50 year old couple first time buyers, but with other debt

O

OldNewbie

Registered User
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Hi,

New to the mortgage game, we're an older couple (40s/50s) applying for a small mortgage (sub 100k) over a short term (12 years) to allow us to buy our first home.

We're finding our bank (UB) to be very, very slow and unresponsive, and are just wondering if this is commonplace, or if we've just got unlucky with our choice of bank/branch.

It's 5 weeks since application first submitted. However there was one piece of paperwork which needed clarification before the application could be keyed in, and it took a whole two weeks for the bank to come back and ask for this.

So in theory the application was sent to underwriters about two and a half weeks ago (assuming they did actually key it in once we responded to the query - they said everything was good to go).

We were told then we'd probably have a response in 48 hours, a week tops.

When we query, the bank just never get back to us - absolute radio silence.

So, is this normal. Should we cut our losses and apply somewhere else, or are all lenders prtty much the same?

OldNewbie.
 
Brendan Burgess said:
Ulster Bank is particularly slow and inefficient.


Why not apply to AIB as they are the cheapest?

Brendan
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We went with UB as we've both banked with them for many years, and thought that this would make the process easier.

We're going to have to look at other options now.

We could quite understand if they came back with a query, or a refusal, or whatever. But just absolute silence, and no response to any mails.

Are AIB particularly good?

And what is EBS reputation like?

Oldnewbie
 
UB have been slow for a long time. The very worst reason for going with a particular lender is just because you always banked with them. Might be of some teeny tiny benefit if your application is not absolutely perfect but if you meet all criteria for amount/income etc then definitely try other lenders if you can get a better deal with them.
 
Just a word of warning with aib. I would advise you ring them rather than use their emortgages.I Applied a month ago and was chasing them since then. Got a call yesterday to say their systems have had problems and the application needs to be restarted from scratch through their advisors as the application is not retrievable. Frustrating
 
We just got AIP from BOI. We went to them first as they have some bank accounts & it was easy & we have a querk that means we couldnt calculate ourselves what a bank was likely to lend, tho we are going to investigate AIB etc as rates are better than BOI. The guy from BOI called to the house in the evening & went through everything, nice guy who knew his stuff, we gave him our applications and a week later he called us to advise we had AIP & a day later the confirmation came in the post.

Easy, quick & painless, now if only they would reduce their rates.......
 
JPSaltee said:
We just got AIP from BOI. We went to them first as they have some bank accounts & it was easy & we have a querk that means we couldnt calculate ourselves what a bank was likely to lend, tho we are going to investigate AIB etc as rates are better than BOI. The guy from BOI called to the house in the evening & went through everything, nice guy who knew his stuff, we gave him our applications and a week later he called us to advise we had AIP & a day later the confirmation came in the post.

Easy, quick & painless, now if only they would reduce their rates.......
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Interesting to read all of these responses - thanks.

And I do feel foolish for being niave enough to think that our 20 year relationship with the bank would count for anything !

Our application, hopefully, is simple enough - our desired mortgage is 1 x combined salary, and based on the quotes we have seen, the monthly repayment would be slightly less than we are currently paying in rent. We have a good clear history of paying that rent while at the same time putting aside €1000 per month to save towards deposit. We do have some short term debt (mostly car loans) but likewise this is documented as reliably paid every month alongside the rent and before we have put aside savings. And to my knowledge, we've never been late on any payment (excepting that month a few years ago when UB computer systems were up the spout and all payment in and out were halted for a couple of weeks).

So we're going to give UB another couple of days, and in the meantime be preparing everything we need to apply elsewhere.

I might add that we are already sale agreed on the house we plan to buy - we had planned to get AIP first, but the househunting went quicker than we thought, and the bank slower . . .

Oldnewbie
 
See all that being up to date and good history/mtg no more than rent etc will be neither here nor there if the stress tested payments on the loan you are looking for combined with your short debt repayments falls outside their percentage of monthly income that can go on loans. Did they check that in branch when you were applying?
 
OldNewbie said:
We went with UB as we've both banked with them for many years, and thought that this would make the process easier.
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The bank doesn't care I'm afraid.

The sales department phone line always has a shorter wait time than customer service.
Anywhere you've got big businesses and small consumers, the businesses are set up to reward "hard working" consumers who shop around, and to charge "loyal/lazy" customers whatever they can get away with.
 
Monbretia said:
See all that being up to date and good history/mtg no more than rent etc will be neither here nor there if the stress tested payments on the loan you are looking for combined with your short debt repayments falls outside their percentage of monthly income that can go on loans. Did they check that in branch when you were applying?
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Yes, they did that - came up green on the four different measure that they apparently test against.

They actually tested this for an amount about 50k higher than we ended up eventually applying for, as the place we eventually found was more reasonable than we had imagined.

So we'd like to think that we have a reasonable chance of success, but win or lose, we would have expected them to come back to us by now, even if it was only with a query.

We'll press ahead elsewhere next week, and I'll update here when we get an eventual answer.

Thanks to everyone for the info.

