Neighbour Problem

Hi all,

Any advice on the below would be appreciated.

Our neighbour has caused us endless problems since we moved into our house last year. She is living by herself, moved in shortly before we did, and appears to have mental health issues. We have involved the gardai and sent a solicitor's letter previously but after a lull of over 6 months she is back to her old ways. While we have had more serious issues with her the main thing now is knocking on our bedroom wall when we get up in the morning no matter how little noise we make. Not sure what we can do.

Btw she has a previous history with neighbours and we did try to talk to her and her mother but no engagement. We also got some extra soundproofing in our room.

Could you contact the public health nurse for the area- maybe she needs to have her medication adjusted. Otherwise can you report the noise issue to the council and contact the Garda again re the noise.

Feemar5 said:

Could you contact the public health nurse for the area- maybe she needs to have her medication adjusted. Otherwise can you report the noise issue to the council and contact the Garda again re the noise.

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I agree with the above they also need to be very careful in there dealings with her,

Thanks for your replies, to give a bit more background, there were more serious issues the time I went to the gardai, they said they would call up to her mother (her mother bought the house for her and I believe she was living with her before there were a couple of incidents) and even though I followed up multiple times they never got back to me on it. The council were of no help the last time I contacted and basically said there is nothing we can do unless the noise got a lot more serious and we could record it happening which we have tried and will try again. I thinking is if I can get recordings I will go the civil case route, I have everything detailed from when it started with dates, times and type of disturbance so I have most of teh work done.

How would I go about contacting the public health nurse? Would they not just tell me to get lost that these are private matters?

I'd keep reporting to the Gardaí. There are numerous cases of individuals causing serious harm/death to neighbours/own families on the news at the moment.

Is she acutely unwell or chronically unwell/under treated for her mental health problems?
1) Contact Gardai and say you feel unsafe- state her mental health issues are not being addressed and she could benefit from a mental health assessment. They can instigate this under the Mental Health Act.
2) Speak to the mum- encourage her to get help via MH services or re-engage with them.
As a psychiatric nurse- she is probably psychotic- with paranoid ideas. You need to be wary!

Thanks again for the comments.

I spoke with her mother when it happened first and we had a very civil conversation, offered her my mobile number but she wouldn't take it and then wouldn't engage again after which was very disappointing as I would have liked to have discussed doing things around soundproofing etc.

I don't know if her mental health issues are being addressed at all but I presume she has been diagnosed with something as there is definitely a lot of paranoia. She gets worse when there is some slight level of engagement like just seeing her at the door when I drive in the driveway. The mother does collect her every Friday evening and she seems to stay with her until Sunday evening so at least we have some respite.

I was thinking of going down the route of the civil case, inform the gardai I am doing this so it is back on their radar. What I am hoping is this opens up some level of mediation and gets the mother to face reality. What are your thoughts?

The Gardai can't do much other than have a chat. In most cases they'll do nothing as it's a civil matter, they don't have authority to do much more than ask the offender to stop unless it escalates into something much worse. See here for details on Noise Regulations, you can seek an order in the District Court, but I've no idea how successful such actions are.

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Write to the local Superintendent by name giving all the details and describing its impact on you. Simply ringing the station may not get the problem the attention it deserves.

The Guards won't care about a civil case, it has nothing to do with them.

Just bear in mind that you will have to live with the outcomes of any actions you take and be prepared for what that might mean for you. This is not to deter you from taking action, just a word to the wise.

The legal framework in Ireland for noise disturbance is extremely weak. The only route is a civil case but this will cost you and can be hard to prove.

I would write to the local Garda Superintendent outlining the issue. They won't do anything but it will help bolster your civil case.

In the meantime keep a written record of everything, no matter how small.

Leesider32 said:

While we have had more serious issues with her the main thing now is knocking on our bedroom wall when we get up in the morning no matter how little noise we make.

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Personally I'd be tempted to just knock back (for a few days) to see if this discouraged her. I'd stop tiptoeing around anyway.

Pinkpanter said:

Is she acutely unwell or chronically unwell/under treated for her mental health problems?
1) Contact Gardai and say you feel unsafe- state her mental health issues are not being addressed and she could benefit from a mental health assessment. They can instigate this under the Mental Health Act.
2) Speak to the mum- encourage her to get help via MH services or re-engage with them.
As a psychiatric nurse- she is probably psychotic- with paranoid ideas. You need to be wary!

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As a psychiatric nurse, I am not sure you should be diagnosing people as psychotic with paranoia episodes just because the OP says she APPEARS to have mental health issues.

OP, you seem to suggest that sending a solicitors letter worked last time for a period or at least got her mother engage briefly. Why not try it again and then go down civil case route if that doesn't work. Or unfortunately and I know it is not fair, consider moving if possible.

