Confused about salary scale on grade promotion

life_checker

life_checker

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Hello!

I've been working for 8 years in the public sector of the HSE now. I started in Grade IV (Clerical) and then got promoted to Grade V (Clerical) roughly 2 years ago.

I have been promoted to Grade VII (Clerical) which begins Monday (once signed). I have been informed by my HR department that I will be on the first salary scale of this grade. I was told there was some calculation applied and it comes out at the first point.

The starting scale of Grade VII is currently higher than my current point on the Grade V scale (by about 3k).

This was slightly disheartening as I was anticipating a roughly like-for-like jump to the same scale point. Obviously, I will benefit greatly in the long-run but I worked hard for the promotion and when I approached about requesting it, it was on the basis of getting higher wages for the recent work I have accomplished. HR are going to have a deeper discussion with me on this after the weekend to explain how it arrived at that point.

Does anyone here know if that's correct? I'll be perfectly honest in that I haven't been following my scale position much and I didn't look at it when it moved from IV to V (I had assumed it was like-for-like).

Thanks!
 
life_checker said:
The starting scale of Grade VII is currently higher than my current point on the Grade V scale (by about 3k).

This was slightly disheartening as I was anticipating a roughly like-for-like jump to the same scale point.
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Can you explain what you mean here please?
life_checker said:
Obviously, I will benefit greatly in the long-run but I worked hard for the promotion and when I approached about requesting it, it was on the basis of getting higher wages for the recent work I have accomplished.
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Again I don't understand. You are going to get higher wages in the new role - €3k more - so what's the issue?
 
ClubMan said:
Can you explain what you mean here please?

Again I don't understand. You are going to get higher wages in the new role - €3k more - so what's the issue?
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Hello! My assumption was that if I am on point 5 on the scale in Grade V for example then I would be on point 5 on the scale in Grade VII for example. Although I don't have much knowledge of the scale system.

The issue is, I requested the promotion on the basis of an immediate and noteworthy wage gain due to some of the work I had begun doing (which was way above my pay-scale, something I would have been paid much higher to do in the private sector for example). I'm proud of this work and happy with how it benefited my employer. This is why it was a bit deflating to see the immediate gain only go up by roughly 3k.

I know in the long-run I will benefit but I wanted to be sure that the scale position was possibly calculated correctly before my meeting Monday. I'm accepting of it regardless as I love working here but I want to go in knowing I'm not missing anything.
 
life_checker said:
This was slightly disheartening as I was anticipating a roughly like-for-like jump to the same scale point.
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I don't have the relevant Circular to hand but for my internal promotions the rule is that you start on the first point of the higher salary or a point immediately above your position on pre-promotion scale, whichever is higher.
 
life_checker said:
Hello! My assumption was that if I am on point 5 on the scale in Grade V for example then I would be on point 5 on the scale in Grade VII for example. Although I don't have much knowledge of the scale system.

The issue is, I requested the promotion on the basis of an immediate and noteworthy wage gain due to some of the work I had begun doing (which was way above my pay-scale, something I would have been paid much higher to do in the private sector for example). I'm proud of this work and happy with how it benefited my employer. This is why it was a bit deflating to see the immediate gain only go up by roughly 3k.

I know in the long-run I will benefit but I wanted to be sure that the scale position was possibly calculated correctly before my meeting Monday. I'm accepting of it regardless as I love working here but I want to go in knowing I'm not missing anything.
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You start the new grade at a point with a salary above your current one, but not at the same point on the different scale. Look at it this way; if you were at the final point on your scale and got a promotion, would you truly expect to go straight to the end of the higher scale??
Some institutions may give you a slight boost, in that that they will bump you up one increment on your current scale and then put you on the point in the new scale that is the closest above that salary, so you would not necessarily be starting on the first point. If the next point on your current scale is below the first point on the new scale, they won't bump you up past that, though.
 
life_checker said:
Hello! My assumption was that if I am on point 5 on the scale in Grade V for example then I would be on point 5 on the scale in Grade VII for example. Although I don't have much knowledge of the scale system.
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This assumption is false.

Staff are moved to a point on the new scale closest to their existing salary, but above their existing salary.
 
life_checker said:
Hello! My assumption was that if I am on point 5 on the scale in Grade V for example then I would be on point 5 on the scale in Grade VII for example. Although I don't have much knowledge of the scale system.
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From my experience in the public sector, the way you have been treated for pay purposes is correct. You always start a the first point on a salary scale.

There are occasional instances where the highest point on a scale for a particular grade is greater in value than the lowest point on a scale for a more senior position. In those instances, you may start at a higher scale point to ensure that you don’t incur a loss. This doesn’t apply in your case though.
 
Thanks everyone! I really appreciate the insight!

I'll wait my years out for it. At least my ceiling is higher again now!

Appreciate it everyone! No I can go in Monday with a clear head.
 
Do a search for starting pay on promotion.and you will find Circulars governing same. 08/19 for Civil service has some good examples.
Congratulations on promotion
 
Calculations for pay on promotion in various Public/Civil area differ. They shouldn't differ, of course, but they do. Several situations govern pay on promotions within the service e.g. length of time served in the older grade, Time spent on the Max of the grade, Rate of Pay before promotion, Date of increment (if one is due) and a few other items. I used to have the instructions (which were detailed to say the least). I loaned them to a person and despite my requests were not returned to me. This might seem like Lucky Dip to the reader and I cannot say that he/she is wrong.

I bet you won't believe this:- The processes governing promotion in the Irish Civil/Public service were handed down as written in the British Post Office in Victorian times. Hence, my disappointment on not having the papers returned to me.
 
Leper said:
Calculations for pay on promotion in various Public/Civil area differ. They shouldn't differ, of course, but they do. Several situations govern pay on promotions within the service e.g. length of time served in the older grade, Time spent on the Max of the grade, Rate of Pay before promotion, Date of increment (if one is due) and a few other items. I used to have the instructions (which were detailed to say the least). I loaned them to a person and despite my requests were not returned to me. This might seem like Lucky Dip to the reader and I cannot say that he/she is wrong.

I bet you won't believe this:- The processes governing promotion in the Irish Civil/Public service were handed down as written in the British Post Office in Victorian times. Hence, my disappointment on not having the papers returned to me.
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She's in the HSE. Starting Pay on Promotion circ 10/71 should apply.

I had a pristine copy which I lost during several office moves.

I would say off the top of my head, level 1 of the VII sounds about right. A 3k jump is a significant rise imo. Wait for the increments, they are a lot less.
 
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