AER LINGUS DELAYS

S

Swoon0

Guest
Hi, Would like to hear anybodys stories re Aer Lingus delays over Christmas and New Year. Personally involved in a delay by them after apparentely two planes touched at Dublin Airport, we were stranded in the U.S.. Not ONE apology from them.

The green ryanair !!
 
In fairness Swoon0 it was a highly unusual occurence .. the planes more than just "touched" they were both out of service for a day or two for maintenance due to one of them blowing around through 90 degrees and impaling itself on the other one in a ~100mph wind gust at the airport.

This left Aer Lingus down over 25% of their normal long haul capacity. Due to the time of year (peak travel season) & the unfortunate events in Asia excess charter capacity was I believe very hard to come by

I think they finally did manage to get in some capacity from charter companies a day or two after the incident.

If you had travel insurance you should investigate making a claim through them - I don't think you're going to get much out of Aer Lingus.
 
> AER LINGUS DELAYS

Got to H/row for 1410 flight to dublin last week. at 1405 announcement from departure gate that flight would be delayed at least half and hour. Would you believe the reason !!! apparantly the flight crew were delayed in traffic on their way from central london on the M4. I find this sort of codology totally unacceptable when one considers that the majority of the passengers were able to get there on time. one has to wonder why the crew didn't use the tube or why don't they lodge at one of the many hotels on the perimeter of Heathrow? i don't suppose willie will sort it out before he goes.
Roundstone
 
flight

I was delayed for 2 hours in Madrid on the 8th, no explanation at the airport but the pilot said a ground vehicle hit the plane that was meant to be coming over. Fair enough, these things happen but then we waited at the baggage belt for well over an hour upon arrival for the luggage to arrive.
Saw and confronted the first person I have ever seen breaking the smoking ban, an impossible woman, you know the kind!
 
Re: flight

The storm that caused all this trouble was forecast by Met Eirean. It was the responsibility of Flight Operations management to notify ramp personnel in advance and order suitable precautions to avoid damage to aircraft.
This is elementary stuff. No other airline had aircraft damaged.
Unfortunately, as ever, Aer Lingus management had their heads up their collective jacksies and did nothing.
Manpower shortage on the ramp as a result of staff cuts meant any attempt to take rapid action when the storm hit was hopelessly late.
The result was inevitable.

It cost millions, both in damage to aircraft and in the cost of rescuing the operation by hiring in aircraft.

Whose head will roll for this screw up?

You guessed it....nobody!
 
Aer Ryanair !!

Correct answer Tharggy !! I'm with you 100 % - My comment was that not one Aer Lingus Employee bothered to apologise.

Evil Doctor - I didn't say a thing about the fact we were delayed by 2.5 hours on the way out, having to go back to the stand after there was a problem with the aircraft, just as we were about to take off.
Or the story I heard of passengers being delayed for 9 hours due to an oil leak as they were about to take off, the week before Christmas. These are facts and had nothing to do with the weather.

Low cost means finding the lowest price on maintenance too - Obviously !!
 
Re: Aer Ryanair !!

Yes - 100%. Low Cost means cheap everything...including maintenance. Same at Ryanair. And all low cost airlines. The travelling public have no idea what goes on behind the scenes. Superglue is holding your airplane together when you fly Low Cost. The pilots and cabin crew are all poorly trained, overworked, and stressed out from worrying how they'll pay the mortgage because of bad pay. No food or coffee either while working 12 hour+ shifts.
Its an accident waiting to happen...and IT WILL.

But hey...its cheap, which is what you want, right!
Why did you buy a ticket on a crappy low cost airline? You got exactly what you paid for....I mean, you eventually arrived, alive! Thats a bonus!

Remember....working for a Low Cost Carrier means NEVER HAVING TO SAY SORRY.

Now feck off (as our Mick would say).
 
Re: Aer Ryanair !!

Tharggy,

"The pilots ...... stressed out from worrying how they'll pay the mortgage because of bad pay."

So what is the average pay of Aer Lingus pilots?
Ditto for Micko's lad?

Roy
 
Re: Aer Ryanair !!

Yep...I This post will be deleted if not edited to remove bad language you not. One Ryanair newly joined first officer (based in Stansted) was recently found sleeping in his car because he couldn't afford a hotel for two nights when they sent him to Manchester for his sim check.
O'Leary won't pay for crew accomodation or expenses.

Most of these young pilots have taken on debts of up to 75,000 euro to finance their pilots licence, and O'Leary then makes them pay for their type rating on the 737. They are then paid a pittance when they start working for him.
For many its a hand to mouth existence, with the bank manager snapping at their heels. Forget mortgages...most can't afford one.

