Dunphy and Giles and Irish Soccer

[NorthDrum]

well they say its a game of opinions.



Agree on Mcshane, O'Shea is consistently starting for United and was almost ever present for their record breaking clean sheet run. Doyle & Hunt should be with mid table prem clubs by next season. Jack picked up plenty of players with the Granny rule who were operating at a lower level and subsequently made the big step ups to bigger clubs, our young lads might very well do the same. I think andrews is also a fairly regular starter now for Blackburn aswell.

Dont get me wrong, we all look back on Big Jacks days fondly, but that doesnt negate the fact that he had a "harry ramsden challenge" and used to write tactics on the pack of fag pack! Even in those times it took the mickey . .

O'Shea starts when united players are injured. He is a first team player by default . While I agree Doyle and Hunt are better then their clubs, they are still championship players.

Not looking for an arguement . I enjoy dunphy and co, but they do talk some tripe sometimes.

And as far as Irish fans not having realistic expectations of their team, is it any surprise considering the vast amount of people in this country sticking their heads in the sand regarding our economy.

 

[Lex Foutish]

I cant believe people are defending dunphy and co.

Firstly, big Jack made a joke of Irelands most talented squad of players. We had a much stronger bunch of individual first teamers back then. Wont go into it as if you dont recognise this, you shouldnt be talking football,

Secondly, the squad players available to Ireland are very limited and 2nd-3rd seed material. Shay Given, Richard Dunne and Robbie Keane are our best players playing regular football for top teams. Mcgeady plays in Scotland (but is good IMO), O'Shea is a bit part player played everywhere for united, McShane is definantly one of the worst players in the team and plays for a relegation struggling team, Kilbane is a likable player who gives it 100%, whelan and andrews dont necessarily start for their clubs, Hunt and Doyle play in the championship.

Not really sure where all these top premier league players are that somebody mentioned. How many of Italys bench (let alone starting team) would oust some of our guys!

There appears to be a distinct lack of reality on the part of some Irish Fans. S.Ireland doesnt want to play for us, nothing to do with Trapp. Andy Reid took the pss on a factfinding tour, even if apologised and came back, it means we make be better going forward but most definantly would be more vunerable in defence. Lee Carsley, this is actually one of the few things I cant understand with Stephen Reid being unfit.

This group is very tight (highlighted by the few goals and many draws) and there is very little between all the teams (remember we got some of the hardest lower seeds out there as they have good players but were not seeded because they are fledgling teams).

The manager has us on track to get to the world cup with an organised, tough to beat team , with an average bunch of players. Most of the Italian team won the world cup, so how anybody can conveniently push this aside when debating how good they are is laughable.

In 94 and 2006 the Italian national team were seen as average Italian sides yet they both reached the final of the w.c. Same thing can be said of Germany in 2002 that were "the worst german team in living history". What that says is that these top teams always have more then the eye sees.

Trapp isnt perfect by any means, but he is the best manager Ireland has ever had . . . Had he Big Jacks team I really think we could of won a major tournie.

Excellent post. Agree very much. Not perfect but as good as we can hope for.

And we need to move on from the Stephen Ireland business. He doesn't want to play for his country and that should be the end of it. Even if he did want to come back, I'm not sure that members of the current panel would be jumping up and down with delight. My personal feeling is that he would have a de-stabilising affect on the team.

The Management have said that they won't be contacting him anymore and that the next move is up to him.

I can't understand why the media keep asking Trap and Brady about it. The last time I saw a press conference where it came up, Brady took a firm line with the media.

Surely an average player who wants to play for his country is of greater benefit than a good player who doesn't want to.

 

[Lex Foutish]

And to deviate slightly, lest we ever forget.................

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PS7pXBV3SQ0

 

[MrMan]

As bad as Dunphy is, I would always listen to him and Giles ahead of people like Redknapp, Shearer, Hanson, Townsend etc. Giles for me is the best analyst around.

The thing is i think Giles has been getting far too much credit for a while now. His constant football is a simple game, honesty of effort and they should apply themselves in a positive manner in every game are hardly nuggets of wisdom. they could shorten the analysis by half because everything is repeated so often. Throw in a few 'great players like John, Ronnie and Graham would never play like that' every week and you have the rte analysis.

