If that works out why not rent them out to Shell or Elf or Total? Can they find oil three miles under ground? If so they can save oil companies hundreds of millions of dollars.
Of course - but the corollary is that where there is little or no evidence to support a particular hypothesis then we can most likely assume that it is false - viz. dowsing and the results of several scientific/"clinical" trials to date.Empirical science has its limitations. Hypothesis are never proven.
For example, Newton's law of Universal Gravitation seemed pretty rock solid until Einstein came along.
but the corollary is that where there is little or no evidence to support a particular hypothesis then we can most likely assume that it is false
True - my mistake.No, this is incorrect. The most we can say is that there is little evidence to support the hypothesis.
I would say that your local Feng Shui consultant would be able to help you. They might tell you what the best way to face the house is as well.
Brendan
Eh? Something that is long established automatically deserves some sort of respect? I think not...But feng Shui as a body of knowledge is very old indeed, and not be slighted in this way.
What "precinct"? Even if they do that doesn't validate dowsing.2. Any oil or exploration company worth its salt uses dowsers as a part of their exploration process. One precinct of Switzerland makes it law that the site must be dowsed (regarding illness-producing earth energies) before a building can be sited there.
"Professional" dowsers have fared little better in rigorously scientific clinical trials that have been carried out. See here for example (note - not Wikipedia).This is the biofeedback system that you have set up in training. You can use any system you wish, including your hands, a visualised pendulum or nothing at all except a feeling. Just because many amateur dowsers get mixed results, this does not invalidate the practice?
Eh? This certainly suggests that he has entertained their challenges but they failed.4. James Randhi has been challenged on many occasions by dowsers and has failed to allow the challenge.
So what if the Catholic Church did this? They are hardly any sort of arbiter of scientific and objective reasoning.5. The Catholic Church used the services of Abbé Mermet, a french monk to map-dowse for water in parts of the earth where water was NOT easily found.
And....?6. The US military trained thousands of troops in Vietnam to use a single dowsing rod in one hand, rifle in the other, to locate enemy foxholes.
Yes - everybody can dowse as well as the experts - i.e. in line with chance and randomness.7. Eveyone can dowse to a greater or lesser extent. Its like the 4 minute mile folks, it can be done. Do not believe such haphazrd references to online research. Try it for yourself. If it works, keep it to yourself, because negativity is contagious in all forms of human activity.
Such as?Sorry for the tone, but dowsing is a valid activity, with many studies clearly showing results above chance
As the saying goes - "keep an open mind - but not so open that your brains fall out".So what seems crazy is not, if you take time to research with an open mind.
I would prefer if you could link to the tests which you claim validate dowsing as returning results better than chance. And to supporting information about some of the other claims that you make above. It think that it's reasonable to ask for somebody making such claims to back them up.Please don't ask me to reference the above claims.
Any chance Concern or Goal can hire a few of these guys to spend a few weeks in the Sub-Sahara? Might be a great help
If that works out why not rent them out to Shell or Elf or Total? Can they find oil three miles under ground? If so they can save oil companies hundreds of millions of dollars.
I'm amazed that no one has thought of this before!
What’s that you say; they use geology and science. I wonder why?
Eh? Something that is long established automatically deserves some sort of respect? I think not...
What "precinct"? Even if they do that doesn't validate dowsing.
"Professional" dowsers have fared little better in rigorously scientific clinical trials that have been carried out. See here for example (note - not Wikipedia).
Eh? This certainly suggests that he has entertained their challenges but they failed.
So what if the Catholic Church did this? They are hardly any sort of arbiter of scientific and objective reasoning.
And....?
Yes - everybody can dowse as well as the experts - i.e. in line with chance and randomness.
Such as?
As the saying goes - "keep an open mind - but not so open that your brains fall out".
I would prefer if you could link to the tests which you claim validate dowsing as returning results better than chance. And to supporting information about some of the other claims that you make above. It think that it's reasonable to ask for somebody making such claims to back them up.
Scientific enough! Care to elaborate?No its not withcraft and yes it is scientific enough for those who use it and get results.
No - let's test it to see if it does work. Hang on - they've done that and what do you know? Results no better than chance in any properly structured scientific/clinical test that has been performed to date (i.e. double blind etc. etc.).How does it work? Hmmmmmm. Let's stop using it until we find out.
So we should just accept that it works in spite of the evidence to the contrary and lack of evidence to support such claims?For God's sake, its not a cancer drug. If it works, it works. Do any of you know how many of your devices in your home really work? Do you sit there and go, ah no, that sounds like serious bull. How could you record programmes if you're not watching them and you've no tape or dvd? better tell Sky that they're pulling the wool over your eyes folks!!
