Low Fare Airlines
- Thread starter dewdrop
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C
Chocks away
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Excellent idea dewdrop. But the tiara in the overhead locker?
On a related point, why wouldn't the Minister Of Transport support Ryanairs resolution at the AGM that the directors take a big pay cut. They have overseen a massive drop in value in the taxpayers stake in the company and turned down Ryanairs offer of €1.40 a share which at this point is a great deal. I know Michael O Leary is trying to cause mischief but he has got a point.
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While I generally like O'Leary, I often think he should just stick to his knitting. His baiting of various ministers over the years hasnt exactly served him well (didnt get his way on the Dublin terminal for example), so maybe he should consider if theres more than 1 way to bludgeon a cat to death (skinning it doesnt reflect his approach ! 
)
)It may be a great deal financially but is it such a great deal, from a competition basis, if one airline controls so many air routes into & out of Ireland?
In fairness to Ryanair their model is high volume low fares, they point out that they already have monopolies on many routes but dont exploit them by overcharging - they want to fill the plane.
Anyone else think that, for all their .. err.. virtues, Ryanair are reaching the "tipping point" whereby they have become so agressive and anti-service that its starting to outweigh their benefits. I'm talking about the likes of:
- pure stupid baggage rule that each bag must be under 18kg (or whatever), as opposed to an average. (cue frantic re-distribution of weight between bags). Extortionate price of something like €40 per kg over (i.e. nearly cheaper to fire your stuff in the bin rather than pay Ryanair to carry it).
- rigid enforcement of 1 carry on bag policy. Does it really make that much difference if its 2 bags not one (particularly since you're not paying anyone the min wage to move it anywhere). What impact is this having on airport shopping??
- public campaigns of what next to charge for .... the jacks, fat people (ok they are not coming in but its needless antagonising and threatening of the travelling public).
Shouldnt they rename it the Low Fares nil service 1 small carry on bag Airline.
It has started to put me off flying in general, particularly if travelling with kids. Getting to the stage where I'm considering paying more just to avoid the stress.
Anyone else think that, for all their .. err.. virtues, Ryanair are reaching the "tipping point" whereby they have become so agressive and anti-service that its starting to outweigh their benefits. I'm talking about the likes of:
- pure stupid baggage rule that each bag must be under 18kg (or whatever), as opposed to an average. (cue frantic re-distribution of weight between bags). Extortionate price of something like €40 per kg over (i.e. nearly cheaper to fire your stuff in the bin rather than pay Ryanair to carry it).
- rigid enforcement of 1 carry on bag policy. Does it really make that much difference if its 2 bags not one (particularly since you're not paying anyone the min wage to move it anywhere). What impact is this having on airport shopping??
- public campaigns of what next to charge for .... the jacks, fat people (ok they are not coming in but its needless antagonising and threatening of the travelling public).
Shouldnt they rename it the Low Fares nil service 1 small carry on bag Airline.
It has started to put me off flying in general, particularly if travelling with kids. Getting to the stage where I'm considering paying more just to avoid the stress.
Have to concur with Betsy Og - Ryanair does exactly what it says on the tin... and not a jot more!
I do find it low-fares generally, but with all the charges and baggage costs etc, and the airport transfer cost at often akward times, the real price can be quite different.
I also think that they start making their real money the minute you put your foot wrong, and there seems to be a policy to slowly make it easier that you put your foot wrong.
Agree with the point about the airport shopping. I'm surprised that Ryanair hasn't faced protests from some of those airports where there is a higher number/proportion of Ryanair flights. An effective ban on airport shopping bags seems designed to hit the airport as well as the passenger?
Could see through it if the on-board selection was similar to the Airport shops, but its not possible to put that selection of stuff on the flight and alcohol can't be purchased on intra EU flights anyway.
Other than avoiding the weight factor - which must vary hugely and be impossible to guess per plane because passengers may or may not buy things in the airport - it appears to be an illogical over-assertion of a rule for no good reason and a real backward step in terms of customer relations.