Can you change rooms so that you are not on 'that' side of the house ?

Just a few thoughts.

EVIDENCE.

This is really messy from an evidentiary point of view.
I suggest OP now keeps a daily diary or log of everything that goes on.
Write down what happened and note date and time.
Sound and video recordings would also help where relevant.
Make your notes as contemporaneous as is possible.

PSYCHIATRIC ELEMENT.

Nobody can assert the presence of a psychiatric condition by plain and unqualified observation of the subject and there lies a big problem.
A person may be psychiatrically ill. Alternatively, they might not have a diagnosable psychiatric condition but could just have a personality that is atypical, obnoxious or just downright obstreperous.

I think that the public health nurse has no function here at the behest of the public.
I would persist with Gardai whenever things get out of hand.
This creates a record of complaints that can be referred to in court if required.

CRIMINAL LAW.

Offhand, the only thing that occurs to me is to formally report the neighbour for harrassment under section 10 of the NFOAP Act 1997.
Follow this link to see the definition of the offence.

CIVIL LAW.

If this goes on over a continuous period of time it could constitute the element of the tort of nuisance that deals with OP's right to basic use and enjoyment of their property. This is fine in theory but probably of no practical use if the neighbour is a conveniently defiant type who would ignore court orders on the civil side. (Ignoring any court orders on the criminal side is a more serious matter).
There would also be the matter of legal costs and the practical difficulties of litigation.

MISCELLANEOUS.

I would regard leaving as a very last resort.
If selling up hope that the neighbour does nothing to make your sale problematical e.g. rendering her greetings to viewers !!.
Interfering with your sale is another problem area and could knock down value.
Finally, I would now avoid all communication with the neighbour - what is not said cannot be quoted.....

P.S. 1
You say neighbour's mother bought the house for her.
I wonder if mother is actually the owner and your neighbour is a tenant.
If so, I would be thinking of attacking [legal sense !] the mother for allowing the continued operation of a nuisance from her property and or failing to abate it.

P.S. 2.
If neighbour is actually a tenant it might also be worth having a chat with THRESHOLD to see what they might add.
LINK https://www.threshold.ie/advice/dea...enancy/antisocial-behaviour-and-noise-issues/

Thanks again for the replies and I think DirectDevil has probably captured all elements so going to answer on those areas:

EVIDENCE - this has all been captured in the manner suggested and it was included with the solicitor's letter.

PSYCHIATRIC ELEMENT - yeah would agree that I can't do much in this area especially as her mother wouldn't engage with me.

CRIMINAL LAW - I will keep them informed as I believe the gardai called to her house about a different issue last summer.

CIVIL LAW - this is the route I would like to explore as I think if I could get into a mediation situation with the mother we might progress to find a suitable solution.

MISCELLANEOUS - we avoid all communication with her and particularly as a male I don't want to be seen as an aggressor. However we do not intend to move either and I would see this as a last resort. I would love to think knocking back would resolve the issue but whereas it might give me some immediate satisfaction I don't think it would help. I think going down the route of putting pressure on the mother is the best option.


On the other areas you mention about tenancy etc. I did check this out but unfortunately she is joint owner with her mother.

Sunny said:

As a psychiatric nurse, I am not sure you should be diagnosing people as psychotic with paranoia episodes just because the OP says she APPEARS to have mental health issues.

OP, you seem to suggest that sending a
solicitors letter worked last time for a period or at least got her mother engage briefly. Why not try it again and then go down civil case route if that doesn't work. Or unfortunately and I know it is not fair, consider moving

I think an psychiatric assessment is warranted. Unfortunately the community has lots of people who have undiagnosed psych issues. Usually the vast majority don’t cause anyone any problems. This is a long standing problem with previous neighbours too! The poster believes s/he has issues and we have not been given all the facts.

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Sunny said:

As a psychiatric nurse, I am not sure you should be diagnosing people as psychotic with paranoia episodes just because the OP says she APPEARS to have mental health issues.

OP, you seem to suggest that sending a solicitors letter worked last time for a period or at least got her mother engage briefly. Why not try it again and then go down civil case route if that doesn't work. Or unfortunately and I know it is not fair, consider moving if possible.

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S/he needs to be assessed for psychotic symptoms. Given that she is causing problems of which we don’t know the
full story. The fact the poster believes she has such problems, it is probably a truthful belief.

