Brendan Burgess
Founder
- Messages
- 54,801
Up until 2009 an SVR tracked the ECB rate. There lies the shambles we have now.Should the thread title not read " No reason to expect that the "Appropriate Variable rate" related to a tracker rate" ?
I think that this decision has implications for other borrowers who are claiming that the references in their documentation to "variable rates" could include trackers, because trackers are variable rates.
It seems to me from this decision, that this line of reasoning will not be enough on its own. You will need to provide some other evidence to support your view that a variable rate was intended to mean a tracker rate.
Brendan
Up until 2009 an SVR tracked the ECB rate. There lies the shambles we have now.
Thats where the terms are grey.... how grey is up to the ombudmans i suppose....Would you include the EBS Variable Base Rate in that?
For the AIB guys the clause was "Conversion to Tracker interest rate mortgage loan at the banks then prevailing rates" so there is no ambiguity they are entitled to a tracker, the ombudsman needs to rule on what the prevailing rate should of been.what about prevailing rate?
Thats what I was thinking definitely not clearly one or the otherThats where the terms are grey.... how grey is up to the ombudmans i suppose....
That doesn't leave me with too much hope. How could he determine what it might be?For the AIB guys the clause was "Conversion to Tracker interest rate mortgage loan at the banks then prevailing rates" so there is no ambiguity they are entitled to a tracker, the ombudsman needs to rule on what the prevailing rate should of been.
Yes and no. But it didn't track the way a tracker Mortgage would track the rate.Up until 2009 an SVR tracked the ECB rate. There lies the shambles we have now.
Peemac- there were 7 ECB base rate changes between April 2004 and March 2008. If during this period your rate changed in line with the ECB base rate immediately following each of these changes with the exact same margin applicable (e.g. ecb +1.25%)...and you were sent a letter immediately after each of these 7 ECB rate changes confirming that your rate has changed because of said ECB base rate change ...and your mortgage contract referenced a base rate...would this rate in your opinion be a SVR or tracker rate?Yes and no. But it didn't track the way a tracker Mortgage would track the rate.
I've had mortgages since 1990, and moved home 5 times until current house purchased in 2005.
So up to the 2005 mortgage, all were standard variable rates or fixed rates that moved back to the variable rate - and it was the same for many years before that too.
Mortgage rates did move at similar ways to ecb or irish central bank rates - but not always immediately as they must do with trackers, and not always by the exact same amount as a tracker must.
Some banks tried to hold off as long as possible until media pressure led to the changes. In most cases they announced reductions a couple of days into a new month and to take effect from the following month.
But yes, they "followed" ecb / cbi moves, but did not track them.
There were many rate changes before trackers existed and the mortgage rates generally followed those changes fairly quickly.Peemac- there were 7 ECB base rate changes between April 2004 and March 2008. If during this period your rate changed in line with the ECB base rate immediately following each of these changes with the exact same margin applicable (e.g. ecb +1.25%)...and you were sent a letter immediately after each of these 7 ECB rate changes confirming that your rate has changed because of said ECB base rate change ...and your mortgage contract referenced a base rate...would this rate in your opinion be a SVR or tracker rate?
So a good way for a bank to manage market challenges such as competition & media pressure around rates was to somehow conflate an SVR & tracker product.There were many rate changes before trackers existed and the mortgage rates generally followed those changes fairly quickly.
If a bank did not make a change, the media questioned it and they quickly became uncompetitive and banks generally had a similar margin.
Mortgages were rather boring loans before trackers.
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?