edwardian house with problems...would you buy?

M

medicinelady

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Hi Everyone,

I hope i'm posting this in the correct section! I am looking to buy a house in Dublin and have been talking to someone who might have an edwardian property up for sale within the next year. we haven't talked prices yet and I guess they will want a quick sale and avoid estate agents fees and waiting for buyers etc. I love the house but the problem is there is a lot of damp etc. in the basement, the kitchen and bathroom need to be replaced, it needs to be rewired replumbed etc. I am waiting to get a builder in to get some estimates to give me an idea of costs as we will haev a pretty low budget but does anyone have experience of this sort of thing. we are both pretty hand ie. tiling, painting, etc. and are happy to learn and get our hands dirty. Am I insane?

I will obviously get a structural report done etc. and will push the price accordingly but just looking for any advice from people who have bought similar properties. I'm so afraid that it will be a money pit.

Thanks guys!
 
I think you have answered you own question. The problem with older houses is that you never know what you will meet until you start pulling it apart. A builders estimate will be just that, an estimate. Expect to pay more. I'd only do it if I had the funds and I really loved the house/area. Its a buyers market, don't forget.
 
I love period properties so don't think you are insane. That said, get the best survey money can buy and get proper builders' estimates for repair work. Period properties are a bit of a money pit (plus they have no right angles!) but you can certainly get a good idea of the costs before you actually agree to buy. Being handy will only go so far in that you will only be able to do the work after the really big things have been sorted out. They could include rewiring, replumbing (as you have mentioned), new heating system, damp (both rising and at extension junctions), roofing, insulation etc etc. You scare me when you say you have a pretty low budget though!

Sprite
 
Is it going to be a 'forever' home? Might be worth it emotionally if that's the case, probably otherwise it's a money pit.
 
I, personally, would not touch an older house requiring extensive works with the proverbial barge pole. But then I don't have limitless monies, I am disinterested in period properties and have no stomach for endless renovations. Equally, I have friends who love the charm of an older house, the bigger rooms ( mostly), the likelihood that such a property is closer to amenities than a newer build and the general feeling of solidity you get in a well built older property.

So each to their own.

mf
 
thanks for the responses! my budget is probably about 40-50k and I'm not thinking of fancy kitchens etc. but I know the money will dissapear with the damp problems, rewiring etc. We plan this to be our home for a long time so I know the initial year or two will be hard graft and no weekends. I suppose i just want to hear the best and the worst advice so i'm prepared!
 
Another thing to get your builder to look at is the condition of the plaster. With age and damp problems the plaster will probably start crumbling the minute any work gets started, wallpaper gets stripped. Ask your bulder to factor in the costs or removing plaster from all internal walls, reslabbing and plastering.

We are in the middle of such a rennovation and none of the builders who quoted originally factored this in. In the end pretty two thirds of walls and all ceilings needed redoing.
 
so can I ask another question... does anyone reccomend a builder in Dublin who has a good knowledge of damp problems/ older properties but isn't going to charge me through the poor old roof?
 
Have a look at the key post here:

I contacted McGoverns and they got back to me with a quote of about €550 (incl VAT) for a full survey. From there you can perhaps get them to recommend a builder and explain the portions of the building they couldn't comment on as part of the survey? I'd imagine you'd need both a serious survey *and* and actual builder quote (or a number of builder quotes) and not rely on just one or the other (survey/builder). Spend the money on good prep work now- it'll save you heartache in the future.

Sprite
 
We bought an Edwardian period house (1908 I think) in SW London about ten years ago. What you are buying is the aesthetics and the classic "look" of these houses in their settings. In all other respects you are buying early 1900s technology and build quality.

If you think you'll be there for a long time and the area is not likely to be overdeveloped then think about it - but my advice would be to budget for entirely new plumbing/heating, electrics, plasterwork, kitchen, bathrooms, damproofing, replastering, chimneywork, roof replacement, any extensions and add it to the likely purchase price.

The main problem with an older house is that there are so many people who've bodged it before you.........

Regarding damp - it's either rising or getting in. Both of which can be fixed. It's the things you don't know about that'll kill you.

BTW - a survey is likely to include many phrases like "the xxxx was not inspected fully and therefore cannot be relied upon".

SSE
 
Actually looking back I think I sounded a bit too negative in my last post. I'd say yes the house will be a money pit. But so is spending thousands in stamp duty on a characterless box miles away, you can maybe avoid this by "overbuying" your house now so you don't have to move if you have kids etc.

Good luck anyway
SSE
 
Naturally it all depends on its location and the condition.....wil lits location pay for itself long term? If so and you have lots of patience well maybe.As someone reared in one, I wouldn't touch one with a barge pole.
Damp, wiring , plumbling,basements....UGH, dry rot, wet rot, windows , chimneys and their breasts and assorted bits, replacement gutters , fascias etc. ,crooked walls, wallpaper to be stripped and floors, plastering. It goes on and on but if you are handy , prepared to do it in stages and have a good marriage/relationship, then go for it.
I grew up with the sash windows, the lovely fireplaces,the crooked walls and the doors that warped and I love my utilitarian, easy to manage 2000 house with its good insulation and little or no maintenance and I'll be dead before it needs much work!! I have seen friends and family spend a lot of their lives battling with these period properties and with two people working to pay for them, I wonder was it worth it. However, each to their own.
 
