20 cigs by 50 cents ;

WolfeTone

Registered User
Messages
271
A disproportionate tax on the poor. Is any of this tax take to be used for assisting addicts get off their habit?
I wonder what the carbon emissions are from the tobacco industry?
 

SBarrett

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3,129
A disproportionate tax on the poor. Is any of this tax take to be used for assisting addicts get off their habit?
Just go to https://www2.hse.ie/quit-smoking/ and you can get free help to quit smoking.

Any increase in anything can be deemed a disproportionate tax on the poor as they have lower disposable income.



I wonder what the carbon emissions are from the tobacco industry?
Smoking is the leading cause of preventable deaths in Ireland and most countries around the world. Almost 6,000 people die each year in Ireland due to smoking related illnesses.

Making them so expensive so people cut down/ quit is a good thing. It will also discourage younger people from starting in the first place as they won't want to spend what little income they have on such a filthy habit.
 

24601

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Messages
140
The reduction in smoking has been a remarkable public health victory. A combination of the workplace smoking ban, tax policy and other strategies has resulted in a huge reduction over the past 10 years. Prevalence is down from around a third of people to 18%. It may very well be a tax on the poor but the costs to society are immeasurable.
 

noproblem

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1,819
No sympathy at all for people smoking. Just a pack a day now and it's costing €5000.00 per year. Wouldn't be a bit surprised at all to see SVP having a packet of fags in the hand out parcels this Xmas. Bloody mad
 

Duke of Marmalade

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2,431
No sympathy at all for people smoking. Just a pack a day now and it's costing €5000.00 per year. Wouldn't be a bit surprised at all to see SVP having a packet of fags in the hand out parcels this Xmas. Bloody mad
You would save almost €3,000 if you bought your cigs in Spain. That would easily pay for a round trip and a pleasant weekend stay to boot, with lots to spare; not great for the planet I admit. But as Theobold points out that is not really an option for the less well off.
 

Leper

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885
Let's stop fooling ourselves. Most people who smoke in Ireland nowadays have purchased their cigarettes abroad and/or have people bringing the ciggies back to Ireland from foreign holidays.

Next time you're in the smoking area of any pub count the ratio of John Player Blue boxes from Spain -V- John Player Blue boxes from Ireland. Ireland has a score of nil for a start while the Spanish government obtains some tax from Irish purchasers. If we want to gain tax from ciggies in Ireland we've got to charge Spanish prices.
 

noproblem

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1,819
Let's stop fooling ourselves. Most people who smoke in Ireland nowadays have purchased their cigarettes abroad and/or have people bringing the ciggies back to Ireland from foreign holidays.

Next time you're in the smoking area of any pub count the ratio of John Player Blue boxes from Spain -V- John Player Blue boxes from Ireland. Ireland has a score of nil for a start while the Spanish government obtains some tax from Irish purchasers. If we want to gain tax from ciggies in Ireland we've got to charge Spanish prices.
The cigs for the most part bought in Spain and other countries are the rat poison variety (illegal), the same as in Ireland. Let people who smoke do so by all means but for goodness sake I do hope they cop on to the awful waste of money and the cost of their health, never mind what they're doing to their children and everyone around them.
 

noproblem

Frequent Poster
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1,819
Fake news. Same ciggies less than half the price.
Indeed. I brought back some for people from Fuerteventura . €37.00 for 200, so €3.70 a pkt. I bought them in a reputable Supermarket but was told by the friends I gave them to that they were fakes. Who am I to argue? In any case, it's an expense anyone can save on by just stopping smoking. Govt don't mind less smoking, they're saving on medical care and all the other costs involved by people killing themselves slowly.
 

WolfeTone

Registered User
Messages
271
Ouch! Opened a hornets nest without even trying.
I don't have the figures to hand but will try resource them if need be.

- A disproportionately higher level of low-income earners with low educational qualifications are smokers. Estimate, 39%
- high income earners with higher educational qualifications are anywhere between 9-15%.

That is what I meant by disproportionate increase on the poor. The government will be well aware of this.

- As a former smoker, and a former user of the smokers helpline, I can categorically state that the helpline is helpless. To consider the helpless helpline as a tonic to nicotine addiction is not to have any consideration at all for this health issue.

- Increasing the price will induce more smuggling. With Brexit on the horizon, the smugglers are gearing up for a bonanza.

Nicotine is highly addictive. Typically most smokers get addicted in their impressionable teens. It is a predatory industry on young people.
Workplace bans have done a great deal to stigmatize smoking. But more needs to be done to eliminate it altogether.
€0.50 increase is a revenue raising exercise on what is a healthcare issue.
 

DublinD

Registered User
Messages
44
Patches, gum etc..can be prescribed on the medical card...so if really “poor” then quit free of charge.
 

WolfeTone

Registered User
Messages
271
Patches, gum etc..can be prescribed on the medical card...so if really “poor” then quit free of charge.
No doubt a significant assist in reducing numbers of smokers. But smoking addiction goes beyond nicotine. There are significantly profound psychological issues, such as prevailing poverty, lack of career educational opportunities, 'sister' addictions like alcohol.

The €0.50c increase is not an exercise in reducing smokers, it is an exercise in raising revenue. Targeting those who are at the centre of a public health care issue through their addiction.
It is not just targeting poor people, just disproportionately so.
A similar €0.50c tax could have applied to restaurant bills over €100, or hotel accommodation over €150 or tv subscriptions over €50 a month, or online purchases over €150, or jewellery purchases over €300, or club memberships over €500, or anything else you care to think of.
Instead, a lack of imagination and a reliance on 'old reliables' is used to raise revenue disproportionately against those typically on lower incomes and with an addiction.
 

Bronco Lane

Frequent Poster
Messages
351
Just a pack a day now and it's costing €5000.00 per year.
Two packs a day will cost €10k per year. The so called "poor" who can still manage to afford these amounts of money are diverting monies away from their families also to feed their habit. Nobody gets their annual holiday to Benidorm as a result...
 

SBarrett

Frequent Poster
Messages
3,129
The €0.50c increase is not an exercise in reducing smokers, it is an exercise in raising revenue. Targeting those who are at the centre of a public health care issue through their addiction.
It is not just targeting poor people, just disproportionately so.
A similar €0.50c tax could have applied to restaurant bills over €100, or hotel accommodation over €150 or tv subscriptions over €50 a month, or online purchases over €150, or jewellery purchases over €300, or club memberships over €500, or anything else you care to think of.
Instead, a lack of imagination and a reliance on 'old reliables' is used to raise revenue disproportionately against those typically on lower incomes and with an addiction.
That is absolute nonsense. The reason for high taxation is to turn people off smoking. The cost to the HSE in treating people with smoke related illness is far greater than the income generated from cigarettes. Suggesting putting a 50c tax on purchases that already attract VAT at 23% is ridiculous.
 

SBarrett

Frequent Poster
Messages
3,129
Indeed. I brought back some for people from Fuerteventura . €37.00 for 200, so €3.70 a pkt. I bought them in a reputable Supermarket but was told by the friends I gave them to that they were fakes. Who am I to argue? In any case, it's an expense anyone can save on by just stopping smoking. Govt don't mind less smoking, they're saving on medical care and all the other costs involved by people killing themselves slowly.
I tell my kids, don't believe everything you're told. I think I have to say it to you too ;) .

Fuerteventura is a tax free island. Ireland is a high taxation island. Given the huge amount of taxation we have on cigarettes, there is going to be a massive difference in prices without them selling fake cigarettes made in China.
 
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