OldNewbie
 
Keep pestering them and if you get no follow up reply or call then ask to log a complaint re that, it's a pain of a system so whoever you are talking to will do their utmost to avoid having to log the complaint so you'll probably get a call back then :)
 
It's not just Ulster Bank.
I originally applied with Bank Of Ireland as I had a problem with UB. I got to the stage of being approved and just having to sign the offer letter when I saw a an update needed on the offer letter. Their rate dropped .2% from the time the offer letter was printed.
I couldn't get a new offer letter. Phone calls, voicemails, involving the head office. None of that worked. It seems this is something like rocket science.
Another department of BOI rang me about a month ago asking if I still wanted to go ahead with the mortgage. I told her about the offer letter. I told her if they had managed to spend about €2 in getting me a new offer letter they'd have sold me a mortgage that would probably end up making them €150K. She asked if there was anything they could do. I told her the Ulster Bank rate and that we were well advanced there and if they could match it I'd think about it. I never heard back from them again.

As my original problem with Ulster Bank was resolved I started dealing with them as a backup. I'm heading into month 4 of this process now. Signed the documents with the solicitors 3 weeks ago. On Wednesday our adviser told us there was a problem with the signatures. I asked what the problem is. He can't elaborate, so he has to send new documents out to the solicitor and we've got to sign exactly the same way we did before and hope for the best.

I know in the long term UB will save us a fortune. If that wasn't the case I'd have told them to cancel the application. I hope somebody that works in some banks reads these threads. If somebody can manage to make this process efficient they'll clean up.
 
UB Mortgage processing and I assume their application process is now done in Edinburgh and a lot of their back office processing is now being done in India. Discretion and common sense goes out the window when that happens
 
thedaddyman said:
UB Mortgage processing and I assume their application process is now done in Edinburgh and a lot of their back office processing is now being done in India. Discretion and common sense goes out the window when that happens
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Yeah, something is done in Scotland. The documents had to be printed there. I got stuff delivered from China quicker than the documents came from Scotland to Ireland.
 
So I said I'd come back with an update.

Finally heard back from UB, and the answer was No. They are not happy with our level of short term debt.

We have an application in with EBS too, but I'd assume this will be rejected for the same reason.

So we have a plan to address what we need to address, and come back in a year or so to try again.

We've learned some valuable lessons:

1> Never fall in love with a property until you already have an AIP in your hands.
2> Don't expect banks to come back to you when they say they will.
3> Even if you can demonstrate monthly saving double the value of the mortgage, you can still be knocked out by other debt, no matter how faultlessly managed.
4> Don't expect your own bank to show you any mercy just because you have been with them for 16 years.

So, for now, heads down, clear off all other debts, continue to save, delete Daft from our phones, and see where we stand by next easter.

Thanks all here for advice.

OldNewbie
 
OldNewbie said:
Yes, they did that - came up green on the four different measure that they apparently test against.
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They clearly didn't do that bit right in the branch so! Your short term car loans was the first thing I noticed from your info as most likely to cause you problems.

Sorry you were unsuccessful but it's all about the numbers fitting the computer these days. Can you clear any of the short term debt from your savings and still have enough left for deposit?
 
Monbretia said:
They clearly didn't do that bit right in the branch so! Your short term car loans was the first thing I noticed from your info as most likely to cause you problems.

Sorry you were unsuccessful but it's all about the numbers fitting the computer these days. Can you clear any of the short term debt from your savings and still have enough left for deposit?
Click to expand...


We can clear it off, just not quickly enough to save this deal. But it's a learning process.

I've no problem with them saying No - absolutely their gift as to whether they lend to us or not.

But the lady in the branch kept telling us there was no problem at all, she could see nothing that would lead them to say no, and we were absolutely to expect an answer within a couple of days, or a week at the outside.

We feel very bruised, not by the refusal, but by the way our application was handled.

EBS meanwhile, warned us at the outset that it didn't look too good, and have told us not to expect an answer for two weeks.

Anyway, live and learn :)

Oldnewbie
 
That's very annoying, but all banks and not just UB (although they have done a lot of it in last few years) have got rid of experienced staff, don't want to pay them! That problem should have been picked up on initial interview.
 
Hi all,

An update on our status, with good, and not so good, news.

First off, I mentioned earlier that while we were waiting for Ulster Bank to come back to us, we also applied to EBS.

Well, after an even longer wait, EBS finally came back to us three weeks ago with Approval In Principal.

In the meantime, and after considering advice offered here, we had actually taken steps to pay off all short term debts, by liberating some money from an isolated pension account from a former employer (i.e. the 25% tax free lump sum). This one had been sitting on it's own, and not rolled into our other ongoing work pensions.

So we're now sitting with all short-term debt paid off, and with an approval in principal that was granted before the bank even knew we would be able to do this.

All that remained was the valuation . . .

First off, it took two weeks for the valuation to happen and the report to be sent to EBS. Unfortunately, when it arrived, it was for the wrong house (valuer had got mixed up with a different property for someone else, 50km away).

It then took a further week to get that mishap sorted out.

Now finally valuation is in, agrees with our purchase price, and recommends the property for mortgage.

However underwriters have chosen this moment (not earlier - when there was time) to decide that they want an engineers report.

We already had a structural survey done which gives a clean bill of health, and which the valuer had sight of, and references on the valuation. But the surveyor's degree was in Architecture, and EBS want a report from an engineer.

This happened yesterday, and at the same time sellers solicitor contacted ours to say they really can't wait any longer.

So now, we have to find an engineer to do a survey, and get it done in double-quick time or else we will lose the property.

If EBS has told us any time in the last two months that they would want an engineering survey, it could have been in their hands by now.

So, so frustrated.

OldNewbie
 
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