Delays in rolling out vaccine

[Wahaay]

Meanwhile today's Inewspaper reports that the UK has taken delivery of up to 10 million extra vaccines.
It will allow the NHS to reach all over-50s and those with underlying health conditions by the end of this month.
If supply holds up throughout the spring, all over-40s could get a jab in April with the 30-39 age group being vaccinated towards the end of the month and 18-29-year-olds called up from May.

UK has up to 10 million extra Covid jabs, as surge in supply means NHS can ramp up second doses

Wales's First Minister said a 'dip' in vaccination numbers has now come to an end with greater supplies available across Britain

inews.co.uk

The Irish media this morning appears to be parroting the EU line that everything possible has been done to get vaccines.
And it's all the fault of the British media for stirring the pot.

www.irishtimes.com/news/world/europe/there-are-no-spare-vaccines-available-for-ireland-to-lobby-for-1.4506889

But arch-EU fan Guy Verhofstadt doesn't share their magnanimity.
This was him spitting tacks at least a month ago and he's still hacked off.

[Stakeholder] I love the EU - but the vaccine strategy is a fiasco

In my opinion, the contracts Europe negotiated with the pharmaceutical companies were extremely unbalanced. Precise on pricing and liabilities but weak and vague on supply and timing, and with escape routes to the contractual obligations of the pharmaceut...

euobserver.com

 

[Paul O Mahoney]

"GlaxoSmithKline plans to apply for emergency use authorisation in the US and elsewhere for its experimental Covid-19 antibody treatment after an interim analysis of clinical trial results showed an 85 per cent reduction in hospitalisation or death among patients.

GSK, which developed the treatment with Vir Biotechnology, also said a separate in vitro study suggested the therapy remained effective against variants of concern. They plan to seek authorisation from the US “immediately” as well as approvals in other countries.

The approval would add to other antibody treatments, including those from Eli Lilly and Regeneron, that the US Food and Drug Administration has authorised. However, concerns remain about the efficacy of some of the approved treatments against virus variants."

From FT today, behind paywall.

This might be an additional weapon.

 

[Bronco Lane]

[broken link removed]

It would appear that in Menorca they will vaccinate those under 55 years of age who are willing to take the Astrazeneca vaccine. Those over 55 years have to wait until one of the other vaccines arrives.

 

[Wahaay]

[broken link removed]

It would appear that in Menorca they will vaccinate those under 55 years of age who are willing to take the Astrazeneca vaccine. Those over 55 years have to wait until one of the other vaccines arrives.

Meanwhile the UK has administered 11 million doses of AZ vaccine across the entire age spectrum with no reports of any serious side effects.
European politicians such as Merkel and Macron who cast doubt on the effectiveness of this vaccine will force citizens across the continent to pay a heavy price for their foolishness.
It has encouraged vaccine scepticism and will cause the unecessary deaths of a great many people.

 

[Odea]

It has been suggested that this is a cynical approach by the Spanish authorities so that they can advertise that their population aged under 55 have been vaccinated, so it is safe to come and spend your tourist Euro. At the same time they are leaving those over 55 wait until one of the other alleged more suitable vaccines become available.
or
Is it a good idea to use one vaccine for those under 55 and another for those over 55.
or
Should we be vaccinating a range of ages of people rather than concentrate on the over 80's?

 

[Wahaay]

It has been suggested that this is a cynical approach by the Spanish authorities so that they can advertise that their population aged under 55 have been vaccinated, so it is safe to come and spend your tourist Euro. At the same time they are leaving those over 55 wait until one of the other alleged more suitable vaccines become available.
or
Is it a good idea to use one vaccine for those under 55 and another for those over 55.
or
Should we be vaccinating a range of ages of people rather than concentrate on the over 80's?

In the UK it's a combination of age,clinical vulnerability and frontline NHS staff


NHS England weekly stats published to 7th March. 1st dose has gone to:

95% of over-80s
100% of 75-79
96% of 70-74
89% of 65-69
69% of 60-64
19% of 18-59
95% of frontline NHS staff
90% of clinically extremely vulnerable
91% of older care residents
72% of care staff

 

[Bronco Lane]

In the UK it's a combination of age,clinical vulnerability and frontline NHS staff

Our population is around 5 million people or so.

I just cannot see why we are unable to vaccinate the lot of us in a month and get us sorted once and for all. This constant excuse of not getting enough vaccines is wearing thin. Other countries are doing it.

To hear that we are doing well compared to other countries, positioning ourselves in the middle of the league table is not good enough. Why are we happy to sit in the middle of a league table? We should be up there with the top three.

 

[odyssey06]

Our population is around 5 million people or so.

I just cannot see why we are unable to vaccinate the lot of us in a month and get us sorted once and for all. This constant excuse of not getting enough vaccines is wearing thin. Other countries are doing it.

