Should we build??

T

tomred

Registered User
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42
Hi,

We were lucky enough to inherit a site in Celbridge and we have spent the last 2 years trying to get planning permission. Early this year we were granted permission to build a 4,000 sq ft house. At this point we are trying to decide on our next steps and tying to weigh up all the pros / cons before proceeding.

I make the cost to build at c. 600K. We both have good jobs with good salaries (combined earnings c.160K) and I think we could make the mortgage criteria. Both jobs are reasonably secure. We have 2 children and currently own a house in Lucan where we owe c.200K (should still have some equity but not a great deal). We have some savings (c. 150K) but much is tied up in Equities.

We are very keen to build and are consious that this is an excellent time to build from a cost to build perspective.

Anybody got any thoughts?
 
A 4,000sq ft house is very big. You don't just have to pay a mortgage of 600k you also have to maintain and heat the house. The cost of which would be very high. If the government bring in a tax on houses based on size your tax would be high. My sil has a house of about 2500 sqft and maintenance is high as is cost of heating it. Personally whilst a house that size sounds lovely I don't think it is very practical. Would you not go for a smaller house?

Also (sorry to be so pessimistic) but what happens if university fees are increased and/or children's allowances are cut. Also I think we will end up paying a lot more in taxes/levies over the next few years.
 
Judging by what you've said, good salaries, secure employment etc, if you think you can afford repayments and build the house of your dreams.........GO FOR IT! Lifes too short.
 
The golden rule is not to build too big for the area, in terms of either house type or size.
There is a very small market for 6-bedroom houses, for example.
That having been said...

Building a Big House #1

You should see what the market is like for that kind of property of a similar size site in Celbridge.
See if they sell for €600K PLUS the cost of a similar sized site PLUS fees, levies and contributions.
You inherited the site, but you should include a cost for it in your assessment.
Similarly with professional fees and levies.
All things that go to make up the cost to produce a product like yours should be added in, then check this figure against the price of houses locally.
If the market supports your figures, then you may make a sound investment, but you should then consider it the market will fall further and/or the builders price fall further.
If house prices are less than your total, you have to consider whether this is a negatively distorted market.
I think its safe to say that such would be highly unlikely, given current trands and predictions.

Building a Big House #2

There's a lot of hoo-ha around right now about getting great prices for building work.
Just remember, most of these guys were on the pigs back a year ago.
Some may resent cutting their throat to stay afloat at the same time as they're dying for work.
Make sure you retain adequate professional oversight to cost, manage and inspect the work to ensure that you get what you paid for and that its to the required standard.

Building a Big House #3

Do you really need a 4,000 sq ft house for 4 people?
A 2,500 sq ft 4 Bed would do most families of that size, including the guest room.
Would youthink of keeping something back in terms of your disposable income to cater for your pension, your kids education in the future, your health insurance, holidays and travel?
 
Another option would be sell the site and get closer to being mortgage free! It's a place i'd love to be.
 
If you were every going to build a house like that now is the time. You could get it built 300,000 at a push. You could prob get a great house built for 500,000.

There are lots of tradesmen about now who would jump at the chance for work and are pricing to keep themselves going. Its a great time to build.
 
tomred,
I'm interested in your question. We are in a very similar position, permission for 4000 sq ft house granted 12 months ago and are now wrestling with the decision to build or not. We are trying to put together a budget but I'm not sure how to make sure all the elements are in place - can you advise how you reached your budget of €600k and does it include all professional fees, development levies and what else needs to be included?
M
 
If you can afford to go for it now is the time alright! I think kildare coco fees are quite big for planning contributions have you checked that out yet? Depending on what route you decide to use to build i would say you would comfortably have a good finish for €400k, depending on site conditons and finishes/spec of house. Have nearly completed ours 4,500 for around €59/sqft!

www.selfbuildardmore.blogspot.com
 
We started working on a project for someone, yesterday. Cost for 3000 sq ft, turn-key finish, is Eur 109/sq ft, with a high spec. Let's say you really push the boat out, towards v.high performance, and say Eur 120/sq ft - that makes your build 480k.

So, 600k sounds very high, but there again, maybe you're putting in a 100k kitchen for all I know.....it only takes a couple of things like that to really upset the budget.

What I would say is this: 4000sq ft is indeed big. With your budget, it could conceivably cost less than a 'standard' house, half that size, to run, so don't let that put you off.
 
well done jolly man, you have the patience of a saint ! what about a nice bit of coving to finish your lounge off ?
 
get the plans out too a few builders and see what prices you get back,otherwise its all speculation,then see if you can afford it,butt galwaytt sumed it up 600k is very steep but it just takes a 100k kitchen or all stone on the house too add serious money too the cost of the house.
 