Its a laugh isn't it! I break my This post will be deleted if not edited to remove bad language just thinking about the stupid eejits joining these days. All they are is slaves and cash cows to ruthless employers.

Still, I'll bet it makes all you office slaves feel good about yourselves, that those smug little flyboys are getting it up the bum good and hard, eh? Serves the feckers right.
Just remember though...he may be driving you to London when you take your next flight. Best of luck.
 
Re: Aer Ryanair !!

But Tharggy, you didn't answer the question...

So what is the average pay of Aer Lingus pilots? Ditto for Micko's lad?

Roy
 
Re: Aer Ryanair !!

Average pay is irrelevant, nobody earns the 'average pay' at any job. A couple of high earners at the top end of the company payroll who've been there for 20+ years will distort the picture.

An example:
In a company where everyone is earning 50K per year each...average pay is 50K. Fair enough, only it never happens.

But in a company where the top 10 earn 150K per year and the other 50 earn just 30K per year the average wage is still 50K. And management can also point out that some people are earning 150K!
Its a total distortion when those living on 30K form the vast majority of the workforce. This applies anywhere, not just airlines.

In the case of Low Cost carriers like Ryanair and Aer Lingus only a lucky few earn big money, and they form less and less of the workforce year on year - most of these are paid well only because they are management pilots (e.g. Willy Walsh earned over 250K as a management pilot).

Meanwhile at the bottom end the juniors are on salaries of 30K before tax, and with huge training debt burdens.

In Ryanair the latest trend is that junior pilots actually earn NOTHING...in fact THEY PAY THE COMPANY for the 'pleasure' of gaining flight hours. This is a wheeze that Micko has picked up on lately and he's forcing it on all new joiners. Eeejits.
 
Re: Aer Ryanair !!

With respect Tharggy I think you will find that in a lot of sectors "juniors" will be earning a lot less that 30k before tax. Chances are if you're buying a new house an apprentice will have been doing some of that wiring for you.

We also had the junior doctors working crazy hours for years without getting overtime - to be honest I would have had more sympathy with their situation.

If you want another example take law..... very heavy up front costs followed by devilling for a few years with little or no money.

So if a guy like WW could be on 250k p.a. before he was 40 then it's obviously a very lucrative game to be in so that explains why people are prepared so to pay so much to get into the game.

Looking at their website it quotes contract pay @ €85 per hour for First officers and €134 for Captains and in the UK Captains start @ STG£89k rising to £102k... actually the other stuff sounds good too eg Fixed Roster Pattern
Our roster pattern lets you plan with certainty. 5 on, 3 off. Fixed Days Off. No scheduled overnights, circumstances permitting.
Unrivalled Career Progression
Potential for command within 3 years.
Pension Plan
Company matches first 5% contribution from basic salary.
Loss of Licence Insurance Cover - €190,000
5 Year Agreement on pay, benefits and share options
Share Option Scheme
Our share option scheme has seen returns of €230,000 in 5 years for existing pilots
Excellent Flight Benefits
 
Re: Aer Ryanair !!

...in a lot of sectors "juniors" will be earning a lot less that 30k..
You can get a job in a call centre in Ireland that pays starting salaries of 25K rising to 35K. No investment required in your own training, and no real qualifications necessary.

We also had the junior doctors working crazy hours for years without getting overtime - to be honest I would have had more sympathy with their situation.
Why, are you a junior doctor? The junior doctors received their degree free of charge from the state and don't have to pay any of it back.

If you want another example take law..... very heavy up front costs followed by devilling for a few years with little or no money.
For a Barrister qualification, yes. But not for general Solicitor type qualifications, and again...its all paid for by the taxpayer!

So if a guy like WW could be on 250k p.a. before he was 40 then it's obviously a very lucrative game to be in so that explains why people are prepared so to pay so much to get into the game.
Dear me, weren't you reading? Only perhaps 1% of pilots ever get to that kind of money, even in a company like Aer Lingus where (I'll agree with you) there are too many greedy Chiefs and not enough Indians. Most pilots don't take up the career so they can sit in an office and write memos...they want to fly. Theres no money of the 250K kind in that unfortunately.

Looking at their website it quotes contract pay @ €85 per hour for First officers and €134 for Captains and in the UK Captains start @ STG£89k rising to £102k

Nope, thats NOT what it says...naughty naughty little keano!
Here's what it says!

"Our remuneration package includes a basic salary and sector pay. Captains joining Ryanair in the UK, for instance, can earn up to Stg£88,700 in the first year, rising to Stg.£102,140.
A senior first officer with 3 years' service can earn up to Stg.£70,620."

Note 'Can Earn', and Note 'Up To'.
And 'Rising to'...over how long?