Maybe if Ryanair could demonstrate how much fuel it saves, then it might have an explanation. Currently it just seems like the exercise of undue power over air travellers.
I do find it low-fares generally, but with all the charges and baggage costs etc, and the airport transfer cost at often akward times, the real price can be quite different.
I also think that they start making their real money the minute you put your foot wrong, and there seems to be a policy to slowly make it easier that you put your foot wrong.
Agree with the point about the airport shopping. I'm surprised that Ryanair hasn't faced protests from some of those airports where there is a higher number/proportion of Ryanair flights. An effective ban on airport shopping bags seems designed to hit the airport as well as the passenger?
Could see through it if the on-board selection was similar to the Airport shops, but its not possible to put that selection of stuff on the flight and alcohol can't be purchased on intra EU flights anyway.
Other than avoiding the weight factor - which must vary hugely and be impossible to guess per plane because passengers may or may not buy things in the airport - it appears to be an illogical over-assertion of a rule for no good reason and a real backward step in terms of customer relations.
Maybe if Ryanair could demonstrate how much fuel it saves, then it might have an explanation. Currently it just seems like the exercise of undue power over air travellers.
Absolutely agree. Apparently if you don't check in on line now you will be charged €40 to check in at the airport. The last time I tried to use Ryan Air's on line check in facility it wasn't working. Didn't make any difference at the airport, still had to pay. It was only about €6 each then and we were a bit irritated. Imagine how people will feel if they're charged €40, for each member of the family,through no fault of their own.
well the way AL are burning through their cash, that will be the case anyway in a couple of years (if that)
Their margins are small but the volume is huge, tiny savings add up to big differences when you have 60 million passengers per year so yes they will aggressively enforce the rules. And I support it. If making everyone on the plane bring only one hand luggage makes my fare lower, then fine with me. It's not asking a lot to keep your luggage to one bag
ehhh isn't that the way it's supposed to work? You want more, you pay more.
C
Chocks away
Guest
We fly with the cheapest fare. Hope O Leary keeps the Niagara Falls route in mind . Maybe just a teeny weeny bit short on the legroom for a six hour jaunt.
. Maybe just a teeny weeny bit short on the legroom for a six hour jaunt. My basic point is that there are no apparent savings, and all this fussing is counter productive - I'm all for scouring the website to avoid the insurance they add on, online check in, no bags if feasible, and all that fun 'n' games, but what I meant by "tipping point" is that I'm reaching the point where enough is enough. Their annoying bewildering new "rules" appear to an attempt to extort cash, like the examples I gave:
- 1 bag or 2?, does it beepin matter or do you just fancy taking some cash off me?,
- weight per bag???, what if one is under weight and one is over, cant the airline get its head around that??, or is there specific discrimination against bigger luggage size??, or <shock horror> am I a captive consumer about to be preyed upon?
IMHO both of the above are simply barefaced money grabbing, and while I am willing to play by the many rules and the pay more-get more principle, it would be much better all round if the rules made sense.
Rant over. Ferry terminal tomorrow - hurrah !!
My basic point is that there are no apparent savings, and all this fussing is counter productive - I'm all for scouring the website to avoid the insurance they add on, online check in, no bags if feasible, and all that fun 'n' games, but what I meant by "tipping point" is that I'm reaching the point where enough is enough. Their annoying bewildering new "rules" appear to an attempt to extort cash, like the examples I gave:
- 1 bag or 2?, does it beepin matter or do you just fancy taking some cash off me?,
- weight per bag???, what if one is under weight and one is over, cant the airline get its head around that??, or is there specific discrimination against bigger luggage size??, or <shock horror> am I a captive consumer about to be preyed upon?
IMHO both of the above are simply barefaced money grabbing, and while I am willing to play by the many rules and the pay more-get more principle, it would be much better all round if the rules made sense.
Rant over. Ferry terminal tomorrow - hurrah !!
It's all about choice and eliminating unnecessary costs.