To an extent, it's a matter of personal preference. I would rather live in an 1847 terraced money pit with original features and some character than a souless new build McBox any day.

But the people who are saying that you don't know what you've got till you get in there are right. We bought a house with rising damp and curved walls we were sure were hiding a mass of concrete patchwork to hold up a collapsing exterior wall and mould everywhere. The builders took the plaster down and found... dirt. The house had been "insulated" with actual dirt. Which explains the bulge and the damp. The actual walls are in much, much better condition than we thought. You really just never know.
 
I live in an edwardian house and love it... The high ceilings the cornicing the fireplaces...more than make up for having had to treat dry rot, somewhat oldfashioned plumbing... everything wont have to be done at once... yes you have some issues such as no two windows are exactly the same size so nothing can be bought off shelf without checking but if you like the house and survey not too bad GO FOR IT!!
 
Being in Galway where that sort of housing stock is almost non existent so have to go with the characterless new housing - I would have jumped at the chance of a property with character that yes would really stretch the finances but as other posters said if this was a house for life then you can take your time over it.
 
Definitely get a full survey and quotes for all the jobs. My hubby and I recently renovated a property (c. 1920's 3 bed mid terrace) and it came in at approx €120k. You won't see €40-50k if there is a lot to be done.
 
We live in a Victorian House and you just cant beat it. Older features, a history to it etc.

You MUST look around though. There's a lot of cherrys on teh market and older houses, when they have problems, are huge jobs.

Get an engineers report done, make sure this engineer has specialises in older homes too.

Dont get involved in anything flaky, we bought from a person who had done 80% of the renovations before us. Happy Days as neither of us have the time or the patience for a complete renov.

My advice, look around, get the engineers reports, talk to a builder based on said reports and then put in a cheekily low offer!
BM
 
We bought an old victorian property this year and faced all the same issues as yourself. I got Pat Mc Govern to do my survey and to tell you the truth It really only dealt with superficial issues.Report mainly recommended getting damp expert/timber expert/plumbing advice -far too vague.An architect friend looked at the property and was able to give me a lot more information by pulling up 2 floorboards , getting his hand dirty and having a proper look. So I think having an engineer to look might be more beneficial. Survey told us there was risng damp throughout. In fact the is very limited rising damp. The cement render on building had failed and the cracks were letting in all the water. Be careful with damp companies it is in their interest to diagnose rising damps and sell you solutions.often the water is coming from elsewhere. The guy from Protim was very honset with me and told me i didnt have a rising damp problem. Another guy based in howth was the same.

You will inevitably find more problems than you realise when you start the renovation.Weve just pulled up the floors replaced some joists insulated put back original boards and sanded them, tedious work but worth all the effort. I know the work will be ongoing for years but I wouldnt swap the house for anything.

When getting work done get someone with interest in old buildings. They are built and repaired in a completely different manner than modern methods.Adrian Harrison from Saint Domingos builders has been very helpful to me and loads of renovation experience.
 
We bought a similar aged house 10 years ago, got a full survey done, so we knew what we were dealing with. Work we did before moving in was some remedial work where damp had been getting in, complete rewiring, plumbing, heating system, new kitchen, bathroom and redecoration. Since then, we've done very little - replaced the (non-original) windows recently with wooden sashes, but apart from that just normal decoration.

Advice: get a good survey done; get a few quotes (if you keep your costs under control you should be OK for a similar set of work); get someone who'll give an unbiased, qualified opinion.

The big enemy of old houses is water ingress: check the roof very carefully. If there's evidence of extensive long standing damp, then I'd walk away (we did this with one place we viewed: we absolutely fell in love with it, but it had loads of dry rot. We are so, so glad we walked away from that one). Don't go by the damp proofing specialists: there's actually a school of thought that says there's no such thing as rising damp, which they claim to find and fix (it's invariably some other source of damp, such as leaks or condensation, which is relatively easy to fix). What's not easy to fix are the consequences of damp: the wood attacked by wet and dry rot is frequently structural in these houses, so dealing woth it can be very expensive.

Any regrets? none really: we love the house, it's in a very convenient location (as most such houses are), and has huge character. The rooms aren't particularly large, but the high ceilings make a huge difference to how it feels.

Ongoing issues: you have to keep on top of any evidence that things aren't right. We've had a couple of occasions (only a couple, though) of having to pay a couple of hundred to sort out problems that if left would have cost thousands.

One last thing: people say "they don't build them like they used to". This is true, but it usually applies in the opposite way that most think. Poor workmanship is nothing new. Unsound foundations are thankfully a thing of the past, but they do exist in the past, so you need to be careful there too: I'd also walk away from anything that major structural issues, as many of these houses have.

Hope this experience helps.

One final, final thought: if you're the type of person where everything has to be "just so", perfectly straight, unblemished, it's probably not for you. You can get that standard of finish in an old house, but it'll cost an absolute fortune, as you'll have to gut it (and loose "character" in the process). I'm not suggesting you have to live in a place that's full of faults, but the skirting will have knocks in it, details won't be perfect etc.
 
thanks everyone for your comments and advice. I think we have our hearts set on an older quirky property as personally I can't stand the idea of living in a completely modern new home. I love the fact that there are loads of nooks and crannys and endless fireplaces etc. but i know that comes with a price. I just have to wait and see what the professionals say its going to cost when they see it!

Thanks again for all the comments.
 
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