Getting yelled at for having my dog off the leash...

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flossie

Registered User
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406
Morning all,

I would value some opinions here. Every morning, i take the dog for a walk for about an hour around a boardwalk in the forest. I have been doing this for a year at least, down there the minute the gate opens. There are a handful of us dog walkers, and most of us will let the dog off the leash.

There are signs saying 'Please keep the dog on the leash' which i have interpreted as being a request as opposed to an order. The reason i go down first things is to let the dog run before there are any children around, and while it is quiet. If i see a dog i don't know, or if i see a young child, i put the dog back on the leash. My dog is very quiet, and just walks around sniffing, and then running along to catch up with me - he is always in my sight. Most mornings I see the same three dog walkers, and maybe one or two regular walkers - never had an issue with this.

This morning, on the way back to the car, a lady was power walking towards me and yelled at me to put the dog on the leash. This was a lady i have never seen before, so i put dog on the leash thinking she might be scared etc. However, when she came to me she started yelling saying all dogs should be one the leash, she would be reporting me to the dog warden, all dogs should be banned from the area etc. etc. In retaliation i told her i thought she had a stinking attitude and was small minded. I also pointed out that I interpreted the word 'Please' as a request, not an order.

At the time, my dog was sniffing a patch of grass, he wasn't bounding up to her or anything and came straight to me when i called him over to put him on the leash. I really would not let my dog off the leash if i didn't trust him enough or if i didn't feel i had control of him. As a result of this morning, i am raging. Am i overreacting?

I always carry dog mess bags and pick up my waste (it's a pet hate of mine when people don't), go down first thing in the morning, and generally feel i am being a responsible owner. Now i am worried that i will be reported to the dog warden - if a sign says 'Please keep dogs on leash', am I in the wrong for letting him off? If the sign said 'Dogs must be kept on a elash' that would be different in my eyes.

I have never seen this woman in the area before, and it would be such a shame if dogs were banned from walking in the area (there are very places I know of where dogs can run free). What are your opinions?
 
Local authorities can set bye-laws regarding the times and places where dogs can be allowed off a leash. A conviction for a breach of the bye-law carries a max penalty of a fine of €1904.61.

You might like to check whether a bye-law applies to your walking area.
 
Check with the other dog walkers - to see if they have also been approached by this woman or any other person about the same topic.

Although I can understand your fury I would try and not let it get to me too much. Contact the council if your really worried and ask them are dogs exempt from walking in that area without a leash.

She can report you to the warden, but she needs to prove it !
 
Who owns the forest that you were walking in ?

The law does not say that dogs must be kept on a lead, unless they are particular breeds.

If the forest belongs to or is in the control of a local authority, they can stipulate that dogs must be on a lead, that would be standard in local authority parks.

Was it obvious from the sign who put it up, the local authority ? Coillte, maybe ?

The lady who yelled at you might complain, but who knows, Maybe she was just rude.
 
Perhaps its the National Parks & Wildlife Service? I know that there is a problem in certain parts of the country with dogs attacking baby deer and baby lambs in adjoining farmers fields.
 
It's a forest park, as opposed to a forest - if that makes sense? I don't think it's Coillte, perhaps the council. I will check.

I was going to call the dog warden and see what they say - if the dog warden says they must be on a leash, then fair enough, i will happily obey that. My dog is a cross breed, but not on the restricted breeds list. The annoying thing is that I go every morning when i am not working away, and have built a very good rapprt with the other dog walkers and normal walkers. For me to come across this woman once and spoil it, then it's not fair (in my eyes). I was thinking of i see her again i might be polite, and ask her if i could see what her reasoning for upset is. This might make me understand a little more - if she has been attacked by a dog before, or is generally afraid, fair enough, but if it's just a general dislike of dogs that's uncalled for. What does she do when she is down by the river, or stray dogs walkign aorund the town?
 
huskerdu said:
Who owns the forest that you were walking in ?