20 years ago you could bring 40kg of luggage and get a big dinner on a flight to london but the fares were ridiculous.
Someone then realised that cutting out the dinner and 40kg luggage allowance made air travel affordable and passengers voted with their feet.
I like the option of being able to hop on a plane for a 2 day trip with just hand luggage and paying €50 return.
I think RyanAir can be great value for money if you get your timing right. For example, I recently booked flights to Stansted in August for €40 per head including all charges.
On the other hand, they will really scr*w you if they know they have you over a barrel. I got caught in a snarl up on the M50 last year and missed an Aer Lingus flight to Manchester. The later Aer Lingus flight was booked out and I ended up paying €450 to RyanAir for two one way flights.
Overall, I think they are consistent in offering a 'no frills' service at generally low prices, but at times I feel they take it to extremes and seem to regard it as part of their job description that they should be as rude as possible to their customers, just in case anyone might get the wrong idea and think that they actually care about customer service or trying to engender customer loyalty.
And I find it particularly annoying the way in which more and more items are being removed from the basic 'headline' fare and charged as add-ons. The move to having only online check-in may lose them some non computer savvy customers, but I guess it's an easy way for them to reduce the number of older passengers who might be slower getting on and off the planes and hence delay their turnaround times.
I had a recent encounter with them that I found somewhat frustrating, but not really all that surprising. Last February, I booked flights to Portugal travelling later this month and I didn't book any checked luggage at the time. We subsequently decided that we would like to bring at least one checked bag and I tried to change my booking online. When I tried to make the change, I was told that we would no longer be able to check in online if we added a checked bag.
I went through their FAQs several times and couldn't find anything that advised what this would cost. So I had no choice but to call them (on a premium rate line) if I wanted to make the change.
I did this and was told that it would cost €40 per head to check in at the airport if we wanted to add checked baggage at this stage. Needless to say, we have decided that we will make do with our carry on luggage.
Overall, I probably fly with Ryanair more often than Aer Lingus, because their fares tend to be lower. But it's never that enjoyable an experience and I will generally be prepared to pay a bit extra to travel with Aer Lingus, if they offer a roughly equivalent flight.
Homer
On the other hand, they will really scr*w you if they know they have you over a barrel. I got caught in a snarl up on the M50 last year and missed an Aer Lingus flight to Manchester. The later Aer Lingus flight was booked out and I ended up paying €450 to RyanAir for two one way flights.
Overall, I think they are consistent in offering a 'no frills' service at generally low prices, but at times I feel they take it to extremes and seem to regard it as part of their job description that they should be as rude as possible to their customers, just in case anyone might get the wrong idea and think that they actually care about customer service or trying to engender customer loyalty.
And I find it particularly annoying the way in which more and more items are being removed from the basic 'headline' fare and charged as add-ons. The move to having only online check-in may lose them some non computer savvy customers, but I guess it's an easy way for them to reduce the number of older passengers who might be slower getting on and off the planes and hence delay their turnaround times.
I had a recent encounter with them that I found somewhat frustrating, but not really all that surprising. Last February, I booked flights to Portugal travelling later this month and I didn't book any checked luggage at the time. We subsequently decided that we would like to bring at least one checked bag and I tried to change my booking online. When I tried to make the change, I was told that we would no longer be able to check in online if we added a checked bag.
I went through their FAQs several times and couldn't find anything that advised what this would cost. So I had no choice but to call them (on a premium rate line) if I wanted to make the change.
I did this and was told that it would cost €40 per head to check in at the airport if we wanted to add checked baggage at this stage. Needless to say, we have decided that we will make do with our carry on luggage.
Overall, I probably fly with Ryanair more often than Aer Lingus, because their fares tend to be lower. But it's never that enjoyable an experience and I will generally be prepared to pay a bit extra to travel with Aer Lingus, if they offer a roughly equivalent flight.
Homer
Dewdrop..because they are spoilt brats who love themselves waaaaaaaaaaay too much.