The boys on BBC and Sky are afraid of offending their buddies and the guys on rte have gone stale and look like they need a shake up.

 

[Betsy Og]

Well if you are convinced Reid is brutal and theres no place for his likes in the team, then where does that leave you as regards McShane? There's surely some poor divil plugging away in the League of Ireland who could do a better job than him.

I accept we are no team of stars, and need to have realisitic expectations, but isnt that all the more reason not to exclude players "on principle" when, for all their faults (scurrilous guitar strumming etc.), they might be of some use to you.

 

[oldtimer]

The main thing for me on Wednesday night was, for once, the Irish team entertained us with attacking football. Time after time we have watched them huff and puff aimlessly. I think Trap deserves great credit. Within a few minutes an italian sent off and a goal down called for a dramatic change in tactics. He took a huge gamble throwing on untried players and it worked for him. I think he showed his wisdom about the game. He is doing well with limited talent at his disposal. Like many, I am fed up with Dunphy. As Sunny said, he thinks he is God. He has criticised every manager since Charlton. He always has a ''pet'' player - for years Roy Keane was his idol and now we have to listen to him go on about Reid and Ireland. I was disappointed with Giles on Wednesday - I thought he could have been more complimentary to Trap. Overall, Ireland are doing okay in the Group - its all to play for and we are in there with a good chance.

 

[NorthDrum]

I see the scottish FA have disciplined their captain and banned him from ever playing for his country again. Possibly excessive but just makes a mockery of some peoples opinions that we should beg or openly accept Stephen (all my grannys are dead, make an idiot out of the country) Ireland back to play for us.

Also shows how the scottish FA want to to things right and disciplined, but our "Harry Ramsden fish challenge" fans still dont realise that in modern football having talent isnt simply enough.

 

[Lex Foutish]

I see the scottish FA have disciplined their captain and banned him from ever playing for his country again. Possibly excessive but just makes a mockery of some peoples opinions that we should beg or openly accept Stephen (all my grannys are dead, make an idiot out of the country) Ireland back to play for us.

Also shows how the scottish FA want to to things right and disciplined, but our "Harry Ramsden fish challenge" fans still dont realise that in modern football having talent isnt simply enough.

Excellent!!!

 

[MrMan]

I see the scottish FA have disciplined their captain and banned him from ever playing for his country again. Possibly excessive but just makes a mockery of some peoples opinions that we should beg or openly accept Stephen (all my grannys are dead, make an idiot out of the country) Ireland back to play for us.

Also shows how the scottish FA want to to things right and disciplined, but our "Harry Ramsden fish challenge" fans still dont realise that in modern football having talent isnt simply enough.

It will be interesting to see if a grovelling apology and fan pressure makes a difference in the scot scenario. In fairness sitting on the bench giving 2 fingers to the camera after having an 8 hour drinking session before a qualifier is more excessive than making up a story to get out of a match to see your girlfriend who has just miscarried your child.

One incident was childish and irresponsible while the other seemed the act of a paniced young man.

 

[NorthDrum]

It will be interesting to see if a grovelling apology and fan pressure makes a difference in the scot scenario. In fairness sitting on the bench giving 2 fingers to the camera after having an 8 hour drinking session before a qualifier is more excessive than making up a story to get out of a match to see your girlfriend who has just miscarried your child.

One incident was childish and irresponsible while the other seemed the act of a paniced young man.

That's Fair enough, I would agree with that about his girlfriend, but it doesnt really explain his actions in the days afterwards (all his grannies died) and his subsequent self imposed exile from playing for us . . I dont see why he is was (and still is) so devestated that he can play for City but not for Ireland.

Im not suggesting that we ban him, but we shouldnt be looking for Trapp and Brady to grovel, nor should he be talked of as a shining beacon of Irish Football.

The point on the scottish FA was that they at least put proper perspective on players behaviour and how it can affect team and fan morale. I wouldnt even debate whether or not the FAI would have the balls to suspend Robbie Keane if he did the same thing, he wouldnt miss a game!!