably will decide where Joe lives.

I presume it's unlikely that the court would eject Ann from the house if she is Joe's Committee?

Brendan
 
Brendan Burgess said:
I know nothing about the law...

1) The first question is whether Ann is acting in Joe's best interest? Can you get Ann removed from the committee?
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This is something that Brenda needs to look into more closely.
Brendan Burgess said:
If Joe is not paying his mortgage when he can afford to do so, there is a risk that he will lose his home. Surely that is not acting in his best interest.

2) How much is the house worth and how much is outstanding on the mortgage?

Ah, there is €200k equity in it.

Does Brenda own a separate property with a separate mortgage?
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Brendas husband owns property as she could not get on a mortgage due to being blacklisted
Brendan Burgess said:
What has that got to do with Ann? If Brenda has borrowed too much, then that is her problem.
Unless it was intended that Joe pay the full mortgage and Ann was just named on it.

It was to be 50/50 but Ann forced her way in and bullied Brenda out. Brenda met her husband and decided for Joe and her it would be better plus she wanted peace in her own life. She continued to visit Joe but that stopped after the assault
3)


Did you report this to the Gardai? You should do so. It will stand to you later when you try to get the house back.
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Yes reported but they said they won't be involved as it's family dispute. Brenda should have pushed this further but at the time mental health was poor
Brendan Burgess said:
4)
I don't think you should sign over the house as you will own it in full when Joe dies.

5)


She can tell that to the judge.

6) I think you should make a monthly payment of a token amount - maybe €100 on the mortgage to show that you are not walking away from it.
You should also send a full statement to the lender setting out the issues and that you are seeking to sort them out but are finding it very difficult.
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I will say this to Brenda for sure, it was discussed before but times were hard so she in better position now.
Lender fully aware and very difficult to deal with. At a standstill since Ann made him a ward of court.
 
Brendan Burgess said:
Change solicitors.

This is a difficult problem and even a good solicitor might not be able to solve it. But many solicitors are useless, so try another one.
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Nobody wants this case. Very complex but she needs new solicitor for sure. Problem is finding one
 
Sue Ellen said:
How would Ann get a portion when she has not contributed to the mortgage and the house is owned by Joe and Brenda only
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On Joe's demise - if intestate - Succession act will apply. No spouse, children or parents so estate split between siblings.

thats if Brenda signs over her 50% ownership to Joe, assuming there are no other siblings she gets it back when Joe passes.

Personally, I'd walk away; do the best you can for Joe but otherwise leave the hare sit.

Agree re resuming what you can afford re mortgage payments, so at least you show willing.
 
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DannyBoyD said:
What rubbish, assault is a crime full stop.
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Ive tried to push her to persue it there was photo evidence and doc reports but cops did not want a bar of it. Brenda was terrified and just wanted away at that stage.
It was 2019 so prob too late now but I wish she had of pushed it
 
DannyBoyD said:
On Joe's demise - if intestate - Succession act will apply. No spouse, children or parents so estate split between siblings.

thats if Brenda signs over her 50% ownership to Joe, assuming there are no other siblings she gets it back when Joe passes.

Personally, I'd walk away; do the best you can for Joe but otherwise leave the hare sit.

Agree re resuming what you can afford re mortgage payments, so at least you show willing.
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One other sibling who keeps as far away from Ann as possible.
 
Besides the house, one very worrying aspect of this whole matter is poor Joe and his health. Does anyone actually go to the house to check on him in light of Ann's fighting and driving people from the home?
 
Hi Jayne

I got an email from someone involved in the area who had seen the thread

your last contributor (Sue Ellen) makes the most important point - Joe is an adult and is a ward of court and may not be able to protect himself from abuse or financial abuse.

Jaynedoe or any person who is concerned about Joe and his actual safety, his assets ( his home) in this case, and also his right to live with who he wants to live with - should contact the HSE.
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Safeguarding and Protection Teams​

HSE Safeguarding and Protection Teams are in place all over the country to provide help. Contact your local Safeguarding and Protection Team by choosing your HSE Community Healthcare Organisation (CHO) Area below.
 
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