Multiple problems with 2 year old house in Offaly - Help!

K

Kenno77

Guest
Hi,
My upstairs bedroom floor was sagging so I contacted builder. This only became a problem after a few months of living in the house.
The carpenter that came to repair said the quality of workmanship in the house as a whole is very poor.
To fix the sagging floor he has secrewed some new joists onto the old to make floor level. He said he cannot garuntee that this will not re-occur. I over heard them talking and they think the house is in big trouble.

The sound proofing the house is terrible, I can hear the neighbours talk at normal volume. Again, this seems to be getting worse over time.

Do I have any comeback on the builer to get these issues fully resolved? If so how do I go about it.
 
I'd imagine you definitly have come back here.
Check the Homebond policy (if you have one)
I'd contact your solicitor and get him on the case!

Good luck
 
Thanks Steevo,
I don't have a home bond policy, how do I get one?

Would any solicitor do or is there anybody you could recomend?
 
Kenno77 said:
Thanks Steevo,
I don't have a home bond policy, how do I get one?

Would any solicitor do or is there anybody you could recomend?
Click to expand...

No - Homebond is the insurance scheme or equivelant, that all builders need to sign up with before building a house - it is to protect the buyers in the case of structural defects for up to 10 years - www.homebond.ie

However, my experience with Homebond, and the anecdotal evidence I have read, is that they are not great to deal with and don't really want to know unless the house is practically collapsing around you.

My advice, for what it's worth, is that the first thing you should do is get an engineer to fully survey the property and give you a list of issues if any - see if you can get the survey to include a noise test. It won't be cheap but it will give you solid backup for any claims you may make.
 
Kenno77 said:
Hi,
My upstairs bedroom floor was sagging so I contacted builder. This only became a problem after a few months of living in the house.
The carpenter that came to repair said the quality of workmanship in the house as a whole is very poor.
To fix the sagging floor he has secrewed some new joists onto the old to make floor level. He said he cannot garuntee that this will not re-occur. I over heard them talking and they think the house is in big trouble.

The sound proofing the house is terrible, I can hear the neighbours talk at normal volume. Again, this seems to be getting worse over time.

Do I have any comeback on the builer to get these issues fully resolved? If so how do I go about it.
Click to expand...

probably not, but you may have some comeback on the professional who 'certified' the work. If it can be shown that the work did not comply to relevant standards, in this case IS 444, then the certifier 'may' be liable.
 
Who would normally certify the house? County Council Engineer or private Engineer?
 
Private engineer.
Did you buy this house??? if so check the deeds to see if there is a 'certificate of compliance' included. If there is none, then your solicitor is in trouble.

If you didnt buy it, did you build it??
 
sydthebeat said:
Private engineer.
Did you buy this house??? if so check the deeds to see if there is a 'certificate of compliance' included. If there is none, then your solicitor is in trouble.

If you didnt buy it, did you build it??
Click to expand...

I did buy the house. I don't have a copy of the deeds. I persume the bank holds the deeds while we are paying the mortgage?
 
While the floors were lifted upstairs today, I did think I noticed a cuople of brick joints with no mortar in them. I noticed a mortar joint about 2 inches wide in the jack wall in the attic in the past. Does any of this count as structural?
 
Kenno77 said:
While the floors were lifted upstairs today, I did think I noticed a cuople of brick joints with no mortar in them. I noticed a mortar joint about 2 inches wide in the jack wall in the attic in the past. Does any of this count as structural?
Click to expand...

if its just a mortar joint, it shows bad workmanship, but not necessarily a structural problem. Structural problems appear as cracks, both internally and externally......
If the floors sagged it would say to me that the floor joists are installed incorrectly... either spanning too large a span, not bridged enough, or not specified strong enough.......

Your solicitor should have a copy of the cert of compliance. Explain the situation to him/her and get their advice.... see if the cert covers all aspects of the building regulations.

What size floor joists have you....?
Is there a stamp on them saying something like "C16 SS" to IS 444/127 or BS 5268/4978.....
What is the span of these joists and how often are they 'bridged'...(this is solid pieces of the same size located between the joists perpendiculary .. like noggins in a stud).....
Are they held on 'shoes' or built into the masonry walls.
 
sydthebeat said:
if its just a mortar joint, it shows bad workmanship, but not necessarily a structural problem. Structural problems appear as cracks, both internally and externally......
If the floors sagged it would say to me that the floor joists are installed incorrectly... either spanning too large a span, not bridged enough, or not specified strong enough.......