Was it obvious from the sign who put it up, the local authority ? Coillte, maybe ?
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The sign is a piece of A4 paper, in a plastic sleeve that has been nailed to a post at one entrance to the trail. There are 2 entrances. I only see it because i walk there every day and it caught my attention when it went up as it looked different.
 
Ideally, dogs should be kept on a leash in a public area... but not always the case.

Maybe this woman just had a bad experience with a dog hence the reaction you were exposed to. Might be a once off with her being there... so in your position I would continue to do as you were always doing.
 
I have jsut called up the Carlow Kilkenny dog sheltern and warden for advice. I explained the situation, and even though it is effectively a public place, as long as my dog has a collar and tag, I have a dog licence, and i am in effective control of the dog, I was doing no wrong. When i asked if i could be reported, he said no - the lady could report all she likes. It seems more like a general anxiety issue (or just plain rude!) form the lady in question. Th
 
flossie said:
I have jsut called up the Carlow Kilkenny dog sheltern and warden for advice. I explained the situation, and even though it is effectively a public place, as long as my dog has a collar and tag, I have a dog licence, and i am in effective control of the dog, I was doing no wrong.
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That's the paradox though - you aren't in effective control of a loose dog as there are no guarantees that he will do what he is told!
 
You need to tell this woman that you will not put your dog on a leash and that you have every right to go for a walk there. Then ignore her from then on.
 
I totally disagree with Elcato - I'm terrified of dogs and to see one hurtling towards me, whether playful or not, is a nightmare for me and leaves me a shuddering, shrieking mess. So, if there's a public walk where dog owners are requested to leash the dog, then I think they should.
 
demoivre said:
That's the paradox though - you aren't in effective control of a loose dog as there are no guarantees that he will do what he is told!
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Point taken, but when you tell him to wait, he stops in his tracks and lets you put the leash on. Like I said, he goes on the leash when unknown dogs are approaching.

I have put my dog licence in the car with my insurance certificate just in case the woman gets the dog warden to come down. At least I have sought advice and can proceed on the basis I have been told all is OK. If i meet the woman again I will calmly state that i am doing no wrong in the eyes of the dog warden. It's a shame she had such a negative approach, a few quiet words could have resolved this.
 
flossie said:
Point taken, but when you tell him to wait, he stops in his tracks and lets you put the leash on. Like I said, he goes on the leash when unknown dogs are approaching.

I have put my dog licence in the car with my insurance certificate just in case the woman gets the dog warden to come down. At least I have sought advice and can proceed on the basis I have been told all is OK. If i meet the woman again I will calmly state that i am doing no wrong in the eyes of the dog warden. It's a shame she had such a negative approach, a few quiet words could have resolved this.
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It's the legislation I find perplexing - how can you be in "effectual control" of a loose dog? I suppose it's open to interpretation but in my experience the dog warden will come down hardest on the responsible dog owner, who they receive complaints about, and will ignore the greyhounds running out on to a main road from a halting site ! Too much hassle.
 
I can understand it from both sides tbh.

Personally Im a bit of a rule follower in areas where other people are also trying to enjoy the area, so if I saw the sign, Id leash my dog (I dont have a dog - but hypothetically).

However, if there are also other unleashed dogs, the dog has good recall, etc, then I can understand why you dont leash the dog. It is true though, that an unleashed dog is never under full control, you never know what is going to happen, another dog to attack your dog, a person to frighten your dog, a small animal to bite your dog - that will cause the dog to react in an unpredictable manner.

From the angry womans point of view - first of all there are constructive ways to approach someone, and that wasnt one of them! However, Ive been attacked and almost bitten in a Coillte forest while the owners sat at the side saying 'he wont go near you, he is only playing guard dog' and their uncontrolled dog was growling, snarling, nipping and running at me with full on attack body language. So she may have had an experience with an irresponsible owner before and thinks everyone with a dog off leash is going to act the same way.

As Eithneangela points out, some people are terrified of dogs, and if thats the case then even a good dog on leash passing by can be a scary experience for them. And I think its important to remember this in public places.

If your dog just wanders along and sniff and then runs to catch up with you (invisible leash I used to call it with my last dog), then why not put him on a long extendable so he still has the same experience but you are sticking to the rules?

