Start Mortgages halts all repossessions as calculating arrears wrong. Tanager using the same method.

Discussion in 'Mortgage arrears & negative equity case studies' started by Brendan Burgess, Nov 3, 2017.

  1. Brendan Burgess

    Brendan Burgess Founder

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    Back in 2005, I complained to the Financial Regulator that the Irish Nationwide was overstating the arrears. But I got nowhere.

    I see now that the High Court in Northern Ireland has found against Bank of Scotland who calculate the arrears in the same way.

    NI judge finds that Bank of Scotland/Tanager calculating arrears incorrectly

    I would be very interested in seeing some mortgage statements from former Irish Nationwide customers who are in arrears to see if the new owners have fixed this problem.

    Brendan
     
  2. RedOnion

    RedOnion Frequent Poster

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  3. Brendan Burgess

    Brendan Burgess Founder

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    I have seen the statements from some Tanager customers and they are using the same method in the Republic.

    I understand that Michael McGrath has drawn the above court case to the attention of the Central Bank. Hopefully, they will step in and halt Tanager's repossession cases as well.

    Brendan
     
  4. Open air

    Open air Frequent Poster

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    Fair play to you brendan
     
    Browner likes this.
  5. Bronte

    Bronte Frequent Poster

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    BB what happned to your complaint? And if you could see it how come the FR did nothing?
     
  6. Brendan Burgess

    Brendan Burgess Founder

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    Hi Bronte

    When you make a complaint to the FR or the Central Bank, you get no feedback at all. They could have launched an investigation, I have no idea.

    But there was no evidence that they did and it seems that the buyers of Irish Nationwide mortgages are still calculating the arrears wrong.

    Brendan
     
  7. Bronte

    Bronte Frequent Poster

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    Well I think you should write an article for the newspapers on that. I presume you have a copy of your complaint. Someone dogged like Charlie Weston in the Irish Independant might be interested in chasing that story up, to see what exactly the FR did with your complaint.
     
  8. Brendan Burgess

    Brendan Burgess Founder

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    It was back in 2005. It is just one more example of the Financial Regulator doing nothing.

    Brendan
     
  9. RedOnion

    RedOnion Frequent Poster

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  10. Brendan Burgess

    Brendan Burgess Founder

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    Interesting that there is no mention of Tanager.

    Two have reported problems

    Lone Star - €420m of loans from BoSI and Start Mortgages

    Mars Capital - Oaktree - €320m of loans from Irish Nationwide and Springboard

    The Lone Star vehicle said that the outcome of any investigation may result in delays “in any enforcement against the relevant borrower”.

    While I appreciate that it's difficult to understand and explain, the Irish Times report doesn't fully understand what has gone wrong here:

    "The Central Bank has started to examine whether mortgage lenders mishandled some borrowers who have availed of the most popular form of debt restructuring on offer for distressed home loans."

    If a borrower agreed an arrears capitalisation with the lender, then the mortgage repayment was calculated correctly.

    However, if there was agreement to capitalise arrears, then the repayments were calculated incorrectly. Because the bank both capitalised the arrears and pursued them at the same time.

    Brendan
     
  11. Bronte

    Bronte Frequent Poster

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    How can banks with the best banking brains make fundamental mistakes.

    As for the Financial regulator - what a country.
     
  12. Open air

    Open air Frequent Poster

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    As a registrar said last week bronte,, " either these people dont know what their doing,or in my opinion and i hope im wrong, they know exactly what their doing". These funds have been left run riot!
     
  13. Nel

    Nel New Member

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    I am currently with Tanager and have been before the County Registrar once so far. I am paying the full mortgage repayments now but I want to pay extra off the arrears which has already decreased by 14,000. How can I tell if they have miscalculated the arrears balance?
     
  14. Brendan Burgess

    Brendan Burgess Founder

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    Hi Nel

    I would guess, and it's only a wild guess, that the arrears are probably overstated by around 10% to 20%. In other words, if your arrears are €40,000, the correct figure should be around €36,000.

    So, how much do they say your arrears are and how much are you planning to pay off your arrears?

    Brendan
     
  15. Nel

    Nel New Member

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    Hi Brendan, they say my arrears stand at 66,000 at the moment. I would like to pay an extra €300 every month to get them down. The Registrar ordered that we submit a SFS again and meet with the bank, ordering that a representative from Tanager should be there along with their solicitor. To be honest I found the Registrar very fair. I watched a few cases before mine and I thought she handled them well, including mine. I hope I am not eating those words when I am before her next time! As we know, Tanager don't like to meet face to face, so I thought it was good that she ordered them to have a meeting.
     
  16. IdesofMarch

    IdesofMarch Registered User

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    Lapithus, the master credit servicing firm for Tanager have a closed office as well, wonder do Central Bank of Ireland know this? Your arrears balance is wrong, you know this, Tanager know this and I suspect the CBI are now also aware. Try and get a notice of change in interest rates that Lapithus sent you. It will exhibit your monthly mortgage repayments increasing as the interest rate applied to your account decreases. Show this to the registrar or Judge. This is unconscionable behaviour. You never know but your case could be struck out, with the right application to the Court!
     
  17. Open air

    Open air Frequent Poster

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    This is exactly what happened when my interest rate dropped!
     
  18. Browner

    Browner Registered User

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    I also got a letter stating the interest rate had gone down yet my repayments went up.
    This happened twice to me.
     
  19. Nel

    Nel New Member

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    Thanks IdesofMarch. I get nervous at the thoughts of bringing anything up with the Registrar because I don't want her sending it into the Judge, although having it struck out would be amazing. I did a Freedom of Information request recently and just received a ton of documents so I need to through them. I don't have a very good eye for figures so it could be worth getting it checked by someone who does.
     
  20. IdesofMarch

    IdesofMarch Registered User

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    Last edited: Dec 9, 2017
    Nel, you received a data access request (DAR) not a freedom of information request (FOI), your data access request should be chronological in nature, so all you have to do is look up the last time the ECB changed it's interest rate. That was in March 2016. You should find your notice of change of interest rate from Lapithus in or around this time. It should be born in mind that Lapithus are only emulating what BOSI did with your mortgage since inception. In other words, the longer you were in arrears with BOSI the bigger the overcharge is.
     
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2017