To hear that we are doing well compared to other countries, positioning ourselves in the middle of the league table is not good enough. Why are we happy to sit in the middle of a league table? We should be up there with the top three.

The other countries are who exactly? The US, UK and Israel?
The US and UK have far bigger pockets and resources when it comes to sourcing vaccines.
The UK authorized vaccines early on an emergency basis, which they took a considered risk on given their huge resources in the field.
We don't have that.

There's a finite amount of vaccines in the world right now.
One of the reasons we don't have more vaccines right now is because the US and UK have hoovered so many up.

We would never have signed up for the deal Israel signed up for.
Even if we had, would the Irish state have been able to roll it out with military efficiency like Israel?
Not a chance.

If we had 'gone it alone' far more likely we'd be in situation Canada is in right now, with even less % of the population vaccinated.
Maybe we'd have gotten lucky and it would have gone better than expected, or maybe it would be a fiasco (do you remember how we sourced dodgy PPE?). It would be a disaster for us if we were far behind the rest of the EU in the vaccination rollout.
Working within the EU deal makes sense for Ireland. Do you really trust the HSE etc to succeed at this if they went alone? I don't.
Sure they should also be looking at what side deals could be available (within the bounds of the EU deal).

So that's not to suggest EU have been perfect in terms of vaccine rollout, but I would not expect Ireland on its own to fare better.

 

[Purple]

I just cannot see why we are unable to vaccinate the lot of us in a month and get us sorted once and for all.

We don't have the vaccines to vaccinate people.

This constant excuse of not getting enough vaccines is wearing thin.

Yea, reality can be really inconvenient like that sometimes.

Other countries are doing it.

Who? Tell us what country has vaccinated its entire population in a month?

Israel has a vastly superior and integrated and much cheaper than ours (ours is more than 40% higher per capita). That's on the people mwho work within the health service, every one of them. Therefore Israel is much better placed to work with with manufacturers to be the pilot project and offer accurate data. They also paid a premium to get to the front of the line.

The USA is now vaccinating over a million people a day. The USA is the richest and most developed and most powerful country in the history of the world.

We are a small country off the coast of Europe trying to cope with this disease within a legacy of inefficiency, inertia and structural incompetence which is deeply ingrained in our healthcare system. We need to get real here.

 

[Odea]

When I heard Michael Martin announce that he had secured 40,000 plus new vaccines to be delivered, I almost expected the champagne corks to be popping in the background and the fireworks going off.

My heart sank. It he is going to be excited by 40,000 extra vaccines arriving then I fear for this country.

 

[Odea]

We don't have the vaccines to vaccinate people.

Why not? We are not doing enough. To hear on the radio yesterday that our minister for health has not even phoned Astrazeneca about anything was dreadful to hear.

Yea, reality can be really inconvenient like that sometimes.

It shouldn't be the case.

Israel has a vastly superior and integrated and much cheaper than ours (ours is more than 40% higher per capita). That's on the people mwho work within the health service, every one of them. Therefore Israel is much better placed to work with with manufacturers to be the pilot project and offer accurate data. They also paid a premium to get to the front of the line.

Are we not one of the biggest producers of pharma in the world? Could we not have entered discussions with one of the companies about setting up a production line here?

We are a small country off the coast of Europe trying to cope with this disease within a legacy of inefficiency, inertia and structural incompetence which is deeply ingrained in our healthcare system. We need to get real here.

Yes, a small country that should have been able to move a lot quicker than we have.

 

[Paul O Mahoney]

When I heard Michael Martin announce that he had secured 40,000 plus new vaccines to be delivered, I almost expected the champagne corks to be popping in the background and the fireworks going off.

My heart sank. It he is going to be excited by 40,000 extra vaccines arriving then I fear for this country.

It's good news 46000 extra vaccines will be administered.
Of all the government's failings being let down by Astrazeneca repeatedly isn't something they can be blamed for.

It's very frustrating for everyone but that's where we are.

 

[SoylentGreen]

The USA is now vaccinating over a million people a day. The USA is the richest and most developed and most powerful country in the history of the world.

My understanding that interest rates are near zero when borrowing money? Could we not borrow now and pay later? Get it sorted.

 

[Paul O Mahoney]

My understanding that interest rates are near zero when borrowing money? Could we not borrow now and pay later? Get it sorted.

Who do we buy from?

 

[Sunny]

Meanwhile the UK has administered 11 million doses of AZ vaccine across the entire age spectrum with no reports of any serious side effects.

And yet just over 1m second doses of the vaccine. The UK made the decision to lengthen the period between doses which is their right but unless they have guaranteed increased supplies, they are going to hit a situation where first doses will fall because available doses will need to be given to people for the second dose. They are have already seen a slowdown in the numbers being vaccinated compared to early months. The UK have done well but they still have a long way to go.

