Non Disclosure Agreement with Enterprise Ireland

O

Ocras

Guest
Kind of a difficult one, but would love to hear some personal non-objective viewpoints;

Someone is approaching Enterprise Ireland with an innovative, but non patentable concept/product.

They are hoping to qualify for feasibility capital.

If you were representing Enterprise Ireland, would you take it as rude to be asked to sign an NDA, before the project was presented to you in full?

Fear is, that Enterprise Ireland are involved with existing companies who could develop and supply the same product, as opposed to Enterprise Ireland assisting a start-up.

This is by no way questioning the integrity of Enterprise Ireland, but NDA's exist for a reason.
 
If you were representing Enterprise Ireland, would you take it as rude to be asked to sign an NDA, before the project was presented to you in full?
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I personally wouldn't take offence at this. In fact I would regard this in a positive light - a business owner with a bit of foresight. However, I don't work for Enterprise Ireland.

Fear is, that Enterprise Ireland are involved with existing companies who could develop and supply the same product, as opposed to Enterprise Ireland assisting a start-up.
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What stopping other companies highjacking your idea anyway, once you have it up and running?
 
Thanks for that.

"What stopping other companies highjacking your idea anyway, once you have it up and running?"

"Up and running" is the key phrase. Leaves you ahead in the race.
 
Hi Ocras

I wouldn't worry too much about it. I am sure that EI has a policy on this. they either sign standard Non disclosure agreements or they don't. I doubt if a grant applicant would be able to convince them to change if it is not their policy.

Brendan
 
Cheers.......I'll tell my friend not to worry so much, but to bring along the NDA, anyhow. I'm sure offence won't be taken by them on it's proposal.
 
I have had, and still have, dealings with EI on projects that involve intellectual property considerations. They have a strict policy of nondisclosure but if you want to claim the IP on a project you have to have NDA's in place with whomever you show the product of concept to. If you don't then it is considered to be in the public domain and noone can claim the IP. It's not quite that simple but if you proceed on that basis then you are covered.
Remember that a copyright can offer quite a bit of protection even if it falls short of the monopoly guarinteed by a patent.
Your friend also has to remember that any legal IP protection is useless unless you have lots of money to defend it in court.

The grant application process is another thing that has to be looked at in detail before you get into specifics with the EI boys and girls. If your product is a new technology, a technology that is not currently produced in Ireland or an advance on an existing product then you can qualify for a Research Technology and Innovation Grant or one of the start up grants for SME's. You or your friend probably already know this but from my experience how you present your application is as important as it's contents.
If the money is there then there are consultants who can hand hold you through the process. If you want more detail you can PM me.

Good luck to your friend either way.
 
Don't EI take shares in start-ups they invest in? If that's true, they'd be just as determined as you to protect their investment.
 
One of the ways they give finance to a company is to buy shares in it. These are not standard shares, they can only be sold back to the other shareholder so in a way it's an interest free loan.
 
Posts before this are from 2005.

I'm reviving this thread because a google search for "Enterprise Ireland NDA" returned it in my search results & there are relevant insights mentioned above that are still relevant today.

I had pretty much the same question as the OP above. I imagine a scenario where you approach EI with the Lamh out for funding & professional advice & in the other hand you have an NDA that you're reluctant to put on the table for fear of alienating the relationship & scuttling it from minute zero.

Similar to above the idea is not copyrightable or patentable but rather it is a somewhat innovative business practice/service.

@Purple had mentioned some engagements with EI & his professional experiences with them in 2005. Anyone else have more recent engagements or advice on engaging with EI while protecting your concept?
 
Talk to EI and see what they say. If you are already in business or have a backer or show in some other way that you are a serious proposition then they will take you seriously. They will not share your ideas with other client companies. If they did then they would destroy their own credibility.
 
I can't comment on EI but I know from my own dealings with LEO's in an advisery capacity is that NDA's can be a red rag. At the end of the day, this is taxpayers money that these bodies are giving out, they have to account for it, they have to report on it up the line and to the state and 99 times out of 100 what the NDA is attempting to cover is already out there. EI and LEO may also need to bring the application back into a committee whose members have already signed NDA's as part of their membership or employment.

