The advice to cyclists is still the same. Ensure you are visible by placing yourself in front of the car not potentially in a blind spot. The box only formally recognises that it is best and safest practice that cyclists are in full view of the all too easily blind drivers. It isn't intentionally that most drivers hit cyclists. It is accidentally. And it is all too often because they just don't see a cyclist who is to their side and not in their field of view. It doesn't matter if there is a left turn or not. The cyclist is still the one in the greatest danger. (Think of the situation where some driver is planning to turn right and is not properly in their right hand turn box and a driver going straight just nips around to the left ....)
Drivers bad manners to cyclists on the road
- Thread starter truthseeker
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The advice to cyclists is still the same. Ensure you are visible by placing yourself in front of the car not potentially in a blind spot. The box only formally recognises that it is best and safest practice that cyclists are in full view of the all too easily blind drivers. It isn't intentionally that most drivers hit cyclists. It is accidentally. And it is all too often because they just don't see a cyclist who is to their side and not in their field of view. It doesn't matter if there is a left turn or not. The cyclist is still the one in the greatest danger. (Think of the situation where some driver is planning to turn right and is not properly in their right hand turn box and a driver going straight just nips around to the left ....)
Ive been cycling into the city for 4 years now and not had any real incidents. Im pretty confidant on the road and generally don’t let cars own me on the road.
Ive observed everything mentioned above, drivers disregard an impatience for cyclists and cyclist with there head in the clouds weaving and basically acting like a pedestrian walking on the path. Both cause problems for each other and will do for a long time!!
I suppose my advice to the OP and to all cyclists is to make yourself OBVIOUS and PREDICTABLE on the road. Stay in a straight line close to the path for as long as possible. Look FAR ahead for obstruction (in this case the road works) and prepare for it. INDICATE early and pull out early and stay there. Don’t feel pressured to move back in because a car is coming. Then when past, move in. Use your head when it comes to this. Look around and be aware of your traffic surrounding. Take out the head phones (especially in the city)
Driver should try the same. Look ahead and don’t leave changing lanes and turning to the last minute. Again INDICATE before moving, especially on them left turns.
WRT bikes at lights. It will take you an extra 2 seconds to get past the bike. Do you really need to gun it out of the lights?
Ive observed everything mentioned above, drivers disregard an impatience for cyclists and cyclist with there head in the clouds weaving and basically acting like a pedestrian walking on the path. Both cause problems for each other and will do for a long time!!
I suppose my advice to the OP and to all cyclists is to make yourself OBVIOUS and PREDICTABLE on the road. Stay in a straight line close to the path for as long as possible. Look FAR ahead for obstruction (in this case the road works) and prepare for it. INDICATE early and pull out early and stay there. Don’t feel pressured to move back in because a car is coming. Then when past, move in. Use your head when it comes to this. Look around and be aware of your traffic surrounding. Take out the head phones (especially in the city)
Driver should try the same. Look ahead and don’t leave changing lanes and turning to the last minute. Again INDICATE before moving, especially on them left turns.
WRT bikes at lights. It will take you an extra 2 seconds to get past the bike. Do you really need to gun it out of the lights?
If only it was just 2 seconds - then no-one reasonable would mind. But often across the junction is an oncoming queue of traffic waiting for the light to go green as well - and on narrow city (and suburban) streets, it can be a looong queue of traffic at certain times of the day. So if you don't get past the cyclist at the junction, you could be stuck behind them for ages with no hope of getting past because of constant oncoming traffic on a narrow road. I know it's not going to make my head explode having to wait but it is frustration like this that lead to impatience with cyclists. Haven't creamed anyone myself - just explaining the rationale for being peed off at the cyclist plonking himself at the front of the queue.
Totally agree. Proper cycle lanes are all well and good but when you have cycle lanes in this country they are rarely properly maintained, of sufficient length and adequately separate from either pedestrian or vehicular traffic. Personal hates are those that are painted onto paths as these generally have a lower quality surface, have dips and hillocks for vehicle access, have pedestrians that saunter on them and have cross roads without the stop sign being on the correct side of the cycle track (so technically the car pulling out from the side road actually has precedence even though they are pulling from a side road to a main - the cycle track is not treated as if it is part of the main road so two cyclists would have different priority if they were one on the path and one on the road - had some friends knocked down at such stupid junctions). Oh and people do so like to park their cars in/on them. Also those phantom statistic adder-uppers which allow councils to declare having X km of cycle paths even if they are only in 100m sections. Or those cycle tracks which are simply a line painted on the side of the road without even the suggestion of a different colour surface to indicate a cycle lane.
Think the only solution then orka is to "get on yer bike"
truthseeker
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Not being able to get past someone else on the road happens with a variety of other vehicles - not just cyclists, you can get stuck behind a tractor, bus, slow moving vehicle towing something etc. Whats the big rush? If you get that frustrated because of other road users then perhaps the answer is not to drive?
There are some that are widely used. The ones that aren't - it's usually because they're poorly designed, poorly maintained, full of pedestrians/street furniture/parked cars/glass.
Plenty of photos of Dublin's cycle tracks here and here.
