UK / Irish Pension Question

G

gouldian

New Member
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Hi Folks
I retire at the end of this year and should be eligible for the UK and Irish state pensions. I have just over 1600 PRSI contributions and I intend to apply for a contributory pension though I know I won't get the full amount. After buying 16 years Class 2 NI contributions I have about 35 full years from the UK. I briefly looked at the application forms for both Ireland and the UK and in each case they ask for NI / PPS numbers and about periods worked abroad
My question is. If for example I provide my UK NI number and UK work history to the dept here will they apply to the UK to fill the missing years which would reduce my UK pension or vice versa. As I know roughly what I will get I would prefer that each State pension stays as it is
I called the dept here asking that question but the person I spoke to probably hadn't come across it before so she was not sure.
I'd be very grateful for any help or advice provided. Thanks. Jim
 
35 years NI in the UK will get you a full UK State Pension.
1600 A Class PRSI (equivalent to c30 years in Ireland) should get you at least 30/40ths of an Irish Pension.
 
Thanks for the replies
I was going to apply online for the Irish pension but I think I will do it by completing the paper aplication form so that I can include a letter asking them not to apply to the UK for contributions to top up the Irish pension
I hope I can do likewise for the UK one
 
gouldian said:
I think I will do it by completing the paper aplication form so that I can include a letter asking them not to apply to the UK for contributions to top up the Irish pension
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Making life too complicated - why raise the hare in the first place.

Just leave out the NI number - it can't be mandatory to have one, so just leave it blank.
 
If you answer Q13 Yes (to the Application Form) - which is a direct question and should be answered Yes in this scenario, then one is asked to complete Q21. It doesn't look like Q21 is optional to me. I'd imagine an incomplete Q21 would cause its own delays if Q13 was answered honestly!

The real question is: if one completes the form fully and honestly, apart from possible delays, is there anything at all to be concerned about?

DannyBoyD said:
Just leave out the NI number - it can't be mandatory to have one, so just leave it blank.
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It kinda is mandatory if you worked in the UK!

Also, the Declaration on the form should mean something to those that sign it. Frankly, I'm a bit disappointed by the advice here. AAM should not be advocating that people breach such pledges/declarations.

I declare that the information given by me on this form is truthful and complete.
I understand that if any of the information I provide is untrue or misleading or if I fail to disclose any relevant information, I will be required to repay any payment I receive from the department and I may be prosecuted. I undertake to immediately advise the department of any change in my circumstances which may affect my continued entitlement.
 
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Is it possible that the Department might ask you what you would prefer?

I would think that they'd need your permission to alter the proposed pension income from abroad. You could, of course, then object if it didn't go the way you'd like
 
JimmyB99 said:
kinda is mandatory if you worked in the UK
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You misunderstand.

It is not mandatory for every Irish person to have a UK NI number.

I would simply mark it NA & move on.

They only ask so that, if necessary your UK payments can be used to add to your Irish PRSI record. Which you don't want.

As for the rest of your comments

A. Get a grip
B. Do what ever you want.
 
DannyBoyD said:
It is not mandatory for every Irish person to have a UK NI number.
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Wow - doubling down on the nonsense!

This is a clear, childish attempt to misinterpret the point being made
DannyBoyD said:
Just leave out the NI number - it can't be mandatory to have one, so just leave it blank.
Click to expand...
JimmyB99 said:
It kinda is mandatory if you worked in the UK!
Click to expand...

The questions remain.....
How would you answer Q13 - truthfully or falsely?
If you answer it honestly, are you then going to not answer Q21 truthfully and completely (as per the declaration).
This is seriously concerning.
 
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DannyBoyD said:
They only ask so that, if necessary your UK payments can be used to add to your Irish PRSI record. Which you don't want.
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As things stand today, does anyone know if I can pay more NICs in the UK than the maximum 35 years, say 38, and use the extra 3 years in Ireland if I don't reach the maximum of 40 here by the time I retire?
 
Again
Thanks to everyone. I appreciate you taking the time to reply. I am going to call the UK and Irish departments again to try to get more info. On the UK form they do state that any incomplete sections ARE going to result in delays and I had to provide my Irish work details and PPS no in order to be able to buy Class 2 NI contributions so they know I worked in Ireland. I suppose I have no option other than asking both not to take contributions from the other.
 
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@gouldian - good idea to ring. If you ask them whether you should complete the form, as directed, I'd imagine they will tell you that you should!

I note my questions from earlier have been ignored - I suppose it's an answer in its own way. Disappointing nonetheless as, in fairness, the contributor in question has done much good work on this subject otherwise.
 
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@gouldian

I'm in a similar position to you, and a similar age by the sounds of it. I'm not expert, but everything I've read, says they're paid separately. They don't just go and borrow some from one side, to increase the other. I think it's possible to do that sort of thing, if you're trying to get one side up to the minimum requirements.

I was advised by the International pensions centre in Newcastle, to apply via them, for the Irish pension, which is a pro rata figure, 90% the old calculation, 10% the new, six months before it's due. They then forward that to Sligo, or wherever it is that deals with claims. So I've already filled in the form and posted it to them. I'm currently resident in UK .

Then, three months before 66th birthday, I should receive the invitation to claim letter, for the UK pension.

I'll let you know how that all proceeds!
 
Lisgoold said:
advised by the International pensions centre in Newcastle
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Do you have this in writing? I note you are UK resident.

Edit to update: yep this is published on gov.uk site.

I would have expected claiments to claim Irish pension via Sligo; its nothing to do with DWP & I'm not clear why they would get involved.

Freely admit to being cynical about the motivation on DWP's part.

I'd advise claiming via Sligo for Irish pension & then separately to DWP when that date comes.
 
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@DannyBoyD

Too late in my case, as I've already claimed. I'm sure claiming separately would work just fine.

Everything I've ever read about it, states that you only apply once, even if you're entitled to two, three, or four pensions, and that application should be made in the country where you reside at the time. That's kind of what the international pensions centre is for.

Whether Sligo just go ahead and pay it, based on the forms I've already filled, or whether, once contacted by Newcastle, they just send me their own form to fill in, I don't know yet.

Obviously, they already have my PRSI record, and they requested work history, places of employment, dates etc, just for the Irish employment, which I put on the form that Newcastle sent to me. So I can't really see what else they'd need. Had to put bank account info on there too.
 
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