What would be much more benificial would be a patent on what you have.
 
thedaddyman said:
I can't comment on EI but I know from my own dealings with LEO's in an advisery capacity is that NDA's can be a red rag. At the end of the day, this is taxpayers money that these bodies are giving out, they have to account for it, they have to report on it up the line and to the state and 99 times out of 100 what the NDA is attempting to cover is already out there. EI and LEO may also need to bring the application back into a committee whose members have already signed NDA's as part of their membership or employment.

What would be much more benificial would be a patent on what you have.
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Fully agree with the accountability up the chain you outlined, I also accept that many of the potential ideas are out there already but I don't fully understand the red flag component you described.

For example if I approached the LEO you work with & requested an NDA in good faith what about the request would raise that red flag?
How might the discussion about the NDA around the LEO commitee table go?

I had in my mind that it could alienate the relationship but I didn't have in mind that it would be an actual red flag, procedural or otherwise.
 
purple said:
Your friend also has to remember that any legal IP protection is useless unless you have lots of money to defend it in court.
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@Purple

Is this you Purple, before you grew up to get a capital P !

I once worked with a technology/process for a large multi-national. The technology had been developed by a small company which had no money to defend it in court, so they didn't. They let the big boys use it. Then after several years when it had become an essential part of their work for a number of multi-nationals they sued. It is a lot easier to sue than defend. Of course it was settled out of court so no one knows what the result was, but the developers were going around with a big smile on their faces.
 
cremeegg said:
@Purple

Is this you Purple, before you grew up to get a capital P !

I once worked with a technology/process for a large multi-national. The technology had been developed by a small company which had no money to defend it in court, so they didn't. They let the big boys use it. Then after several years when it had become an essential part of their work for a number of multi-nationals they sued. It is a lot easier to sue than defend. Of course it was settled out of court so no one knows what the result was, but the developers were going around with a big smile on their faces.
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Strategic patience, a nice display of playing the long game there.
Easier to sue than defend that's an interesting insight I hadn't heard before.
 
cremeegg said:
@Purple

Is this you Purple, before you grew up to get a capital P !

I once worked with a technology/process for a large multi-national. The technology had been developed by a small company which had no money to defend it in court, so they didn't. They let the big boys use it. Then after several years when it had become an essential part of their work for a number of multi-nationals they sued. It is a lot easier to sue than defend. Of course it was settled out of court so no one knows what the result was, but the developers were going around with a big smile on their faces.
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Yes, that was me. T'was only a pup back then.
 
Horatio said:
Fully agree with the accountability up the chain you outlined, I also accept that many of the potential ideas are out there already but I don't fully understand the red flag component you described.

For example if I approached the LEO you work with & requested an NDA in good faith what about the request would raise that red flag?
How might the discussion about the NDA around the LEO commitee table go?

I had in my mind that it could alienate the relationship but I didn't have in mind that it would be an actual red flag, procedural or otherwise.
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Most grants come with conditions, for example, the use of a mentor from Leo to support the application, training courses for the business owners/management etc and the NDA could prevent their effective use. In addition, this is taxpayers money and if the application process cannot be seen to be clear, transparent and fair, (and an NDA would/could prevent that) it wouldn't be approved. Indeed, it's unlikely it would even reach the committee.
 
I have some dealings with EI on grants and the confidentiality of background IP is very important. The heads of terms with EI will protect the know how you bring to the table for funding and EI cannot use the information for their own gain. EI will appoint an advisor who will talk through all these complex issues before anything is committed.

And I am sure you can bring an NDA with you for the initial meetings but you can probably talk on the process without mentioning what it is exactly. I have developed a machine that uses water to remove excess carbon dioxide from the atmosphere and I need money to build a prototype beside the local lake…. Nowhere do you say what the technology is but I bet EI would keep talking to you.
 
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