Thank you all for your contributions. I should have made it clearer that the 600K figure was a finger in the air calculation which was based on a similar house built by a friend. It also took into account a high end finish.

Similar to mb16 I would welcome any thoughts on how best to firm up a budget and how best to approach. I agree with sending out the plans but I do not think that it is a simple as sending out the plans as they can be priced / intrepreted in so many different ways and I am struggling on how to approach this.
 
tomred,
a decent quantity surveyor should be able to come up with a pricing document taking into account whatever specifications you like, right down to the smallest detail, you can then send the blank document to contractors and they can tender for the job. once i have my plans finalised this is what im thinking of doing. they do it all the time for commercial and civil projects. your quantity surveyor can also look at the tender prices that you recieve and tell you if their price is abnormally low for the work involved.
 
Ye can get a QS but 9 out of 10 domestic contractors wont have a clue about pricing a full BOQ and will just come back to you with a ball park figure. The other options are to draw up a very detailed spec and get the contractor to price on this basis and you can always get your QS to price an elemental bill for your own use in keeping your budget on track have a look at my blog under the google pages link in the toolbar might be some useful info there budget tracker and Boq Items 1, 2 and 11. I am a QS, so it was a pet project for me on my house :)

Mosstown, i dunno im not too mad about coving plus im sick of working on it lol :) I was up around those beams for nearly a week staining and varnishing lol

www.selfbuildardmore.blogspot.com
 
Hi Tomred,

very interesting read indeed.

did you see this other thread here on passive houses -worth your while looking at it.

I also looked into building - more dreaming than anything - and loved the open style and high quality Huf Houses - shown on Grand designs.
very modern and eco-friendly. expensive I think but worth a look.
and they put them up very qucikly.

enjoy,
k
 
we have about 4000sqft house and about half way through the build, couple of large out buildings, about 300k in at the moment, and expect a further 150k before final fixtures and fittings so 500k and thats doing a lot of work myself so Id say 600k is a nice realsitic budget for a very high spec house. you could and can do it at least 200k cheaper but you do get what you pay for. Building now is a very good option deals are there to be had (although a lot of them still want to charge an arm and a leg) you can no get quality workman at a good price that are available, honest days pay for an honest days work. so go for it
 
Hi,
I just found this forum while googling mobile to rent Wexford and came accross your post so I registered to answer you.
My husband has a building company and is currently building a 3,000 sq foot house in Blessington. The total charge for an extremely high end finish including underground (not underfloor) heating is €360,000.

There are definitely savings to be made in the current climate in both materials and labour and particularly designer kitchens and bathrooms which can be discounted by up to 50% on previous retail mark.

It is unfair to say that all builders (main contractors) have been creaming the market and are now giving realistic prices. The main reason my husband can now quote less is that his plumber that used to be on €200 a day is now working for €130, his labourers are on €90 instead of €130, he still uses the same quality employees but the market has changed their salary expectations and hence his costs along with some reduction in materials. - Though the VAT is slightly higher.

Get someone who will give you excellent references and has proper insurance and who you feel will be always straight with you and reasonable. Building a house that size is a long and stressful project and you need to trust your builder.

Of course this price does not include your legal, planning and other costs so your budget will be commensurately more but in general, I think that if you plan to stay in your house long term, go for it.

There's never been a better time to build, life is short and if I were doing I would build as big and as fabulous as I could afford. We all grow into our mortgages eventually!

Best of luck.
 
Hi,
We are just finally (after much mortgage fun) about to start building next month. When we went out to builders we just had a fairly detailed spec on what we wanted. Costs varied a good bit, but so did what they included so was very hard to compare like with like - it turned out the dearest was also providing us with way more and a higher spec than others, so ended up close to being considered!
The builder we went with in the end was the one that provided us the QS breakdown of everything - at least this way, the only additions are either things we have missed from the long lists ( broken down by different sections) or changes we will make or something that couldn't be predicted.
If I were you, I would look into builders and get it out there - your dream house awaits you - but just be warned, you will have some fun and games with the banks!
Best of luck!
 
karltimber said:
Hi Tomred,

very interesting read indeed.

did you see this other thread here on passive houses -worth your while looking at it.

I also looked into building - more dreaming than anything - and loved the open style and high quality Huf Houses - shown on Grand designs.
very modern and eco-friendly. expensive I think but worth a look.
and they put them up very qucikly.

enjoy,
k
Click to expand...

Great idea - that's what I'd do. Much better looking than yet another dormer bungalow.
 
When we went out to builders we just had a fairly detailed spec on what we wanted.
Click to expand...

Clare lassie how did you go about writing up your spec? I'm trying to get organised to send out the plans to a few building contractors at the moment!
 
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