Michael O'Learys suggestion was correct. Shareholders at the end of the day own the company and they elect a board etc. It just goes to show why its not a good idea to have government interference in running a company thats suppossed to be making a profit.
the company is doing badly their pay should be cut. Not much point paying them a big salary and the company going bust.
I normally try to keep away from Ryanair, to much hassle.
I just tried to fly Cork to Newcastle. Ryanair do; Cork - Dublin and Dublin - Newcastle; but you cannot book through as one booking, all taxes and charges are applied twice, also the connection flight is not one of the cheaper flight, the result is about €566 return. not exactly a cheap airline, I could have a holiday for a week in Spain etc for that including flights.
I also picked up a brochure in the airport for Jet2.com quoting Cork Newcastle €38.99 single. When I did a mock booking it came to €254 rtn.
This one has gone to the Advertising Standards
I just tried to fly Cork to Newcastle. Ryanair do; Cork - Dublin and Dublin - Newcastle; but you cannot book through as one booking, all taxes and charges are applied twice, also the connection flight is not one of the cheaper flight, the result is about €566 return. not exactly a cheap airline, I could have a holiday for a week in Spain etc for that including flights.
I also picked up a brochure in the airport for Jet2.com quoting Cork Newcastle €38.99 single. When I did a mock booking it came to €254 rtn.
This one has gone to the Advertising Standards
Like some other posters, I avoid flying RyanAir where I have any choice. I dislike the whole procedure, from purchase right through to that annoying jingle they play on landing. It seems designed to irritate and offend from start to finish, and to ensure they extract as much from you as possible. I will always check though, if the price of the ticket is truly, significantly, cheaper then I will book them (I am not that precious and I can stick it for an hour though longer than that I tend to find my back hurts from the seats, so the longer the flight the bigger the difference has to be). What I notice is how often there is no point in booking RyanAir. It is quite rare that there is a sufficient difference for it to be worth my while suffering through it especially flying to London. When you add in the awkward baggage and checkin requirements it just makes them less and less attractive.
In defence of the staff will say though I have noticed a spike in customer friendly behaviour from their frontline staff, less surliness, the occassional smile, some acknowledgement of the inconvenience they put me through at one particular checkin and even one particular air hostess that behaved with true consideration towards another passenger, an older lady with mobility difficulties. They have a hard job and the effort that each of these individuals put in to be polite to a customer (not that I am generally a difficult one, I know the drill too well). Hopefully it will spread!
On the original question .. it is a good one. Why were Irish government ministers flown to Limerick on an expensive helicopter to watch a rugby match? There is a very good train service to Limerick now - why could they not have used that since it was a pleasure trip? There has been a definite culture of entitlement among our "ruling" class, an occasional slumming it would do them no harm. They don't need to fly RyanAir though, they should do like the rest of us and shop around
In defence of the staff will say though I have noticed a spike in customer friendly behaviour from their frontline staff, less surliness, the occassional smile, some acknowledgement of the inconvenience they put me through at one particular checkin and even one particular air hostess that behaved with true consideration towards another passenger, an older lady with mobility difficulties. They have a hard job and the effort that each of these individuals put in to be polite to a customer (not that I am generally a difficult one, I know the drill too well). Hopefully it will spread!
On the original question .. it is a good one. Why were Irish government ministers flown to Limerick on an expensive helicopter to watch a rugby match? There is a very good train service to Limerick now - why could they not have used that since it was a pleasure trip? There has been a definite culture of entitlement among our "ruling" class, an occasional slumming it would do them no harm. They don't need to fly RyanAir though, they should do like the rest of us and shop around
I fly quite a lot, around 100 flights a year. If it’s short haul I generally use the cheapest airline but will pay more to save time or get more convenient flight times. I see little or no difference between Ryan Air and Aer Lingus except that Ryan Air know what they are but Aer Lingus still have pretentions that they are in the same league as British Airways or Air France/KLM etc from a service (or basic manners from their staff ) perspective.