Estate agents should not be allowed to claim a property is in Castleknock, when it's not

J

Johnjane

Registered User
Messages
0
Basic economics is supply and demand. Scarcity increases value. So how can estate agents and property developers be allowed to sell houses under the townland name of Castleknock when these houses are clearly not within the borders of the Castleknock townland? The borders are clearly defined on townland maps. Of all the houses for sale on daft in Castleknock right now; 137 of them, only 30 of those are actually in the townland of Castleknock. If there is a perception of a larger supply then the value is affected. This is costing Castleknock residence financially when they decide to sell. Its unacceptable and must be stopped legally.

People choose to live in Castleknock townland because it has a reputation for little or no antisocial behavior, high ranking schools and close proximity to the phoenix park. The residence are losing money because of this fraud instigated by developers and estate agents that want to increase value of their less valuable properties and misleading buyers in the process.

I propose a new section in the law to stop property developers and estate agents from listing properties with incorrect townlands. This law will also protect buyers from being duped into paying for property they believe to be in a certain townland.

With the economy boom or crash people will have transparency. They will not incur an extreme financial loss which this activity is causing for genuine sellers and buyers.

Its not just happening in West Dublin, it's happening all over the country and is costing genuine people massive financial losses.

There are laws in place for fraud and misrepresentation right now;

Criminal Justice (Theft and Fraud Offences) Act, 2001
10.—(1) A person is guilty of an offence if he or she dishonestly, with the intention of making a gain for himself or herself or another, or of causing loss to another—

However it would be preferable to have a specific section for the buying and selling of property as it is in a different category to other sales, in that it is valued based on scarcity, location and the whole economy is affected. We need to send a very clear message that property must be listed and marketed correctly for a fair economy.
 
Last edited:
I don't know who you are. I don't know what you want. If you are looking for [a Castleknock exclusivity], I can tell you I don't have money. But what I do have are a very particular set of skills, skills I have acquired over a very long career. Skills that make me a nightmare for people like you. If you let [me call my bleedin' gaff whatever I want], that'll be the end of it. I will not look for you, I will not pursue you. But if you don't, I will look for you, I will find you, and I will [intentionally mislabel 100s of letters to be sent to your home].
 
I recall a campaign during the height of the boom by some people in Sandyford asking to have it renamed as I think North Foxrock.
 
Anyone who thinks Castleknock is not exclusive obviously suffers from inferior complex. Why do you suppose houses outside the Castleknock area add the name to their address when they are clearly located elsewhere with antisocial problems, less ideal location and not exactly high ranking schools..not that it matters where a person chooses to live mind. But it does matter if they are selling it and misrepresenting it. This is about money and nothing else. I think Mercedes-Benz would take issue if people were selling counterfeit mercs don't ya think. The only big difference is that mercs don't affect the entire economy the same way as property does.
 
Last edited:
Johnjane,

Quite often Townlands gobble up other Townlands eg a general area gets known as Castleknock even though the original Castleknock was smaller.

People buying/selling do not need more laws , just eyesight and a good solicitor etc !
 
Wasn't there nearly an uprising a number of years ago when a part of Firhouse was re-named New Tallaght!!
Why note take a complaint to the advertising standards board for false advertising?
 
Townlands are clearly defined. Easy to find online. Townlands don't gobble up other townlands simply because they are actually very defined. Also estate agents are in a position of authority and are wrecklessly misusing that position when listing properties as being in a more affluent townland when the property is not located there
 
Last edited:
What's in a name? That which we call a rose by any other name would smell as sweet
Click to expand...

In most cities and towns properties are not sold on the basis of townland per se, they are sold on the basis of a much less definitive area usually extrapolated from the address. There is not necessarily an intention to deceive, in many towns and cities the townland is simply irrelevant in an address. The nearest population nucleus or area identifier is the best indicator of location (well - before the advent of eircodes that is ;)). For example, properties in the townland of Askea in Carlow are generally just listed as Carlow properties.

I am sure that there have been several cases (see the examples above from other posters) of people attempting to harness the value of a name to get more value from their own property, I think you'll have a hard time proving it has ever dragged down the general value of properties in the specific townland (which seems to be your primary concern).
 
I believe it does drag down the value simply because a general search on daft may bring up five to six times more the amount of houses for sale (over supply) than are actually available to buy in the specific area search, giving the buyer much bigger choice..but a misleading choice. Buyers are misdirected under the impression they are getting a bargain until this price becomes normal to affect prices in the real townland area because sellers houses remaining unsold. I also hardly think that comparing rural areas to urban is the same. Its quite obvious in rural areas but urban areas are easier to deceive townland borders.
 
Last edited:
Johnjane said:
I believe it does drag down the value simply because a general search on daft may bring up five to six times more the amount of houses for sale (over supply) than are actually available to buy in the specific area search, giving the buyer much bigger choice..but a misleading choice. Buyers are misdirected under the impression they are getting a bargain until this price becomes normal to affect prices in the real townland area. I also hardly think that comparing rural areas to urban is the same. Its quite obvious in rural areas but urban areas are easier to deceive townland borders.
Click to expand...