You can make a complaint under Section 108 of the Environmental Protection Agency Act 1992 and the Environmental Protection Agency Act (Noise) Regulations 1994. This complaint is dealt with in the District court. The cost is minimal (approx 20 euro) You do not need a solicitor. You can present your own case. I represented myself a number of years ago. The usual outcome is that you will win the case and the offender will be prosecuted. The judge will then suspend the prosecution for 4 weeks and tell the offender to meet with you and to rectify the noise problem to your satisfaction and ask you both to return to court to check that the issue is solved. The case will then be cancelled. A day in court might change the neighbours bad behaviour.

bstop said:

You can make a complaint under Section 108 of the Environmental Protection Agency Act 1992 and the Environmental Protection Agency Act (Noise) Regulations 1994. This complaint is dealt with in the District court. The cost is minimal (approx 20 euro) You do not need a solicitor. You can present your own case. I represented myself a number of years ago. The usual outcome is that you will win the case and the offender will be prosecuted. The judge will then suspend the prosecution for 4 weeks and tell the offender to meet with you and to rectify the noise problem to your satisfaction and ask you both to return to court to check that the issue is solved. The case will then be cancelled. A day in court might change the neighbours bad behaviour.

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Thanks bstop, what kind of evidence did you require for this?

Introduction:- I can empathise with Leesider's32 problem. About 30 years ago a lady in her 20's moved in next door with her mother. They were the days of no mobile phones and one car per couple with soaring and more soaring interest rates. People with mortgages back then had serious problems meeting monthly payments. Anyway, I digress and back to my neighbour. Our landline was ex-directory and after she asked we gave our number to her in case she had any fears. Her mother (no spring chicken) remained at home all day long and used to call to see my wife for a daily natter and in those days exchange recipes etc (I can see some of our modern female contributors here rolling their eyes upwards at this point). So, we now had better neighbours than before - no, no, no and not a bit of it.

Our old Ford Escort was too loud for our new neighbours when starting each morning. They wanted us to upgrade and we could barely afford to run the old car. Our toothing crying children caused some annoyance to them. Our barking dog (it was the dog of another neighbour, but we were soft targets). Visitors to our house according to our new neighbours were sometimes parking outside their house and making too much noise by their low talking. Our new neighbours would complain about the fluidity of water as far as we were concerned. They "attacked" our young daughters because the stabilising wheels of their new bikes were making too much noise on the road.
Our other neighbour's dog was barking at midnight and our new neighbour rang our house at 2.30am to complain about what they thought was our dog. Bhí sin an focal deireannach. It was now time to terrorise the terrorist.

Retaliation:- 1. At 3.00am I rang our new neighbour to inform her that the barking dog was not ours. She complained that it was 3.00am and how dare I contact her at that time. I pointed out to her she had no problem ringing me 30 mins earlier (and us with young children). She reported my call to Telecom Eireann as a nuisance call and she also informed the Gardaí that she now felt mentally threatened by the Leprous One.

2. Gardaí visited me, but left with a different point of view after I suggested that she press charges against us and I would look forward to my day in court.

3. She accosted our young children almost daily over the noise from their bikes, other toys and their so called loud chatter. I button-holed her one day when she returned from work and informed her that if ever in the future she approached my children, I would report her to whatever agency.

4. Late at night and early mornings she banged the wall of her bedroom with (I presume) was a shoe. She bad-mouthed me with those who were still friendly with her.

5. I am not a good sleeper and I heard the top being removed from our metal bin (remember those!) and I saw her tipping the contents of the bin on the road before she scurried back into her driveway. She didn't realise I saw her.

6. Things were (and in many instances still) screwed up in Ireland. She reported us for the noise.

7. There were many other instances e.g. complained that our milkman was making too much noise delivering our early morning milk.

8. She complained about any external work by local authorities, ESB, Telecom etc on the road. Furthermore, she was moaning about children playing on the nearby green area.

I am not a psychiatrist and (unlike her) hold no educational degrees whatsoever. But, I am a fair-minded man and was not going to give in to a "crazy" runt living next door. I instructed our children to ignore her (and at that stage) her mother as both of them became as annoying as each other. Our lawnmower was making too much noise, the raking of grass was causing offence, our gate opening and closing was disturbing them, even the postman hopping over the low fence between our houses drove her potty. I don't buy in to the suggestions above contacting Gardaí etc as they are rarely interested for a start and have their hands tied. I advised my nearest and dearest to "smile and be a villain" and ignore all complaints from her. She continued banging the bedroom wall with her shoes. In other words, I drove her more crazy by passive resistance.

Eventually (after 2 years), a "For Sale" sign appeared outside her house. Rumour had it that she was marrying a rich Cork man and her mother would be living with the happy couple. The house was sold and we soon had good and friendly neighbours. Her mother died (a magnificent loss!). The newly-wed visited us to complain that none of us turned up at the removal or funeral and she felt dreadfully insulted. My old neighbour's marriage lasted no time; she "didn't consider all the demands and sacrifices of married life."

Leprous Summary:- That runt had no problems (she was a public servant) and I reckon her biggest problem was that she had no problems. My only advice to the Original Poster here is:- Smile and be a Villain and accept no "crap" from his neighbour.