RPZ limit plus maintenance fee.

B

Bill90.

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Hi, just looking for advice on the RPZ.

I let a house to my friends for 5 years at below market value rent. Now they're leaving and I'm stuck well below market value.

My question is could I rent it for RPZ limit of €1000 + 300 management fee if the new tenant agrees to it and it's put on the lease in black and white.

I do cut the grass and maintain the property.

The full amount would be paid into my account and tax paid so Revenue wouldn't lose out.

If it's agreed on the contract then what could anybody do realistically?

Would love to hear your opinions on this.

Thanks.
 
I have often wondered about that! A lot of rental contracts specify that the tenant is responsible for various utilities and charges however they come about and there seems to be no reason why this couldn't include management fees. Or LPT for example. (That's assuming the management fee is paid to a management company - if it's simply to the landlord then the RTB would certainly regard it as rent by another name.)

I don't know of any cases where there's been a definitive ruling, but generally the RTB take an anti-avoidance approach and would regard any attempt to circumvent the RPZ with suspicion. So tread carefully!
 
Right Winger said:
I have often wondered about that! A lot of rental contracts specify that the tenant is responsible for various utilities and charges however they come about and there seems to be no reason why this couldn't include management fees. Or LPT for example. (That's assuming the management fee is paid to a management company - if it's simply to the landlord then the RTB would certainly regard it as rent by another name.)

I don't know of any cases where there's been a definitive ruling, but generally the RTB take an anti-avoidance approach and would regard any attempt to circumvent the RPZ with suspicion. So tread carefully!
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Yes I agree that they wouldn't be happy with it but the old saying comes to mind "it's not about what you know it's about what you can prove in court "

Revenue still get the same so I don't see them being too bothered.

It's just something I was thinking about is all.
 
I think you can retrospectively apply increases as per what was allowed over the years where there was no increase applied on a compound basis e.g 4% or 2% pa. A friend has recently done this as they didn’t increase for a few years as they had good tenants. Now they have left they will increase in line with what they missed out on. Check in with the RTB for completeness.
 
If a tenant started out not paying management fees it seems unfair to add them on while the same tenant is there

But if the tenant changes and you said to the new tenant... Here is the charge: 1000 plus
300 management and they agreed.... Seems okay
But legally, would it stack up?
 
Institutional landlords seem to be doing this and you can be sure they have taken legal advice before doing so:

Leases and websites for eight of the city’s big private student accommodation providers suggest that two years ago, just one of them charged students extra fees for utilities or amenities on top of the rent.

For the coming academic year, seven of these eight are.

Among those adding fees for students moving in from the autumn is Aparto. Its new contracts now largely mirror the contracts used since last year by Yugo, another of Dublin’s big student housing providers.
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But this is in the context of "all in" packages including cleaning and utilities which is unlikely to be the case of private landlords.

Bill90. said:
My question is could I rent it for RPZ limit of €1000 + 300 management fee if the new tenant agrees to it and it's put on the lease in black and white.
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To me this wouldn't really pass a smell test if challenged. Something approaching 20% sounds plausible but 30% looks like disguised rent. The RTB is very tenant friendly and it's up to you to assess how likely you ever are to end up in there.
 
Between a mix of all of the above, you might get to where you need to be.

- An important question, if you had it let to friends, is was it ever registered with the RTB in the first place? If not, then problem solved.
- If it was registered and you didn't increase the rent for five years then you can now do so retrospectively. So you can increase rent by 10%, as long as inflation over that period of time amounted to more than 10%, which I believe it did, but you can use this calculator to tell you for sure
RPZ Calculator
- If the 10% increase doesn't get you to where you want to be, perhaps you can top it up with charging a management / maintenance / utilities fee. However, I have no experience in doing this and don't know whether it's legal or not.
 
Right Winger said:
I have often wondered about that! A lot of rental contracts specify that the tenant is responsible for various utilities and charges however they come about and there seems to be no reason why this couldn't include management fees. Or LPT for example. (That's assuming the management fee is paid to a management company - if it's simply to the landlord then the RTB would certainly regard it as rent by another name.)

I don't know of any cases where there's been a definitive ruling, but generally the RTB take an anti-avoidance approach and would regard any attempt to circumvent the RPZ with suspicion. So tread carefully!
Click to expand...
I wouldn't do this because the tenant can simply not pay the management fee and walk away, whereas an owner cannot do so without incurring a charge against his property from the management company. RTB suggests that the landlord is liable for any charges that are chargeable regardless of whether or not the property is occupied - i.e. management fee, service charges, LTP, RTB registration and insurance. Its theoretically possible (and possibly currently legal), but cannot be enforced in the event that the tenants simply decide to not pay it because there is no recourse against them as non owners of the unit. You could price up the cost of services such as bin collection and parking space access and charge for that separately perhaps?

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