Who actually pays for the fuel in the hose pipe ?

Presumably this problem is faced by ordinary motorists every day at the petrol pump? TKK has explained it well for the situation where there is only one type of fuel.

But is poor Mercman vulnerable to being shortchanged if they have a multifuel hose pipe?
 
Manta, thank you for your Post. The Hose was emptied by pumping it back into the Truck. Whilst I accept the points you have made, it still leaves the question unanswered as to who is billed for the diesel in the pipe after the delivery, although it seems apparant that the person paying for it does not get delivery of it.

The same circumstance is with LPG.
 
Mercman, are you 100% sure that the driver didn't refill the hose before he put your invoice into the meter?
 
Mercman - At the start of the process you got a full hose of diesel that did not move the metre from zero for your delivery. This offsets the hoseful at the end.

I can't say it many more ways!! It is absolutely impossible to empty the hose during a delivery.
 
mercman said:
The Hose was emptied by pumping it back into the Truck..
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But this does NOT empty the hose, it simply changes the fuel, ie. (as stated before) the hose remains full, so when your delivery started it was also from a hose that did NOT need to "charged".

Therefore a 1000 litres metered = a 1000 litres delivered. QED!
 
QED said:
Mercman - At the start of the process you got a full hose of diesel that did not move the metre from zero for your delivery. This offsets the hoseful at the end.
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Not entirely true QED, once the dispencing nozzle is opened the meter will start turning, and as is obvious when dealing with a full hose, 1 litre dispenced = 1 litre metered.

So therefore there is never a case where "you got a full hose of diesel that did not move the metre from zero for your delivery"
 
I am at this point not disputing any of the contra arguments. But I know what I saw, I know what I was told by the driver, but fail to understand as to why the company will not issue me with an answer, clearly and straightforward. I also know that on one of a previous delivery when my Tank was completely empty, I was billed for more than the Tank actually holds, which has started this query.
 
SparkRite said:
But this does NOT empty the hose, it simply changes the fuel, ie. (as stated before) the hose remains full, so when your delivery started it was also from a hose that did NOT need to "charged".
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But the hose has to be emptied if A got fill of marked fuel and B was going to get fill of Road diesel. I understand that if the driver knew he was going to B after A then he could switch off marked fuel 100ltr before full so as to push the marked fuel out of the line and to charge up line with road diesel for B, but i'm sure that drivers dont always know who the next customer is gonna be
 
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mercman said:
I am at this point not disputing any of the contra arguments. But I know what I saw, I know what I was told by the driver, but fail to understand as to why the company will not issue me with an answer, clearly and straightforward. I also know that on one of a previous delivery when my Tank was completely empty, I was billed for more than the Tank actually holds, which has started this query.
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A tank's contents as marked on the tank is an approximate measurement,which is normally about 95% capacity,or as it is called a nominal value.
To fill a tank completely it could hold maybe 110% of nominal capacity,or as it is known brimful capacity.
A tank capacity is an approximate value,whereas a metered oil delivery is an exact measurement as it is coming from a calibrated meter.These meters are checked and sealed regularly by officers from the Weights and Measures dept.
 
A suggestion to resolve.....

Next time you are getting a fill - get them to fill say a five litre drum/bucket first - stop and check the reading on the lorry.... that should tell you if you are getting what the meter says...
 
mercman said:
I also know that on one of a previous delivery when my Tank was completely empty, I was billed for more than the Tank actually holds, which has started this query.
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my own tank is 900 litre, and it has taken well over that. i would have to root out the receipt but i believe it was around 970 litres.

it's not relevant really, but when your tank was empty do you mean the tank was dry or that there wasn't enough oil in it to start the boiler? because depending on where the connection is on the outside of the tank, you could some oif oil left in the sump of the tank. (this is not relevant to your query, just a point of information):)
 
If your tank takes 1000 litres and your tank is filled with 1000 litres and you are billed for 1000 litres doesn't that answer the question?
 
Bronte said:
If your tank takes 1000 litres and your tank is filled with 1000 litres and you are billed for 1000 litres doesn't that answer the question?
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With respect, this isn't really the question being asked. Your solution is, of course the simplest route to go down as i alluded to in earlier post. At this stage it has developed into all sorts of conspiracy theories
There has been a few posters saying the hose has to be full always. If you read the senario in my post 28 can anyone explain what happens in this case
 
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Bronte said:
But if what I posted is correct then who cares what is or is not in the hosepipe?
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Obviously the OP would like his question answered, as would I.Just because your post was correct doesn't mean the question has been answered:)
 
In the real world nobody ever knows exactly how empty their tank is and therefore they order a fill rather than an actual amount. In a 1500 litre tank circumstance the sight of 50 or 60 litres is hard to quantify.

Whilst the other Posts are noted, I think it fair to say that with the best will in the world, mechanical procedures might, can and could be be altered to suit every users needs.

I have asked again the Oil company that delivered the oil. When if ever a reply is forthcoming (should be the next few days) I will advise.
 
But if your are going with this theory, then when you get a delivery, you are getting what was left in the hose, after a previous delivery was made to some other, less inquisitive customer, so it will all balance out! Maybe!







mercman said:
No the meter kicks in at the tanker side before the fuel enters the hose. I saw this happen when I was having Road Diesel delivered and the driver emptied the hose back into the Tank, as there was agricultural Diesel in the pipe.

It is an interesting one but they are all at it and this is why it might take an age to get to the bottom of it. I do not mind paying for what was delivered. However I will be damned if I am going to pay for supplies that weren't delivered.
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Mopsy said:
But if your are going with this theory, then when you get a delivery, you are getting what was left in the hose, after a previous delivery was made to some other, less inquisitive customer, so it will all balance out! Maybe!
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A perfectly acceptable senario if everyone was having the same type of fuel delivered. Certain tankers are divided into compartments for different types of fuels!
 
mercman said:
This is an Interesting query. If a delivery of Oil is made, whether it be Fuel Oil or Heating Oil and when the tanker senses the Tank is full, it automatically stops pumping. The pump stops when the Hose is full of Oil. Are Consumers being billed for the Oil that remains in the Hose Pipe which is driven off for the next fill or replaced back into the Tanker (which I have seen been done). There could be a fair few gallons left in the Hose Pipe which is being billed to the Consumer !!

Anybody have an idea of this ??
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If the hose is empty when the delivery guy arrives then the chances are you are being charged for something you are not getting.

You should ask the driver if it is full or empty when he arrives.
 
Mopsy said:
But if your are going with this theory, then when you get a delivery, you are getting what was left in the hose, after a previous delivery was made to some other, less inquisitive customer, so it will all balance out! Maybe!
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Not quite because all you end up getting is the meter reading on the pump ie what you are paying for anyway.
 
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