Your solicitor should have a copy of the cert of compliance. Explain the situation to him/her and get their advice.... see if the cert covers all aspects of the building regulations.

What size floor joists have you....?
Is there a stamp on them saying something like "C16 SS" to IS 444/127 or BS 5268/4978.....
What is the span of these joists and how often are they 'bridged'...(this is solid pieces of the same size located between the joists perpendiculary .. like noggins in a stud).....
Are they held on 'shoes' or built into the masonry walls.
Click to expand...

The span of the sagging joists is 5.9 meters. Looking at the building regulations on line, I believe they should be 5m max. The only bridiging I seen was half way along. The joists appear to be mounted into the brickwork.
The joists run lenghtways down the room from the bay window to the en-suite. The back wall of the en-suite is the load bearingwall down stairs.

Does this mean I have any sort of case against the builder?
 
are the joists 225 x 44 (9' x 2')...
are they at 400mm centres??

they should have been bridged at a minimum of 1350 c/c.... all joists should be...

a typical 9' x 2' joists C16 at 400 centres can only span 4.75 metres.
you need a joist of 9' x 3' C27 at 400 centres to span 5.93 m.....

Your builder isnt liable (as i understand it) but the person who certified his work may be..... thats who you should chase... he is also the one with the professional indemnity insurance....

Once final completion occurs, the builder has no legal obligation to the owner / occupier ... i may be wrong, and please dont consider this as legal advice, im not qualified to give legal advice....
 
sydthebeat said:
are the joists 225 x 44 (9' x 2')...
are they at 400mm centres??

they should have been bridged at a minimum of 1350 c/c.... all joists should be...

a typical 9' x 2' joists C16 at 400 centres can only span 4.75 metres.
you need a joist of 9' x 3' C27 at 400 centres to span 5.93 m.....

Your builder isnt liable (as i understand it) but the person who certified his work may be..... thats who you should chase... he is also the one with the professional indemnity insurance....

Once final completion occurs, the builder has no legal obligation to the owner / occupier ... i may be wrong, and please dont consider this as legal advice, im not qualified to give legal advice....
Click to expand...

Don't worry I will seek proper legal advice, just don't want to go to the solicitor blind.

The joists appeard to be 9'X2" to me, I didn't get a chance to measure.
 
Kenno77 said:
Don't worry I will seek proper legal advice, just don't want to go to the solicitor blind.

The joists appeard to be 9'X2" to me, I didn't get a chance to measure.
Click to expand...

let us know how you get on?

Syd in a timber frame structure, I have noticed most builders do not put in the slotted air vents in the external cavity. What is the knock on effect of this? I think is makes the longivity of the frame substancaly less and may lead to timber becoming wet for long periods of time, thus leading to rott. If this is the case why do homebond and the timber frame companies and architech turn a blind eye to this? sorry for going of topic

joejoe
 
Joejoe,

In order for most timber frame sturtures to be properly accrediated.. ie IAB NSAI or BBA etc, they all need the cavity to be vented. These vents are usually located low down and up high on walls at corners.
I have seen cases of premier insurance refusing insurance on TF systems that had no vents. I assume homebond would do the same.

The timber frame companies usually dont get involved because their engagement is usually to erect the TF structure, the client / developer then hires the blockie who knows nothing about this need for ventilation. Its the architects fault... plain and simple... and usually the reason is simply that they dont know the need for it.

The knock on effect is as youve stated. Mould, fungus and Wet rot, possibly sagging insulation cause loss of thermal performance.
 
sydthebeat said:
probably not, but you may have some comeback on the professional who 'certified' the work. If it can be shown that the work did not comply to relevant standards, in this case IS 444, then the certifier 'may' be liable.
Click to expand...

The builder cannot simply walk away on the basis that someone else certified the work as being up to standard.

Most architects certificates are fairly limited, only on visual inspections etc etc. Builder very much in the picture.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top