IMF loan - what's not to like

Bronte

Registered User
Messages
14,580
I've read the conditions the IMF have attached to their loan and I can't see one thing that is bad. Am I missing something? If I'd make any criticism, it is that they didn't suggest we reduce the size of the Dail but that's a minor quibble in the context of their overall conditions. So welcome IMF.
 
Well, what I don't like is that Ireland took the loan in the first place, rather than admit that it cannot repay debts. I still believe that this will be the ultimate outcome. Do you have a link to the official terms and conditions?
 
I've read the conditions the IMF have attached to their loan and I can't see one thing that is bad. Am I missing something? If I'd make any criticism, it is that they didn't suggest we reduce the size of the Dail but that's a minor quibble in the context of their overall conditions. So welcome IMF.

You can't see one thing that is bad. Well, how about the fact that the citizens of Ireland are being made to pay for the gambling debts of European banks who threw money at delinquent Irish banks like Anglo thinking that they would make a killing on the Irish property bubble before it burst!

How do you propose we repay the at least €10 bn a year IMF/ECB interest bill?
The €6 bn cuts we are facing in the budget is for our own domestic deficit.
The total debt we now have thanks to Lenny taking on the bank debts means the country owes over €200 bn. !!
We might as well be trying to put out a house fire with a toy water pistol.
 
You can't see one thing that is bad. Well, how about the fact that the citizens of Ireland are being made to pay for the gambling debts of European banks who threw money at delinquent Irish banks like Anglo thinking that they would make a killing on the Irish property bubble before it burst!

How do you propose we repay the at least €10 bn a year IMF/ECB interest bill?
The €6 bn cuts we are facing in the budget is for our own domestic deficit.
The total debt we now have thanks to Lenny taking on the bank debts means the country owes over €200 bn. !!
We might as well be trying to put out a house fire with a toy water pistol.

More like spitting on the fire really, isn't it?!
 
I think the OP was referring to the steps we need to take as a condition to receiving this loan rather than receiving this load itself.
 
I think the OP was referring to the steps we need to take as a condition to receiving this loan rather than receiving this load itself.

It doesn't help that we are being told that €50bn of the money is to pay nurses, teachers and Guards when the fact is that the debt interest on borrowings to fund the bank bailout is a very sizable chunk of this €50bn. This is on top of the €35bn additional capital earmarked directly for the banks.

Think about it. We will have borrowed €70bn+ to pay for the banks. If it was a 20 year mortgage at the rates of interest being quoted (5.8%) we will pay €6bn+ p.a. out of our own pockets each year for the banks.

We were told only a few months ago the cost was €1.5bn p.a. in interest but this ignored:

1) the fact we would have to ever repay the money,
2) the bailout cost more than doubled
3) It assumed we could access credit more cheaply
 
Will people get their heads around the sheer scale of this debt. To use another analogy, it's like the crew of the Titanic throwing water back out with cups when the ship is sinking further and further under the mountain of water debt pouring in.
It is just not possible to pay a fraction of the bank's debt, never mind the whole lot.
 
I think the OP was referring to the steps we need to take as a condition to receiving this loan rather than receiving this load itself.

That's correct. The debate on why we have to take the loan is another issue.

FF nor FG nor Labour were never going to take the steps outlined. They never have, nor never will. We can't as a people elect competent politicians. Hell we're willing to elect a person because they get us a passport or a bed in hospital for Auntie Mary. 1 in 5 people are still willing to vote FF . We accept the brown envelope society. We don't accept that we are in any way to blame for the economic disaster that has befallen us. We don't seem to accept that we have to pay for it. We are blaming everybody else for what has happened. We need to grow up and take the country back. That I believe also means breaking down the very institutions that hold power, the judicial system and the houses of Government in particular. Rebuilding from scratch as they are not fit for purpose. More even than the banks.
 
Hell we're willing to elect a person because they get us a passport or a bed in hospital for Auntie Mary.
Or to be more accurate, we're willing to elect a person because we think (and they are happy to propogate the myth that) they get us a passport or a bed in hospital for Auntie Mary.
1 in 5 people are still willing to vote FF
More like 1 in 8 on this morning's poll. Going the right direction at least.
 
This is exactly the problem. Enda and Eamon are no better a combination that Brian and Brian.

How can you justify that when they have never been in power ? FF have been there for what - nigh on 15 years now. Do you not think that the opposition should be given a chance ?
 
I think Fine Gael would be given a chance if they got rid of Enda Kenny. I have listened to what Eamon Gilmore has had to say in many interviews now and he doesn't seem to be facing reality. How can he possibly promise what he's promising? Anyway that's off topic.

On topic again I think the conditions imposed by IMF are sensible and would agree with OP's comment.
 
Do you not think that the opposition should be given a chance ?

The country should not be treated as a game of pass the parcel, they should be given the opportunity if we believe they have the skills, not because they have been patient for the last 15 years.

You would not leave your kids with someone that you were not absolutely confident that they could look after them. Why do we treat the governance of the country more like a raffle than an interview?
 
This idea of 'give the other lot a chance' is a totally madcap notion.
We are in deep trouble. Would any multi-national appoint a new CEO on this basis?
Ay sure give him a go and see if it works!
Not likely. The reality is that the opposion are also not fit for purpose.
There is no group of politicians here capable of the job now required.
 
Never voted Fine Gael and do not find Enda Kenny impressive but I think they are worth a chance in the next election. They could be no worse than FF.
The EU/IMF will ensure that the cuts are made anyway.

I would like to see the new government focus on political reform. If they did something radical like reduce the numbers of TDs and make it easier to employ outside experts as ministers, people would but into it. It would be their best chance to make a lasting contribution as the economy will be out of their hands to a certain extent.
 
Will people get their heads around the sheer scale of this debt. To use another analogy, it's like the crew of the Titanic throwing water back out with cups when the ship is sinking further and further under the mountain of water debt pouring in.
It is just not possible to pay a fraction of the bank's debt, never mind the whole lot.

Just like the actual Titanic, the rich bankers have the life boats. Its the working man who will get screwed since unlike them he wont have his pension fund.
 
To use another analogy, it's like the crew of the Titanic throwing water back out with cups when the ship is sinking further and further under the mountain of water debt pouring in.
It is just not possible to pay a fraction of the bank's debt, never mind the whole lot.

To use another analogy, it reminds me of the scene in the movie 'Goodfellas' when the Joe Pesci character is causing trouble in a restuarant he hangs out in. The owner makes the mafia boss a partner so Joe Pesci will behave himself when he is there. However, every month he has to come up with the money for the Mafia boss no matter what.
FF have being putting a positive spin on the IMF coming in but once they are in and the quaterly reviews are happening, there will be no wriggle room. I have no doubt there will be further cuts in PS pay, but untouchables so far like old age pension and corporation tax may be changed once targets are not met. I think they will get more hardline once they are in full control.
 
Back
Top