Where did you get that 85 euro per hour figure? I can't find it anywhere. Do show!

The fact is that, whatever they put on the website to impress...its not what they offer when you are presented with a contract. The new joiner F/O receives a basic salary of around 20K per annum (before tax) and gets around 10K in sector pay. Thats it. And it only applies if you are already type rated and therefore earning anything, if not type rated...you get NOTHING, and you have to pay Ryanair for your type-training, around 30K last time I checked).

Hmmm.. that certainly isn't what I would call fantastic pay, especially since you haven't deducted all the extras such as loan repayments for training, uniform, medicals, pension, various other insurances and health schemes etc. that most employees would expect as part of a normal package.

Our roster pattern lets you plan with certainty. 5 on, 3 off. They can't actually work you any harder without breaking annual hours limits within the first 9 months of the year because each duty day is so long.

Fixed Days Off. Whooppedooo

No scheduled overnights, circumstances permitting. And if you are overnighting...pay for your own hotel.

Unrivalled Career Progression Yes, and a chance to escape will hopefully arrive all the sooner.

Potential for command within 3 years. And when you get it you'll be sent to Hahn, or Stansted...like it or not. Bye Bye kids.

Pension Plan. Company matches first 5% contribution from basic salary. Crap deal.

Loss of Licence Insurance Cover- €190,000 I'm looking at the webpage here and it says 100,000euro Okeano! Is it decreasing or are you exagerating? Either way...its Way below industry standard.

5 Year Agreement on pay, benefits and share options Which they've broken, causing union formation to procede apace.

Share Option Scheme In which you can't actually sell the shares...the shares aren't free, you pay for them, and their value has dropped dramatically over the last 2 years.

Excellent Flight Benefits 10% reduction on Ryanair flights...WOW!
 
Re: Aer Ryanair !!

Asi,

This thread has gone way off course at this stage and is in serious danger of just being your rant at the airline industry...again.

Maybe it is crappy to work in. I doubt it's much better/worse than a lot of industries. Accountants start off on lousy wages and have to work their asses off for years.

So what if you can get a call centre job for 25k. It's a terrible job!
You can get over 20k a year working in a shop. And you can earn up to 50k doing that over time.

Take IT. You need a degree to get a foot in the door as a junior developer these days and you earn pittance for a long time. That's just a sign of the times.

As for Willy Walsh and his 250k. He was head honcho at Aer Lingus ! Most head honchos of companies of this size earn this sort of money.

Pilots are not the poor down-trodden working class heroes that you make them out to be. I'm sure they're not rich snobs either. It's just a job. Aren't there airline specific forums out there where this stuff'd be more appropriate?
 
Re: Aer Ryanair !!

Gabriel, I'm responding to a question by Okeano. He wanted to know what pilots earn...so I'm telling him, OK!
I don't know either what the hell it has to do with a thread about Aer Lingus delays but thats where we ended up. If I ignored his question I'd be accused of hiding the facts.

Who paid for your IT developers job? If you need a degree, who funded your education?
It was FREE wasn't it? Poor baby.

Flying is a profession, not casual labour.
The people who do it are now carrying risks far in excess of the remuneration.

Stick to your desk job and you'll do fine, but don't lecture me about how hard life is for 9-5 'ers with free university degrees.
 
Re: Aer Ryanair !!

Software engineering is a profession too. One that has been hit very hard of recent times. As hard if not harder than the airline industry.

I didn't go to university. I got where I am today the hard way. You know very little about modern office life, especially in IT. Most of my weekdays start before 8 and finish at 8. Closer to dealines I can be here til after 10 or 11. I work damn hard for my salary, but I don't spend my whole life moaning about it.
 
Re: Aer Ryanair !!

Maybe if the whole travelling public moaned about your profession continuously you'd have more to say for yourself too.

Here goes!

What about Y2K then...what a load of bollix that was! Cost a feckin' fortune, all for what...IT people like Gaybo exagerated the whole thing just to make loads of money. They're all wasters and drive around in Porsches etc. Sack the lot of 'em I say!

Right...over to you now.
 
Re: Aer Ryanair !!

I've said my piece Asi. I'd lose the chip if I were you. It'll make you happier.
 
Re: Aer Ryanair !!

Sorry Tharggy me again,

This is clearly a very emotive issue for you and one you have been struggling with for a long time now. Wouldn't you be better off seeking a new job which would be less stressful. Less money maybe but it would give you a better quality of life.

Some of the statements you make appear to me to be scaremongery like the comments about bad maintenance and superglue holding the planes together - we all know that Ryanair have reduced their maintenance costs by buying loads of new planes and Air Lingus are in the process of doing the same. There has probably never been a safer time to fly ex-Dublin.

Roy
 
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