Neighbour built 40sq m Garden Accommodation

A

anxiousannie

Registered User
Messages
7
I'm a regular browser on these forums, but first time posting. Apologies for length of the post, but I'm very stressed over this.
I've been put in a difficult position by my direct neighbour beside us, not attached. We live in a semi detached house in a suburban estate in Dublin, so we have small gardens. My long time neighbour's daughter moved into the house and has now built garden accommodation of 40 sq m, consisting of 2 bedrooms, a bathroom and living area. My problem is that there was never planning permission sought. We were told that they were building accommodation but that it would have no impact on us. Nothing could have been further from the truth. We didn't see plans, nor were we offered.
After the building started, very quickly we were shocked about the size of the imposing structure looking over our garden. We raised these concerns and obviously a row ensued and their foreman insisted that they didn't require PP as they would attach it to the house with perspex, therefore fell within the remit of no PP required. They conceded by reducing the height of the structure and it's now just above garden shed height. Previously, it was blocking our evening sunglight.
Our problem is that now 2 adults and a child have moved into the construction, we can hear their noise in our kitchen. They have put double doors overlooking our kitchen and garden. When we are outside we can hear them talking inside, this will not bode well for the summer. Also, they must have had other kids in, but it sounded like a bass drum in our kitchen.
My understanding of the law is that anything over 25sq m in the garden, requires PP. Any garden room that is lived in requires PP and finally any extension of 40sq m, must match the finish of the already existing house.
We've been put in a incredibly difficult position as when our concerns were initially raised, I was blamed as a trouble maker. I had a good friendship with the girl's mother which is now on tender hooks. We're in a rock and a hard place. I don't believe that I should have to live with the noise and impact on privacy. They are adamant they don't require PP and I'm being difficult. We can address the privacy issue by raising our fence, but what about noise? Do we have any rights here?
Can anyone please advise on how I should proceed and if my assumptions of PP law are in fact correct? Will this impact the value of our own property as if this is not resolved long term, we are thinking of selling.
Thanks for reading.
 
This kind of thing is probably going to get more common and if its built legally there is not a lot you can do .what I would do is pop around with a small gift and bury the hatchet and wish them well in there new home, its nice for the young family to have a home of there own this christmas.
 
anxiousannie said:
I'm a regular browser on these forums, but first time posting. Apologies for length of the post, but I'm very stressed over this.
I've been put in a difficult position by my direct neighbour beside us, not attached. We live in a semi detached house in a suburban estate in Dublin, so we have small gardens. My long time neighbour's daughter moved into the house and has now built garden accommodation of 40 sq m, consisting of 2 bedrooms, a bathroom and living area. My problem is that there was never planning permission sought. We were told that they were building accommodation but that it would have no impact on us. Nothing could have been further from the truth. We didn't see plans, nor were we offered.
After the building started, very quickly we were shocked about the size of the imposing structure looking over our garden. We raised these concerns and obviously a row ensued and their foreman insisted that they didn't require PP as they would attach it to the house with perspex, therefore fell within the remit of no PP required. They conceded by reducing the height of the structure and it's now just above garden shed height. Previously, it was blocking our evening sunglight.
Our problem is that now 2 adults and a child have moved into the construction, we can hear their noise in our kitchen. They have put double doors overlooking our kitchen and garden. When we are outside we can hear them talking inside, this will not bode well for the summer. Also, they must have had other kids in, but it sounded like a bass drum in our kitchen.
My understanding of the law is that anything over 25sq m in the garden, requires PP. Any garden room that is lived in requires PP and finally any extension of 40sq m, must match the finish of the already existing house.
We've been put in a incredibly difficult position as when our concerns were initially raised, I was blamed as a trouble maker. I had a good friendship with the girl's mother which is now on tender hooks. We're in a rock and a hard place. I don't believe that I should have to live with the noise and impact on privacy. They are adamant they don't require PP and I'm being difficult. We can address the privacy issue by raising our fence, but what about noise? Do we have any rights here?
Can anyone please advise on how I should proceed and if my assumptions of PP law are in fact correct? Will this impact the value of our own property as if this is not resolved long term, we are thinking of selling.
Thanks for reading.
Click to expand...


anyone who would do this without first consulting a neighbour is not a good neighbour and i would not waste my time trying to be friendly about it , dropping around with cookies is hardly going to force them to demolish what they have built !

its an extrordinarily obnoxious thing to have done , its also very stupid , if they didnt seek planning permission , they havent a leg to stand on , drop down to the local authority office , go to the planning section and find out if they have gotten any sort of planning permission , that info is publically available , you need to be prepared to deal with this head on , otherwise you have to resign yourself to a huge imposition on your surroundings indefinatley

why should you have to sell up and move ?

these are not good neighbours at all

deal with it through official channels
 
A very rosy summary there Pat but not realistic for Annie in her current situation.

My understanding is that if something is built without the proper PP, then it can be knocked. I sympathise with your position and certainly wouldn't like it to happen in my area. The neighbours have been incredibly selfish and ignorant here IMO as they ploughed ahead with this without really considering you beforehand. Build it and be damned seems to have been their plan.

