sick from one job, but not the other?

Hi folks...

Im just wondering can a person be off certified sick (stress) from one job i.e. light manual labuor, but not be off sick from his other part time job as a bus driver?


both part time.

thank you,

Killter

Sounds dodge. Or could it be something/someone causing the stress (i.e. bullying) at the light manual labour work that the indivdual is avoiding???

Yeager said:

Sounds dodge. Or could it be something/someone causing the stress (i.e. bullying) at the light manual labour work that the indivdual is avoiding???

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yes have to agree with the above as driving a bus must surely be more stressful. any HR person will tell you that STRESS is now the new BACK PAIN.

HR people hate the term work related stress as it used too often. That said you must accept the cert. The employer needs to act quickly to establish what is causing the stress. But in answer to your question, yes you can. A sick cert states you are unfit for your duties, so you can be fit for one job but not the other.

donee said:

any HR person will tell you that STRESS is now the new BACK PAIN.

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Are you suggesting that 'stress' certs are largely down to malingering?

So we have someone who has been signed off by his doctor as being too stressed out to do light manual labour but your question is if he is physically and mentally able to drive a bus and be responsible for the health and safety of his passengers.?

If I was the bus company, I'd be referring the individual to an occ health provider/doctor for an opinion. If the company doesn't have one of these, at the very least I'd suggest contacting the company insurers to make sure that if he is driving, that he is not invalidating the companies insurance policy since he has been deemed to be too stressed to work elsewhere.

If it's work related stress then it could be logical. eg bullying, overwork, underutilised and undermined etc. For instance, if you were out of work suffering from stress it wouldn't imply you were too 'ill' to do housework, gardening etc. Simply that the circumstances exisiting in the workplace were affecting your health and you needed to remove yourself from that situation.

What does the cert say? I'd be very surprised if it stated this person was fit to carry out one job and not the other. Doctors are usually very cautious about this sort of thing.

If the cert was being made out to one employer, why would they mention any other employment in it?

Doctors make certs out to the patient, not the employer. They're generally a standard form, headed with the practice details, state the patient name, sometimes an outline of the condition, and the period of time the patient is unfit to work.

I know, I probaby wasn't very clear but what I meant was, if the employee presents his employer with a cert stating that it is his doctor's opinion that the person is suffering from stress and is unfit to attend work, this could be on foot of a discussion between the employee and the doctor in which it was agreed the employee was stressed because of a situation or issue in one particular workplace. It would, of course, be different if the cert stated he had something physical wrong with him like the flu or a broken leg.

Complainer said:

Are you suggesting that 'stress' certs are largely down to malingering?

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No im certainly not, but at a conference i was at last year regarding Credit Unions the HR speaker made the point that were once the most common sick cert was for back pain , now its 'stress'. Not across the credit union movement i might add. And im not in any way trying to lessen the genuine feelings of pressure that somebody suffering stress feels.

I think there was a time when people were afraid to put 'stress' on their certs because they would be considered some kind of a psychiatric case by their manager or HR Department. Therefore 'back pain' became a euphemism.
I agree that some people just jump on the 'stress' bandwagon anytime they have a bit of hassle at work or just fancy a few weeks off and, like people who falsely cry 'rape', they are making it very difficult for the genuine victims to be taken as seriously as they should be.

The key issue is that a person's GP shouldn't be putting "stress" onto a sick certificate as it isn't a recognised condition. While work-related stress may well be a legitimate cause of various conditions, it is the medical condition that means the individual is unfit for work, not the alleged cause.

The other issue is that GPs are not in a position to make an immediate causal relationship between the person's condition and it being the workplace. A much more detailed examination and investigation is required in particular by an occupational physician to establish any causal link to work.

The frustration from employers is that GPs very often do link conditions with work on official documentation even though they are not in a position to make that judgement.

The OP would have to check in their employee handbook regarding fitness to work and any expectations from their employer. There's a grey area in terms of how much information an employer is entitled to ask for regarding specific medical conditions, however a watered down version may exist where the employee is required to notify the employer of the presence of a condition (without mentioning the specific condition) that may affect "the validity of their risk assessments".

As I say, grey area, but in the event of an incident and it transpires you hadn't declared the presence of a condition and the employer required you to, it could get complicated.

I never was issued a cert saying what was wrong with me when signed off by my GP. The cert states that you are unfit for work and the duration; it isn't the business of anyone WHY you are unfit for work unless you decided to tell them.

IMHO FWIW

I have to say, I agree with you. The only reason our HR want to know is for promotion purposes. If, for instance, you're constantly out with headaches and sore throats they will take that into account. If,however, you're out for a few weeks following an appendix operation or because you've a broken leg, then that will be 'discounted'. Therefore, I now only ask my doctor to put what is wrong with me on the cert if I think it should be discounted for promotion. Personnel then know that everything else should be taken into account eg if I have the flu or a stomach bug.

liaconn said:

I have to say, I agree with you. The only reason our HR want to know is for promotion purposes...

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In fairness, they can want to know all they want, you are not obliged to disclose your illness to your employer. The details of the condition is personal medical information and so an employer has no right to demand to see that information or even put clauses around the disclosure of that information.

Only certain exceptions to that, public health etc, and even then it's vague as to how much detail an employer is entitled to.

ACA said:

The cert states that you are unfit for work and the duration; it isn't the business of anyone WHY you are unfit for work unless you decided to tell them.

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In the Civil Service it is a requirement that the medical cert states the nature of the illness.

Killter said:

Hi folks...

Im just wondering can a person be off certified sick (stress) from one job i.e. light manual labuor, but not be off sick from his other part time job as a bus driver?


both part time.

thank you,

Killter

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I don't know why 'stress' came into this query' replies. The OP asks a question about being certified as 'unfit for work'. In my opinion this is certifying that the person is unfit for any type of work and needs time off to recover from an illness.