Are all these buyers you seek to protect lacking in the most basic literacy, numeracy and computer skills that they can't view a photo/ map online and decide whether to do a drive by?

Believe me, most purchasers have a defined area/price range in mind - they are not going to be fooled

I do not understand your concerns - they are not legitimate

mf
 
My concerns are legitimate and unfortunately it not a small issue. Its massive considering that's just one area I've brought up. There have been cases where developers have been sued successfully for assigning more affluent addresses to sell their less desirable located properties. A law in place to enforce transparency can only be a positive solution to this fraudulent activity. Surely nobody has a problem doing that unless they have their own issues related?
 
Last edited:
There's nothing new about EA ads or documentation being inaccurate. Their own disclaimers on their ads say as much. "This could be all lies but that's your problem", paraphrasing.

In any case, won't the new eircodes sort this out? If there's an improved uptake of licences. If their accuracy is improved (my house is incorrectly identified on the eircode/ An Post maps). If EAs include eircodes as part of the addresses or are required to.

Perrystown / Terenure anyone?
 
Johnjane said:
I believe it does drag down the value simply because a general search on daft may bring up five to six times more the amount of houses for sale (over supply) than are actually available to buy in the specific area search, giving the buyer much bigger choice..but a misleading choice. Buyers are misdirected under the impression they are getting a bargain until this price becomes normal to affect prices in the real townland area because sellers houses remaining unsold. I also hardly think that comparing rural areas to urban is the same. Its quite obvious in rural areas but urban areas are easier to deceive townland borders.
Click to expand...

Your belief does not constitute evidence.

Am going to hazard a guess you are attempting to sell a property and it isn't moving at the price you want to sell it at. A search on property websites is showing you cheaper properties in the general area and you think that that is the reason that no-one is looking at your place, or not offering you the money you want. I hate to tell you this but that is not because the townland boundaries are not being "honoured". Anyone spending Castleknock and environs prices will be doing a great deal of homework and will definitely be looking to maximise their outcome. They will be acutely aware of what and where they are getting for their money and will be expecting to view not-quite-Castleknock properties in the hope of finding something more for a little bit less.

It is highly unlikely that they are only looking for something with the word "Castleknock" appended somewhere - however egregiously. They are far more likely looking for property within the vicinity of Castleknock or in North west Dublin, or near Blanchardstown hospital, that has x bedrooms, y bathrooms, etc., is close to schools/shops/transport (delete as appropriate). Your putative "protection" provides them with nothing. You aren't dealing with naivety, you are dealing with people who know the price they pay for your property is inflated because of an address - however nice your place is, you are pricing it far above its replacement value because it is "in Castleknock" - not everyone is so desirous of spending for that privilege and may be very happy to settle for a better house in a slightly less salubrious neighbourhood as long as it meets their actual, logical criteria. Your suggested law would not make them any more likely to spend an exorbitant amount of money. They will simply adjust their search to look in the townlands you disparage.

Furthermore, the ingrained presumption seems to be that the current prosperity and desirability of Castleknock compared with some other areas in the vicinity is immutable. This is not necessarily the case. Areas go up and areas go down. It doesn't happen over months but it can happen over decades. Even incredibly expensive neighbourhoods can become less desirable with time and gentrification of other areas is not unusual at all. Granting it the "protection" of only ever being known as "Castleknock" doesn't prevent changes in fortune.

As a final point - Askea is definitely urban not rural - hence the reason I picked it, it is a townland within the boundaries of a town, like so many others, but it happens to be one I know well. In an actual rural area (i.e. defined as not in a town or a city) a townland is useful information and would be a necessity for identifying the location of a property. In towns and cities - not so much.
 
You are kidding, aren't you?

This hardly ranks up there as an important economic issue with the likes of the flooding and homelessness crises?

And what about

Are all these buyers you seek to protect lacking in the most basic literacy, numeracy and computer skills that they can't view a photo/ map online and decide whether to do a drive by?


mf
 
You are right, this is not a small issue. Maybe we could have it discussed at the UN the next time Jewish Settlements in Gaza comes up. I can't believe this hasn't led to civil war between the pure blood castleknockers and the muggles from outside.

Maybe Castleknock should change it's name and get it trademarked?
 
Maybe "proper" Castleknock addresses could be changed to say Dublin 14A instead of a common Northside "odd" code like D15
 
So majority of posters on here are against transparency. You've made your quite obvious point.I wonder does it have anything to do with the idea that encouraging this practice may increase the value of your own location? Makes sense if course that being against the idea of transparency means there must be some benefit to you. However there are very big issues which play a part with the economy, just because some people like yourself no doubt are not interested because it's of no benefit to encourage doesn't mean it should be legal to let it continue. I'm sure if any family could afford to live in an area with almost zero anti social behavior and high ranking schools they would prefer it. That drives the price up. That's economics. But it's fraud plain and simple to misrepresent a property in this way
 
Last edited:
I have to say I am surprised at the bile the OP has attracted.

He is looking at it from his own perspective as (presumably) a property owner in Castleknock. That seems perfectly reasonable to me. What have Gaza, flooding or homelessness got to do with it. Not every thread on AAM is about issues of national or even international concern, nor should it be.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top