There are still questions to be asked about AZ and the EU deal. The UK seem to be able to increase supplies and they are not banning exports so why exactly are they failing on EU order side. The EU have exported millions of vaccines outside of the EU including millions to the UK but are somehow being portrayed as vaccine hoarders. The US is sitting on millions of AZ vaccines when it hasn't even been approved. So what exact deal did the company do with the US to deliver before approval? The EU seem to have backed off the company since their initial outburst so can only be left thinking that the contractual arrangement reached between the EU and AZ had more than a few holes in it..... And that is the fault of the EU and EU governments...

 

[odyssey06]

My understanding that interest rates are near zero when borrowing money? Could we not borrow now and pay later? Get it sorted.

We could if there were significant quantities of vaccines not already locked into contracts AND we avoided a bidding war with other countries thinking the same.
But they just aren't there yet. In the short term the EU programme we are in is the only game in town.

Possibly, and this is just me flying a kite, we could be talking to the countries (e.g. US) for a cash and swap deal for AZ vaccines which they have, and don't appear to be using anytime soon i.e. we will use the vaccines now and re-allocate some of our future stock to replenish it.

 

[Wahaay]

And yet just over 1m second doses of the vaccine. The UK made the decision to lengthen the period between doses which is their right but unless they have guaranteed increased supplies, they are going to hit a situation where first doses will fall because available doses will need to be given to people for the second dose. They are have already seen a slowdown in the numbers being vaccinated compared to early months. The UK have done well but they still have a long way to go.

There are still questions to be asked about AZ and the EU deal. The UK seem to be able to increase supplies and they are not banning exports so why exactly are they failing on EU order side. The EU have exported millions of vaccines outside of the EU including millions to the UK but are somehow being portrayed as vaccine hoarders. The US is sitting on millions of AZ vaccines when it hasn't even been approved. So what exact deal did the company do with the US to deliver before approval? The EU seem to have backed off the company since their initial outburst so can only be left thinking that the contractual arrangement reached between the EU and AZ had more than a few holes in it..... And that is the fault of the EU and EU governments...

The UK has up to 10 million vaccine doses on hand at the moment - there was a 2 week slowdown in supplies but as I reported upthread this has ended.
The UK has a legally-agreed timetable with all the drug companies to ensure continued supplies and it expects all adults to have received their first dose by June without impinging on the timetable for second doses.
The failure on the EU side is down to their poorly-negotiated contracts and late procurement of vaccines last year.
For instance, the UK last year ordered 60 million Novovax jabs - clinical results yesterday show a 90% success rate across all variants and is likely go be approved in the UK next month.
The EU has yet to sign a deal.
And it's not a question of the EU exporting vaccines - these are legal contracts between other countries and individual companies within Europe to manufacture vaccines that have been developed elsewhere.
There is nothing the EU could do to prevent their export without causing a major diplomatic incident.

 

[joe sod]

Yes, that's the big risk. It shows that sharing the vaccine with poorer countries before we vaccinate our low risk population is not just morally the right thing to do but is actually in out medium term interest.

That sounds great and is the line being pushed by the WHO and EU but how realistic is that in all fairness. It could take decades for that to be achieved when you look at how long it took to get polio vaccine to the poorest countries. What are lockdowns and sun holidays and hospitality supposed to remain closed until the poorest are vaccinated?, that's actually what one senior expert was suggesting which is preposterous, some of these experts really have come out with some daft suggestions.
I think alot of this talk is being used to give cover to the seriously deficient European vaccination roll out. Even joe Biden united States is pursuing an America first strategy

 

[Paul O Mahoney]

Just on Novavax
it's 96% effective on last year's variant
86% against the UK variant
55% against the SA variant
No data on Brazilian variant yet but based on those figures it's going to be a very important addition.

 

[Sunny]

The UK has up to 10 million vaccine doses on hand at the moment - there was a 2 week slowdown in supplies but as I reported upthread this has ended.
The UK has a legally-agreed timetable with all the drug companies to ensure continued supplies and it expects all adults to have received their first dose by June without impinging on the timetable for second doses.
The failure on the EU side is down to their poorly-negotiated contracts and late procurement of vaccines last year.
For instance, the UK last year ordered 60 million Novovax jabs - clinical results yesterday show a 90% success rate across all variants and is likely go be approved in the UK next month.
The EU has yet to sign a deal.
And it's not a question of the EU exporting vaccines - these are legal contracts between other countries and individual companies within Europe to manufacture vaccines that have been developed elsewhere.
There is nothing the EU could do to prevent their export without causing a major diplomatic incident.

Well the Novovax doesn't have 90% success rate against all variants for a start so lets not get carried away.

I am sure the UK do plan on all adults receiving their first dose by June. Ireland is still claiming 80-90% of adults by June.......Politicians make promises. Lets see what happens