So you’re cool with the Chinese and Russians having a veto over when and where we send our troops but you don’t think we should work with the UK, Germany, France, Holland, Belgium and our other EU neighbours?If it was just one or two or even a few hundred that would be one thing but Irish people have a long history of siding with the oppressor when the opportunity arose. From the Irish who fought to keep slavery in the USA to those who murdered their way around the colonies.
I'm sure we've a long history of fighting with the underdog too (did you not see braveheart) e.g. Irish who crossed over and fought with the Mexicans in Texas. The point is that we, as a State, or even in any meaningfully collective way, have never backed the cause of colonialism so why should the State now unnecessarily and unfairly assume a mantle of shame for the actions of other states (or actions by some individual Irish people).
We play our part through the UN, why should we be a lacky for the US under the guise of NATO?
Come on Purple, your arguments are good enough that you don't have to resort to quoting a muppet like Ian O'Doherty! The guy is an idiot of the highest order. You might as well have used Brendan O'Connor!
Those few words bestow on the article in question all the gravitas and credibility it deserves. Filed [broken link removed]From Ian O'Doherty in todays Indo...
Thanks, but do you disgaree with his point; "So, let's get this straight -- a bunch of LBGT rights activists are happy to stand shoulder to shoulder with the party which has branded homosexuality a moral perversion which can only be dealt with by execution?"
I agree with all of that.No, these marches always attract weirdos who haven't got a clue what they are marching for. Same with every protest march I have ever seen.
I disagree with him about hating Israel and loving Gaza. I neither love nor hate either of them. Just because I disagree with alot of Israels actions and policies doesn't mean I hate them. There are plenty of people who live in Israel who disagree with the road they are going down. Doesn't mean I don't recognise the all good in Israel or that I hate them. Just because I am not Jewish and live In Ireland doesn't mean I don't have a right to voice an opinion without bing called a Israel hating, Hamas loving, terrorist sympathiser. Just as people here who support Israel no matter what are arab hating, zionist warmongers.
It is true that hundreds of thousands of Irishmen have served as the cannon fodder of imperialist Britain down the centuries, but how many of these unfortunate young men would have preferred to remain at home tending farms, raising families, working at a trade or teaching school?During the height of the colonial era we were part of the UK and Irish men went to the colonies in their droves to crack heads and stamp on the natives. Look at the role of Michael O'Dwyer (a Tipperary man) and Brigadier-General Reginald Dyer (Indian born of Irish stock, educated in Cork) in the Jallianwala Bagh massacre (the bit in the film “Gandhi” when the British Army opened fire with machine guns on a civilian crowd).
There are dozens, if not hundreds, of examples of Irish men committing the most horrendous acts all over Africa and India. ....
It is true that hundreds of thousands of Irishmen have served as the cannon fodder of imperialist Britain down the centuries, but how many of these unfortunate young men would have preferred to remain at home tending farms, raising families, working at a trade or teaching school?
The reality for a lot of them was they either took the king's shilling or starved and have their families starve. They were the dis-enfranchised majority, slaves in their native country (no vote, no property, no livestock, no religion, no land, no education, no language, no prospects) who in order to survive, joined the British army.
This seems to have been a tactic generally employed by the British and its directly employed terrorist squads, including the Black & Tans and Auxiliaries and not an isolated army incident attributable to O'Dwyer or Dyer (Anglicised form of O'Dwyer).... Look at the role of Michael O'Dwyer (a Tipperary man) and Brigadier-General Reginald Dyer (Indian born of Irish stock, educated in Cork) in the Jallianwala Bagh massacre (the bit in the film “Gandhi” when the British Army opened fire with machine guns on a civilian crowd)...
It is true that hundreds of thousands of Irishmen have served as the cannon fodder of imperialist Britain down the centuries, but how many of these unfortunate young men would have preferred to remain at home tending farms, raising families, working at a trade or teaching school?
The reality for a lot of them was they either took the king's shilling or starved and have their families starve. They were the dis-enfranchised majority, slaves in their native country (no vote, no property, no livestock, no religion, no land, no education, no language, no prospects) who in order to survive, joined the British army.
My great Uncle fought in the civil war. He was one of the men who occupied the Four Courts and started the whole thing off. He had been shot twice during the war of independence. He used to tell stories about how the younger guys (like him) would vomit and sometimes cry when British soldiers were being tortured to death. He also spoke of the way they tried to strike terror into informants by killing them in front of their families.This seems to have been a tactic generally employed by the British and its directly employed terrorist squads, including the Black & Tans and Auxiliaries and not an isolated army incident attributable to O'Dwyer or Dyer (Anglicised form of O'Dwyer).
The British murder squads (a combination of RIC and Auxiliaries) entered Croke Park on 21/11/1920 and murdered 14 unarmed civilians, including Michael Hogan, a Tipperary footballer, (the bit in the film “Michael Collins” when the British terrorists opened fire on a civilian crowd). Later that night three unarmed prisoners who were being tortured in custody were shot dead by their British torturers.
Yep, just like everyone else. In fact the Brits were about the best of them. But them again for most people in Ireland at the time being British and being Irish was just about the same thing.So it seems that in 1919-1920, in both India and Ireland, the British colonists had a generalised shoot to kill policy in place, which their terrorist police and army employees used to murder unarmed civilians.
we did not take over any other country by force or enslave their people!QUOTE=mathepac;1047801]
I'm proud of being Irish and living in a republic but this guff that we are somehow more noble and morally entitled than Britain or anyone else is sickening.
we did not take over any other country by force or enslave their people!
Thats what makes us more morally entitled.
Yes we did. We were part of the UK during the high point of the colonial era from 1860 to 1910. The fact that we are now an independent country doesn't mean that we get to ignore that. The Brits and the French haven’t colonised anyone since the 1920's either. Does that mean that they get to ignore their own history?
The Belgians haven’t colonised anyone since their King did so in the 1880’s. Does that mean they get to ignore the hundreds of thousands of Congolese that were butchered and starved by Belgians there up ‘till nearly 1920?
Our holier than thou attitude is just another form of Jingoism.
That is the most utterly ridiculous position I've ever heard anyone adopt.... Our holier than thou attitude is just another form of Jingoism.
That is the most utterly ridiculous position I've ever heard anyone adopt.
Between the act of union in 1800 and our winning the war of independence 120+ years later, do you have any idea how many armed insurrections, popular non-armed uprisings, protests and political agitations there were in order to try to boot the Brits out and achieve self-determination for what had been referred to as the Kingdom of Ireland prior to 1800?
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