How exactly is this "the same"?If I tell you I can fly a jumbo jet, maybe I can. maybe I can't>>> same with dowsing.
Show us the evidence that it works.Just because you haven't seen quality dowsing at work doesn't mean you throw the baby out with the bathwater.
No - you post links to the information on which you are basing your claims and let others comment on them.ALL international oil companies use professional dowsers. Try Google, not Wikipedia when you need to know stuff. Google, like a good sports car, needs a good driver. Gotta get the thinking cap on folks!
Evidence?With results above chance.
Huh!?!Bu then, is the scientific HSE not beginning to seriously dilute credibility at this stageAll down to the users and their experience folks. Dowsing is subject to human error too
Link?
- No, the dowsers did not fail Randhi's challenge. He refused to allow them to challenge.
Doesn't prove a thing.
- The Catholic Church used it Abbe Mermet to successfully locate water in parts of mexico, California and other parts of world where all other methods had failed to find water. He found it using map-dowsing, 1st time. So what you say? That makes me smile
So what?
- The US army are of course known for trying wacko ways to kill their troops by training them in using ouija boards and praying that the enemy will go away. No, they found it worked and didn't question why.
What Swiss "local authority" ?
- Again, the Swiss local authority must be bonkers also.
Doesn't take much wisdom to look at carefully collected evidence and draw conclusions. In fact it's boringly simple.Maybe their minds were so open that their brains all fell out !! Ah to be in the company of the bright shining lamp of wisdom
Seems odd that you can comment so confidently but need time to gather the evidence...I will post clear evidence but not tonight.
No problem with that. My problem is with people who claim that dowsing actually works. If he strikes it lucky and gets paid fair enough.
Link?
Doesn't prove a thing.
So what?
What Swiss "local authority" ?
Doesn't take much wisdom to look at carefully collected evidence and draw conclusions. In fact it's boringly simple.
Seems odd that you can comment so confidently but need time to gather the evidence...
How/why would they put forward my argument since to do so would be to totally undermine what they do!Except that this is the argument that many water-diviners in ireland will put forward?
How many diviners work on a "no foal no fee" basis and how many make their living solely from this work?So either they are financially suicidal or they are operating severely above chance?
Eh?It would make an interesting article I'd say. They must be stone-cold crazy to make such bets with punters......
Link?
Doesn't prove a thing.
So what?
I'm not sure at this stage what is meant by "So what?" We have entered into strange territory.
The US government felt sufficiently confident in the results of dowsing to train many troops in its use to help in perhaps saving their and their comrades' lives.
According to Army press office, there was no time for a double-blind test and the enemey weren't happy to oblige. But perhaps they did their own 'scientific' tests beforehand. Either ways, the results were good enough for them> and use it they did. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dowsing Oh look, its mentioned in Wikipedia and Washington Post. Of course, "So what?" I say also! Who are they trying to trying to scare with that crap? The commies?
I will retrn and post evidence. As the big man said, let all who have eyes see. But then again, there's a few agnostics reading this..... Sorry for quoting This post will be deleted if not edited immediately. he asked meSaid he'd been on Boards but not on here too often. some believe dowsing works, some don't. Personally, I don't trust this wireless internet thing, it'll never catch on. How am I getting connectivity in this padded cell? Witchcraft? I just dunno..........
How/why would they put forward my argument since to do so would be to totally undermine what they do!
Not your argument???, this one>>> from a poster here: #38 I think
"How about inserting a dose of pragmatism here?
Example: water diviner tells me that if I specify position I want the well dug in, I pay for every foot, at Eur 7.50 a foot - irrespective of finding water or not, good quality or bad.
If, however, he divines it, I pay nothing unless it's both found and of usable quality.
The well was 295 feet deep.
So, based on that, which option would you elect? All I know is that I've had water for 10 years, and it's perfect..........I am of course, slightly out of pocket..........
How many diviners work on a "no foal no fee" basis and how many make their living solely from this work?
How would I know this? Maybe I'll request that the CSO ask it next time around.... A good dowser working in conjunction with a well-borer will work on this basis.
Eh?Once again I'm at a total loss as to what point you are trying to make.
Scientific enough! Care to elaborate?
No - let's test it to see if it does work. Hang on - they've done that and what do you know? Results no better than chance in any properly structured scientific/clinical test that has been performed to date (i.e. double blind etc. etc.).
So we should just accept that it works in spite of the evidence to the contrary
Show us the evidence that it works
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