Would you vote for a FF candidate if . . .

I just had a look at the FF website and went to the "Local Candidates" (West Cork section, which I'd be familiar with) and I was amazed to see how many of the candidates have no photo of themselves on their pages and that some of them had little or no information about themselves there either.

Maybe they're afraid that they'll be recognised. ;)
 
cork said:
Local Authorities failed miserably to build houses during the celtic tiger era as they did in the 1950s. But FF only got 30% at the last locals.

All governments subsidised property. FG, Labour, the Greens, FF gave mortgage interest relief.
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cork said:
Yes - spending could have been controled better & the public sector could have been reformed. Competition could have been introduced in more areas & the lack of broadband is a disgrace.

FG and Labour were calling for more spending. FG wanted to cut stamp duty and Labour wanted more tax cuts.

No Political party was blameless.

Facts are - people were sucked in by the borrow and spend type of atitude. They are now left with big loans and negative equity.
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cork said:
Mortgage interest relief has been there for years.

The main cause of the bubble (IMO) was people were sucked into the frenzy.

It was akin to a Pymanid schemes.
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cork said:
Thats the kernel of it. Muptiples of joint salaries were common place for mortgage applications.

This was a disgrace.

I remember the David Mc Williams "Agenda" programme of the early 00's.

He consistantly stressed that houses were over priced.

Where was the regulator and the central bank.

There was an absense of reality from all political partys.
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cork said:
Yes - spending could have been controled better & the public sector could have been reformed. Competition could have been introduced in more areas & the lack of broadband is a disgrace.

FG and Labour were calling for more spending. FG wanted to cut stamp duty and Labour wanted more tax cuts.

No Political party was blameless.

Facts are - people were sucked in by the borrow and spend type of atitude. They are now left with big loans and negative equity.
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It's hard to know where to start with all this guff. The key central issue is that regardless of what anyone in the opposition, FF have been in power for 15 years. They got us into this mess, and made the international situation dramatically worse. Your feeble attempts to spread blame have no basis in the real world.

It is interesting to note that you castigate FG/Labour for wanting more spending, and you castigate the local authorities for not building more houses - slight contradiction there, no?

You ask where was the regulator and the central bank? Perhaps you should be directing this question the FF-appointed board members? Of to the FF finance minister that appointed them? Or the FF finance minister that wrote the enabling legislation that created the 'light-touch' regulation environment that ensured that Seanie Fitz & Co could cost the state €4 billion as of today.

It was indeed a pyramid scheme, created, supported and fuelled by the FF govt. We all know who was at the top of the pyramid creaming off the billions, and who is left at the bottom of the pyramid paying for their messing. Today's poll results show that people see through the FF denial guff clearly.
 
Complainer said:
It's hard to know where to start with all this guff. The key central issue is that regardless of what anyone in the opposition, FF have been in power for 15 years. They got us into this mess, and made the international situation dramatically worse. Your feeble attempts to spread blame have no basis in the real world.

It is interesting to note that you castigate FG/Labour for wanting more spending, and you castigate the local authorities for not building more houses - slight contradiction there, no?

You ask where was the regulator and the central bank? Perhaps you should be directing this question the FF-appointed board members? Of to the FF finance minister that appointed them? Or the FF finance minister that wrote the enabling legislation that created the 'light-touch' regulation environment that ensured that Seanie Fitz & Co could cost the state €4 billion as of today.

It was indeed a pyramid scheme, created, supported and fuelled by the FF govt. We all know who was at the top of the pyramid creaming off the billions, and who is left at the bottom of the pyramid paying for their messing. Today's poll results show that people see through the FF denial guff clearly.
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And there ends the party political broadcast on behalf of the Labour Party (upper middle-income protected sector urban branch).
Yes, it's all down to FF; if it wasn't for them we'd be living in a socialist utopia. It's not as if they were re-elected a number of times over those 15 years. God forbid anyone would have to be grown up about it and admit that it was a national problem.
 
I have not had a single FF local candidate knock on my door or any leaflets. They are obviously not bothering to salvage the local vote.
Got the standard state sponsored littir from Liam Aylward and chum. Recycled without reading it.
 
It was indeed a pyramid scheme, created, supported and fuelled by the FF govt.
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Right - How a party that got 30% in the last locals could re-zone land in the backs of the beyonds makes no sense.

But we'll see what the likes of joe higgins will do for leafy suburbia.

The Labour party are far too close to public sector unions. Are the Labour party still opposing the pensions levy?

Rhy'd do anything for a few votes.
 
cork said:
Right - How a party that got 30% in the last locals could re-zone land in the backs of the beyonds makes no sense.
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It's OK, Cork. The election is over now. You don't have to keep spinning the party lines here.

You've mentioned before that you work in a local authority. I can only assume that you've never set foot in or spoken to any of the staff from the planning dept, given your comment above. If you did know just a smidgen about how local authority planning works, you would know well that elected councillors have relatively little influence on planning. They do get involved in the county development plan, but they have absolutely no role in approving or rejecting particular planning applications.