Just a few examples specifically of off-road ones since they're the ones you asked about:
Nice slippy coating of mud and wet leaves in Fairview.
http://www.geocities.com/cyclopath2001/DCP01379.jpg
A considerate car driver at the Artane roundabout.
http://www.geocities.com/cyclopath2001/Dcp01168.jpg
Pedestrians and glass at Fairview.
http://www.geocities.com/cyclopath2001/Dcp01124.jpg
Some lamp posts so cyclists can practice their slalom skills in Clonskeagh.
http://www.geocities.com/cyclopath2001/clonskeagh1.jpg
Lamp post and bin in Glasnevin, with the potential bonus of bus passengers embarking/disembarking.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/joedrumgoole/366871140/in/set-72157594180677328/http://l.yimg.com/g/images/spaceball.gif
No but I am not doing anything illegal and if it slows down drivers all the better.
Ruam
It's been said already. To stop drivers taking off quickly and then taking an immediate left turn. The worst place they can be is in a blind spot. Before every left turn a motorycyclist is trained to do a "lifesaver" and this is a check over their shoulder. You have a wing mirror, do you check also? If you do, you're one of the few. Most cyclist fatalities are caused by vehicles turning left with a cyclist on the inside.
I cycle but more reguarly use a moped. And I'd use the same tactic of stopping in front of a car in both cases.
Besides I find many car drivers are practically asleep at the wheel and have little awareness.
Outside the cocoon of your car you learn the traffic light sequences and I can be already across the junction when the lights turn green and you're only engaging first gear.
Realy, I find Dublin Bus drivers to be excellent and they are probably the most highly trained drivers in the city.
As for taxi's and for drivers with their little precious in the back seat and baby on board stickers. Couldn't care less about me or anyone else
Yeah that's a stereotype but you used one yourself.
Tax you say.
Motorists pay motor tax, hence www.motortax.ie
Or any you one of the many people I see on this site ranting about "road tax"
Motor tax is based on emmisions and as cyclists produces no emmissions during a commute, they pay the correct rate of zero
Motor tax is based on emmisions and as cyclists produces no emmissions during a commute, they pay the correct rate of zero
Nice way of putting it
truthseeker
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Took some of the good advice on this thread this morning, especially that of positioning on the road, giving plenty of time to go around the roadworks I pass. I also availed of more of the cycle lanes even though it meant chopping and changing from road to cycle lane frequently in some instances.
The biggest change I made was taking a good look back as I approached an obstruction or narrow part of road and if there were a lot of cars behind me I hung back a little until they had passed so that I had the road a little more to myself to get past the worst areas.
As a result I had a less stressful cycle, with more work on my part to ensure I was not getting in the way, and a couple of waits to allow myself a clear run past the worst areas.
Thanks to all for the constructive advice.
The biggest change I made was taking a good look back as I approached an obstruction or narrow part of road and if there were a lot of cars behind me I hung back a little until they had passed so that I had the road a little more to myself to get past the worst areas.
As a result I had a less stressful cycle, with more work on my part to ensure I was not getting in the way, and a couple of waits to allow myself a clear run past the worst areas.
Thanks to all for the constructive advice.
G
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Ah! The age old debate! Some good examples of the opinions on both sides here!
I wouldn't say that drivers are the worst - they are 100% better today than they were 10 odd years ago.
What I do think are the worst and even less predictable are the pedestrians - particularly the pedestrians who have returned to the road wearing school uniforms recently.
These usually travel in groups - the long haired, skirted ones have a habit of putting their face to the kerb edge and doing banshee screams at passing cyclists. The trouser-wearing grubbier ones tend to jump onto the cycle lane or road and wander there for a lot longer than they need to as cyclists (which they have seen) approach.
Why do they think verbal assault and/or obstruction are hilarious?
I wouldn't say that drivers are the worst - they are 100% better today than they were 10 odd years ago.
What I do think are the worst and even less predictable are the pedestrians - particularly the pedestrians who have returned to the road wearing school uniforms recently.
These usually travel in groups - the long haired, skirted ones have a habit of putting their face to the kerb edge and doing banshee screams at passing cyclists. The trouser-wearing grubbier ones tend to jump onto the cycle lane or road and wander there for a lot longer than they need to as cyclists (which they have seen) approach.
Why do they think verbal assault and/or obstruction are hilarious?
Walking (safely and with due consideration to all other road users!) this morning I met a man travelling in what to me seemed a classic example of everything dangerous... On a bike, on the footpath, turning from Appian Way onto Leeson Street heading towards Donnybrook (where the path is severely narrowed by a sizeable tree and sightlines around the corner are poor) with a dog on a leash in tow! At least the dog had short legs so he couldn't go too fast.
Makes me despair. How can careful cyclists argue the toss when there are tossers like this undermining their arguments?
Makes me despair. How can careful cyclists argue the toss when there are tossers like this undermining their arguments?
If you had met him on the way back, he may well have been further destablised by a couple of ill-packed shopping bags over the handlebars - did he have brakes on the bike?
I went past a youngster furiously pedalling a small bmx style machine last week on which the brakes had no blocks at the rear and the cable detached at the front - he brought it to a noisy stop at a set of lights by putting his both feet on the ground and leaning fully backwards... new set of trainers every three days I'd say!
We really, really need a formalised cycling proficiency programme in this country.
I went past a youngster furiously pedalling a small bmx style machine last week on which the brakes had no blocks at the rear and the cable detached at the front - he brought it to a noisy stop at a set of lights by putting his both feet on the ground and leaning fully backwards... new set of trainers every three days I'd say!
We really, really need a formalised cycling proficiency programme in this country.
In the same way that drivers can argue the toss that the small number of idiotic drivers do not represent every driver.
However, the potential consequences of the idiotic driver are far more severe and common than that of a cyclist.