I would talk to a planning expert and see what is permissable and what isn't. I would also go to the LA planning office and ask to see whether they submitted any plans...doubtful by the sounds of it but worth a try. And while there get the opinion of someone in that office.
So find out what case you have first.
And then decide if you want to pursue it and all that will come with...major rows with the neighbour, solicitors and all the hassle/costs that come with that lot. If it was me, I would pursue it if I had the ground to do so. Perhaps get someone else to lodge the planning objection who lives a bit further away and so take yourself out of the firing line?

Whatever you decide, best of luck with it all and hope you find some peace of mind.
 
Hi Annie,

So two totally different views already.

First of all, you need to find out for definite if planning permission was required for what they have done. Pay a few hundred euro and get a professional opinion. From what you have said I suspect that planning was not required, but you need to know for certain for your own peace of mind.

Secondly kids being noisy may not be something you are accustomed to in the estate but if we are talking about kids playing during the day or evening you cannot really expect to be able to object. If we are talking about teenagers playing music loudly at night that is different.

They changed their plans at your request to reduce the height to just over a garden shed. So they made an effort to meet your concerns.

Moving to avoid the situation may land you with worse neighbours. You could look at some type of noise insulation as a practical option.

Dont let this issue get blown out of proportion.
 
I don't believe anyone would spend a lot of money on an extension with out knowing the planning rules there was some compromise there but not enough for OP, its not an ideal situation but its completely out of necessity I would say.
 
I suspect that it will turn out that they can build the structure without PP but that it can't be used as sleeping accommodation without PP (it could be used as a home office or similar).
 
My understanding is its an extension on to the main house that happens to be built in the garden.
 
galwaypat said:
This kind of thing is probably going to get more common and if its built legally there is not a lot you can do .what I would do is pop around with a small gift and bury the hatchet and wish them well in there new home, its nice for the young family to have a home of there own this christmas.
Click to expand...
While I appreciate the moral sentiment, what about the young family now facing permanent noise and the sanctuary of a home being compromised. Would you have such a Christian outlook, if it was 8 foot from your border fence?
 
Attaching to the main house with perspex does not cut it, that does not constitute an extension. Separate garden structures such as this must have full planning permission in order to be used as accommodation.

You should be able to check your LA's planning section online for any permission sought, but from what you have reported they said, it would appear they didn't apply.

This will clearly have an impact on your ability to sell your home in future, and needs to be addressed now.
 
There is nobody going to through that family out of there new home built illegally or otherwise thankfully in this country so I suggest the op just get on with it, don't go spending any money on advisers or solicitors, your only bringing stress on yourself accept your living in a very crowded place and that comes with advantages and disadvantages.
 
galwaypat said:
There is nobody going to through that family out of there new home built illegally or otherwise thankfully in this country so I suggest the op just get on with it, don't go spending any money on advisers or solicitors, your only bringing stress on yourself accept your living in a very crowded place and that comes with advantages and disadvantages.
Click to expand...

Not true, an enforcement order is almost certain to be issued here unless the owners apply for and get retention. Based solely on the OP's description of the construction, they will not get retention and so will be correctly forced to demolish the unit and pay a fine.
 
galwaypat said:
There is nobody going to through that family out of there new home built illegally or otherwise thankfully in this country so I suggest the op just get on with it, don't go spending any money on advisers or solicitors, your only bringing stress on yourself accept your living in a very crowded place and that comes with advantages and disadvantages.
Click to expand...
This is terrible 'advice' and clearly incorrect. Freeman-esque type stuff
 
What good is going to come out of this for the OP, OK so she gets it knocked what than, they have to spend the rest of there lives living there beside neighbours they don't get on with horrible situation.
 
An extension up to 40 m^2 which is not higher than the original house, does not require planning permission.

Arguments may arise around the perspex connection to the rest of the house or the difference in finish. However it does not seem to me from reading your initial post that you are likely to get an enforcement order requiring the building be knocked. An enforcement order requiring a change to the finish or some addition to the perspex connection is hardly worth the effort. However I do think that as it is obviously important to you, that if you get a proper opinion it may set your mind at rest.

I think that you will get little sympathy from ant third party, a family has been housed, a child is playing versus a perceived increase in noise. The underutilisation of the existing housing in Ireland stock is a major contributor to homelessness.
 
galwaypat said:
There is nobody going to through that family out of there new home built illegally or otherwise thankfully in this country so I suggest the op just get on with it, don't go spending any money on advisers or solicitors, your only bringing stress on yourself accept your living in a very crowded place and that comes with advantages and disadvantages.
Click to expand...

even it were a family of mice living in a house where planning permission was neither sought , nor granted , the house - extension would not be allowed to remain standing , who is living in it is irrelevant
 
galway_blow_in said:
even it were a family of mice living in a house where planning permission was neither sought , nor granted , the house - extension would not be allowed to remain standing , who is living in it is irrelevant
Click to expand...

This is simply not true. Certainly there have been a few widely reported cases of enforcement orders being granted which required families to move out and houses to be knocked. There are many more cases where enforcement orders are not granted because of "soft" arguments, such as could be made in this case.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top