These decisions are made initially by the full-time professional planners. When the developers don't get the decision they want, they then appeal to An Bord Pleaneala. The politically appointment members of ABP get to make the real decisions. So that's one significant part of the reason why we had a property bubble.
 
Ed054 said:
Well Done!

She got in
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Ed054 I think if FG had put a hamster up for the vote it would have done better than those fools from FF.

I have a friend who is an FG activist, he was telling me that FF just don't get it, they think the reason people are annoyed with them is due to the last budget not because of the other 1,000 things FF have cocked up on.

Complainer:-as far as I'm aware when it came to voting on the rezoning of Dun Laoghaire golf club it was Martin Cullen who instructed DLRCC to rezone more land for housing but it was the councillors who voted on it.
 
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S.L.F said:
Ed054 I think if FG had put a hamster up for the vote it would have done better than those fools from FF.

I have a friend who is an FG activist, he was telling me that FF just don't get it, they think the reason people are annoyed with them is due to the last budget not because of the other 1,000 things FF have cocked up on.

Complainer:-as far as I'm aware when it came to voting on the rezoning of Dun Laoghaire golf club it was Noel Cullen who instructed DLRCC to rezone more land for housing but it was the councillors who voted on it.
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Well there will be a by election due in Donegal so maybe its time to test the Hampster.

Can't do any worse them a lot of the idiots in the Dail
 
You will be waiting for that by election to happen. I doubt it will happen within the current Dáil.
 
cork said:
Right - How a party that got 30% in the last locals could re-zone land in the backs of the beyonds makes no sense.

But we'll see what the likes of joe higgins will do for leafy suburbia.

The Labour party are far too close to public sector unions. Are the Labour party still opposing the pensions levy?

Rhy'd do anything for a few votes.
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Cork, arguing with Complainer about FF is like arguing evolution with a creationist; his opinions are informed by the intimate truth of his socialist dogma and so FF can never do any good.
 
S.L.F said:
Complainer:-as far as I'm aware when it came to voting on the rezoning of Dun Laoghaire golf club it was Noel Cullen who instructed DLRCC to rezone more land for housing but it was the councillors who voted on it.
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Nope - the FF Minister used powers brought in by the FF govt to direct the county manager to rezone more land. The councillors only got to vote on which lands were zoned, but had no choice but to rezone a certain amount. From http://buckplanning.blogspot.com/2008/06/dn-laoghaire-golf-club-development-gets.html
The land in question was controversially rezoned in 2004 after the then minister for the environment, Martin Cullen, used his powers under the 2000 Planning Act to issue a statutory directive to the council to rezone more land in the area to provide extra housing.
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IIRC, FF & FG councillors voted in favour of rezoning the golf club, while LAB & GP voted against or abstained (though I'm honestly not 100% certain of this). Certainly, FF Cathoirleach Trevor Matthews seems to have been very gung-ho about the rezoning [broken link removed]. Thanks for reminding me of this angle. Cork's claims of no FF involvement in rezoning are sounding more than a little hollow.
 
I have a friend who is an FG activist, he was telling me that FF just don't get it, they think the reason people are annoyed with them is due to the last budget not because of the other 1,000 things FF have cocked up on.
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I think you will find that playing with people's incomes does have a huge bearing on their political opinions, it also goes the other way which is why they have been in govt so long. Now that FG have figured out why people are annoyed with FF it will be interesting to see if they can figure out how to make people believe in them.
 
Complainer said:
You've mentioned before that you work in a local authority. I can only assume that you've never set foot in or spoken to any of the staff from the planning dept, given your comment above. If you did know just a smidgen about how local authority planning works, you would know well that elected councillors have relatively little influence on planning. They do get involved in the county development plan, but they have absolutely no role in approving or rejecting particular planning applications.
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They may not get involved in individual planning applications but they do get involved in rezoning land, otherwise why would Frank Dunlop have been bribing them? I know of at least one FF counciler who just happened to be an estate agent who voted in favour of rezoning and then just happened to be appointed the selling agent for the estate of houses that got rebuilt on the rezoned land.
 
Mpsox said:
They may not get involved in individual planning applications but they do get involved in rezoning land, otherwise why would Frank Dunlop have been bribing them?
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Quite true.

Mpsox said:
I know of at least one FF counciler who just happened to be an estate agent who voted in favour of rezoning and then just happened to be appointed the selling agent for the estate of houses that got rebuilt on the rezoned land.
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I'm sure Cork will find a reason to blame FG and Lab for this incident.
 
involved in rezoning land
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They wrecklessly re-zoned land with little consisance to services, schools or facilities.

These were local authorities with little FF influence.
 
cork said:
They wrecklessly re-zoned land with little consisance to services, schools or facilities.

These were local authorities with little FF influence.
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this was a local authority with FF majority on it at the time,
 
cork said:
They wrecklessly re-zoned land with little consisance to services, schools or facilities.

These were local authorities with little FF influence.
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Which local authorities are you referring to, and when did this happen?
 
I was just making a general point about land rezonings that focused little onto weather infrastructure was in place to support development.

After houses were built - house owners look for schools and community centres.

Pity, they did not look at the facilties before buying the house or that local councillers re-zoned lands in such a fashion.
 
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