Health Insurance Fair Deal Scheme - 7.5% of assets

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sadie

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Does the Fair Deal scheme mean that 7.5% of total assets are taken each week regardless?
The HSE info occasionally remarks 'no-one will pay more than the actual cost of care' but I'm not clear on this.

If two people each had a pension of 36k.
Person A person has 5k in savings
Person B has 500k in savings

Do each pay 7.5% of their savings each week? Or only up to the weekly cost as advertised by the nursing home?

http://www.hse.ie/eng/services/list/4/olderpeople/nhss/#care:
"You will contribute 80% of your assessable income and 7.5% of the value of any assets per annum (5% of assets if the application was made prior to the 25th July 2013). However, the first €36,000 of your assets, or €72,000 for a couple, will not be counted at all in the financial assessment. "
 
sadie said:
Does the Fair Deal scheme mean that 7.5% of total assets are taken each week regardless?
The HSE info occasionally remarks 'no-one will pay more than the actual cost of care' but I'm not clear on this.

If two people each had a pension of 36k.
Person A person has 5k in savings
Person B has 500k in savings

Do each pay 7.5% of their savings each week? Or only up to the weekly cost as advertised by the nursing home?

http://www.hse.ie/eng/services/list/4/olderpeople/nhss/#care:
"You will contribute 80% of your assessable income and 7.5% of the value of any assets per annum (5% of assets if the application was made prior to the 25th July 2013). However, the first €36,000 of your assets, or €72,000 for a couple, will not be counted at all in the financial assessment. "
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If assessed separately, Person A will pay 80% of 36k per annum plus 7.5% for any assessable assets, e.g. home etc. As a couple A&B will pay 80% of 36k each and 7.5% of (505k less 72k plus value of home) annually for 3 years. After 3 yrs, it's just 80% of annual pension. This is if both go into a nursing home at the same time.
 
I meant separate single/widowed people. Leaving aside any property they have.

So Person B would pay 28,800 per annum plus (7.5% of assets) 37,500 = 66,300 per year for their nursing home care.

Person B in the next room would pay 37,500 plus (7.5% of assets) 375 = 37,875 per year.

Take Person C who has 36k pension, with 900k in assets, they would pay 37,500 plus (7,5% of assets) 67,500 = 105,000 per year for the same care??

What about the part that says 'no-one pays more than the actual cost of care' - so is the 7.5% of asset capped at the 'actual cost of care' as per the price list on the HSE website?
 
sadie said:
What about the part that says 'no-one pays more than the actual cost of care' - so is the 7.5% of asset capped at the 'actual cost of care' as per the price list on the HSE website?
Click to expand...

For simplicity if Person C is single and has no house ( You can't just leave aside any property they might have) and the €900,000 is sitting in a current account earning no interest (interest would also be income and be assessed at 80%)

The first €36,000 is disregarded, so Person C’s contribution would be; 7.5% of €864,000 = €64,800.

Plus 80% of their €36,000 pension which is €28,800.

Total of Person C’s contribution is €93,600 or €1,800 weekly.

None on the approved list below are that expensive, so Person C would just pay the full amount for their chosen home but not more.

[broken link removed]


It is probably important to be in under Fair Deal even if paying the full amount initially.

Not many would have €900,000 but even those that do, if they were to live a long time, and were in one of the more expensive homes paying €70K annually plus extras such as physiotherapy, hairdressing, prescription charges, specialist chairs etc, they would in time come into benefit as their savings reduced.

You can apply to be reassessed annually.
 
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Thanks, this really helps. No matter how 'rich' a person is they only pay up to the price published by the HSE price list, and no more.
I left the house ownership out to simplify it.
Does the 7.5% contribution stop after 3yrs? Then it reverts to the 80% of income, correct?
 
sadie said:
I meant separate single/widowed people. Leaving aside any property they have.

So Person B would pay 28,800 per annum plus (7.5% of assets) 37,500 = 66,300 per year for their nursing home care.

Person B in the next room would pay 37,500 plus (7.5% of assets) 375 = 37,875 per year.

Take Person C who has 36k pension, with 900k in assets, they would pay 37,500 plus (7,5% of assets) 67,500 = 105,000 per year for the same care??

What about the part that says 'no-one pays more than the actual cost of care' - so is the 7.5% of asset capped at the 'actual cost of care' as per the price list on the HSE website?
Click to expand...

sadie said:
Thanks, this really helps. No matter how 'rich' a person is they only pay up to the price published by the HSE price list, and no more.
I left the house ownership out to simplify it.
Does the 7.5% contribution stop after 3yrs? Then it reverts to the 80% of income, correct?
Click to expand...

Twofor1 explains it well. The benefit of getting into the scheme even if you only pay the nursing home cost yourself until your savings run down a bit is that the 7.5% assessment on the home runs out after 3 years from date of entering NH even if you are paying the NH costs yourself. So, if after 3 years, say, from approval, you need to avail of the NH support, the home is now discounted. So, from then on, you pay 80% of income plus 7.5% of all other assets(minus €36k) for as long as you are in the NH. The assessment can be reviewed annually as savings run down.
 
I see. So the person continues to contribute 7.5% of any assets less their house value - cash, shares, investment properties, etc that they have had since 5yrs previous to applying for the scheme.
If the person had no cash, but had shares and investment properties to the value of 900k (just to run another example), they would still have to find 7.5% of cash equivalent each year to pay for their nursing home....or arrange for a Nursing home Loan where the HSE places charges on their assets?
 
Sorry, think I am getting mixed up again. Here is my question clearly put:
No matter how 'rich' the person is and how much their 7.5% adds up to, they ONLY EVER pay as much as the care costs as published by the HSE and no more than that?
 
sadie said:
Sorry, think I am getting mixed up again. Here is my question clearly put:
No matter how 'rich' the person is and how much their 7.5% adds up to, they ONLY EVER pay as much as the care costs as published by the HSE and no more than that?
Click to expand...
That's correct. It makes no sense to pay the contribution until your means is low enough to make it worthwhile except for the 3 year rule on the home. All other assets apart from the home will be assessed indefinitely(less 36k)when you are availing of the scheme.
 
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