I wouldbt be too bothered by one rude woman tbh, but I do think its important to respect other peoples enjoyment of an area by following the rules set out.

Oh - I would have read 'Please leash your dog' as politely saying 'Leash your dog' - and not as a request that can be ignored or interpreted as something you have a choice in.
 
Contact your local authority, they are responsible for setting out where and when dogs may be let of the leash in public areas.

For example, in Dublin, the following applies:

3. A person in charge of a dog in an area specified in the First Schedule to these Bye-Laws [ except (a) American Pitbull Terrier, (b) Bull Mastiff ,
(c) Doberman Pinscher, (d) English Bull Terrier, (e) German Shepherd (Alsatian), (f) Japenese Akita, (g) Japenese Tosa, (h) Rhodesian Ridgeback,
(i) Rottweiler, (J) Staffordshire Bull Terrier, and to every dog of the type commonly known as a Ban Dog (or Bandog) and to every other strain or cross
of every breed of every type of dog described above] shall keep the dog on a sufficiently strong chain or leash, not exceeding two metres in length if a fixed
leash, or ten metres if retractable, while in that area, except during the following times when the dog may be unleashed in such areas (but excluding
the North Bull Island and any other such area for which a Special Amenity Area Order is made) provided that such dog must still be under the effectual
control of the person-in-charge of the dog in accordance with the Control of Dogs Acts, 1986 and 1992:

January & December: 8.00 a.m. - 11.00 a.m.
4.00 p.m. - 5.00 p.m.
February & November: 8.00 a.m. - 11.00 a.m.
4.30 p.m. - 5.30 p.m.
March & October: 8.00 a.m. - 11.00 a.m.
5.30 p.m. - 6.30 p.m. (Wintertime)
6.30 p.m. - 7.30 p.m. (Summertime)

April & September: 8.00 a.m. - 11.00 a.m.
7.30 p.m. - 8.30 p.m.
May & June: 8.00 a.m. - 11.00 a.m.
July & August: 8.30 p.m. - 9.30 p.m.
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Dublin City Councils Control of Dogs Bye-Laws 1994.
 
I am not a dog lover, so it really annoys me to see dog owners in public areas without having their dogs on a leash. Show a little respect for other people and obey the rules.

Only a small minority clean up after their dogs. It is disgusting to see seaside walks destroyed by dogs running around out of owners sight and control.

That's my tuppence worth.
 
But that's the thing, it appears I am obeying the rules. I totally agree that out of control dogs should be on a leash, but i make the effort to get up early to minimise meeting people, take my dog out to a place he can stretch his legs and have a little freedom - this releases anxiety and results in a happy dog. I wouldn't let my dog off if i thought he was a nuisance in any ways - if i see young children he is put on a leash, and the same if we see unfamiliar dogs. I also clean up after the dog - every walking jacket of mine has a roll of litter bags, just in case. Apart from the fact it's illegal to clean up after your dog, it's a horrible thing to come across. There are a vast majority of dog owners who don't clean up, but i can't speak on their behalf.

I am trying to be a responsible dog owner and doing everything above board - collar, ID tag, microchip, dog licence, insurance, integrating him with other animals and children etc.

I was down the beach at the weekend - i choose isolated beaches where there are hardly any walkers, as with normal walking, he always remains in my sight and bags are with me. It's a good chance for them to be free, tire them out and allow them to explore.

I'm not a child lover - i find it just as irritating when a child is allowed to run free, get under my feet, pick things up, cry uncontrollably and when parents don't have control on their kids. I know that's opening a whole other can of worms.
 
I'm not a scanger lover. It really annoys me to see them walking around in their tracksuits talking with that nasal air. They are also very threatening and it is illegal to take drugs. They should show a bit of respect ......
 
elcato said:
I'm not a scanger lover. It really annoys me to see them walking around in their tracksuits talking with that nasal air. They are also very threatening and it is illegal to take drugs. They should show a bit of respect ......
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That really made me laugh
 
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