Disciplinary Hearing

peter965

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Hi all!

A close friend of mine has a disciplinary hearing in work with allegations of stealing made towards him, he denies this completely. He's been suspended and is waiting on a letter to outline exactly what's involved. Can anyone tell me in these cases is it a good idea to have a solicitor attend the hearing with him. He is extremely distressed right now and has never been through anything like this before. He is not in a union.

I've read on some other posts that sometimes these 'letters' will specifically request that solicitors do not accompany employees, only work colleagues or union reps.

Why is this? I would have a thought an employee at such an important meeting is entitled to have with him or her somebody familiar with the procedure which would be either their TU official or solicitor. Even if the employer has no one else there, you can be sure that the employer has been fully advised and will be working off a script. Should he consult a solicitor now or wait for the letter? How long does the hearing usually take place after he receives the letter?

His employment contract says "An individual has the right to request the presence of either an appropriate member of staff or a trade union representative".

There is no mention of a solicitor. He hasn't got the letter outlining the allegation yet. Are you saying there is no point in contacting a solicitor until he gets the letter? What kind of ballpark figure would a solicitor cost for taking this kind of thing on do you think?
 
As a former union rep I think I can add something to this thread. Non union members in employment where there are union members can be singled out for "special treatment" by management for one reason or another. They are easy targets. I know I am off point here and now for some advice.

1. Do not employ a solicitor at this stage eventhough stealing will probably mean dismissal or suspension at least. There will be a hearing and I presume your close friend just has to listen to allegations and not answer them.
2. Written alegations must follow.
3. If your friend is innocent, now he should employ a solicitor.
4. Now answer the allegations supervised by the solicitor.
5.If your friend is innocent now is the time for counter attack regarding his character being assassinated by defamation. Monetary compensation is now required.

Your friend is innocent. He probably stands to gain thousands in compensation. I think many solicitors will take on this case for a percentage of the compensation awarded.
 
If there's a union in your friend's firm, he should join it. Any union will take on a new member at any time.
 
The staff member here is not a union member. There is no point in joining a trades union now expecting representation on a serious disciplinary matter. I get the feeling in the original post that the union involved is a patsy of management anyway. Many do not know this, but several employers use trades unions to do the work of management where it is prudent to do so. Some employers insist on their staff joining a particular union and this is not because the same employers love fair play. Take heed of my advice above and insist on immediate written back up from management. Then contact a good solicitor.

I have no reason to say this, but the likliehood settlement here is Resign-Now-and-take-€X.XX-as-a-gesture-of-goodwill-with-no-more-obligation-on-management-whatsoever. When the person in question changes employment then is the time to join a good trades union.
 
I've dealt with issues like this in the past as a manager in an unionized environment. Not easy to deal with as you have to be so careful that you don't walk into an unfair dismissal case. I have to say as well that most unions will not defend a person strongly if the case is largely open and shut and providing proper procedures are being followed

Key thing here is for your friend to ensure he gets everything in writing. At this stage, if he doesn't have a copy of the companies disciplinary procedures he should ask in writing for it. That will allow him to prepare.

I hate to say it but there must be some reason they suspect your friend. Something must be missing or there is a history there between employee and employer. Remember as well this is not a court of law, the employer does not have to prove beyond reasonable doubt. Providing they follow proper procedures and have reasonable grounds for dismissal, that may be enough
 
Remember as well this is not a court of law, the employer does not have to prove beyond reasonable doubt. Providing they follow proper procedures and have reasonable grounds for dismissal, that may be enough
I think that's the key point here. The Union is there to make sure proper procedure is followed by all concerned and that the procedures are fair and comply with the law. As long as that's the case they have nothing else to offer.
 
What we are talking about here is a criminal offence and it is for the guards to investigate, not a company disciplinary committee. Your friend should insist that the guards be informed either that or they start discussing his defamation claim. There is nothing like a hard dose of reality to bring kangaroo courts to their senses!
 
I think that's the key point here. The Union is there to make sure proper procedure is followed by all concerned and that the procedures are fair and comply with the law. As long as that's the case they have nothing else to offer.
1.We are talking about a non union member here. The union would have little or no interest in this case.
2. Peter presented this case 2nd hand. There are two sides to every story. It would be interesting to hear the full story.
3. Our police probably would have little or no interest in the case. But, who knows? How much or what is involved?
4. "There must be some reason . . ." according to one poster means little unless solid proof of anything is provided.
5. Jim suggests that there is a kangeroo court afoot.

I hope Peter comes back to inform us of any development(s).
 
What we are talking about here is a criminal offence and it is for the guards to investigate, not a company disciplinary committee. Your friend should insist that the guards be informed either that or they start discussing his defamation claim. There is nothing like a hard dose of reality to bring kangaroo courts to their senses!

No point in the OP's friend reporting the theft, unless it was their property, the Gardai can and will do nothing.

A company is perfectly entitled to investigate such activity internally, they are under no legal obligation to engage the Gardai in such cases. If the OP insists the Gardai are involved, then the person/entity at a loss will need to make a formal complaint.

Now, to take any action based on an internal investigation is another matter, the company will need to be very sure they have all the facts/evidence to back up any action. Most companies will allow the person under investigation to bring another staff member in as an observer to the procedure, they are not obliged to allow a solicitor attend, and very few, if any will allow it.

We don't know the full facts here either, and don't know who is making the allegation. Is it management or another staff member? It may be a vexatious claim by another staff member, in which case the company is likely obliged to investigate fully even if they think there's nothing to it.

OP, perhaps you'd come back and answer some of the questions here? Tell your friend to get a full copy of the company's disciplinary procedures, and make sure they follow them precisely.
 
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