Inheritance - delaying inheritance due to PIA?

Discussion in 'Wills, inheritances and gifts' started by CaraRua, 27 Jun 2018.

  1. CaraRua

    CaraRua Registered User

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    There are five equal beneficiaries to a will - all siblings. The estate is mainly just a house and the will states it is to be sold and divided equally. Executors are two of the siblings.

    One beneficiary has a PIA that won’t be finished until 2020. They have requested that the house is not sold until then, to protect their inheritance. They have suggested renting the house in the meantime.

    Do the other beneficiaries have to agree to this? From the PIA point of view is the beneficiary deemed to have inherited from the date of death of the parent, or from the date the proceeds are actually divied up?

    One beneficiary is against the idea (sell while the market is buoyant), one (an executor) is happy to go along with it, I have no idea about the other two beneficiaries yet.

    Can anyone advise from financial and legal points of view, what happens in this sort of a situation.

    Thanks.
     
  2. john luc

    john luc Frequent Poster

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    whether you sell or not it's the date of death that has determined you all as owners of the asset
     
  3. CaraRua

    CaraRua Registered User

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    Thanks for the reply. So whether the house is sold over the next few months and the proceeds divided up, or it is sold in two years time - he is equally liable?

    I am clueless about this to be honest, this curveball was only thrown at us last night.
     
  4. john luc

    john luc Frequent Poster

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    I presume PIA is personal insolvency agreement. If so then he has inherited an asset in the form of a part ownership of the house. he or she needs to deal with whatever the terms of the agreement is.
     
  5. john luc

    john luc Frequent Poster

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    if they were to refuse the inheritance then it would go back as a portion to be eventually divided between the other beneficiaries but the creditors could challenge this and you all could end up with a lot of legal headaches.
     
  6. CaraRua

    CaraRua Registered User

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    I very much doubt he will refuse the inheritance.

    If he doesn’t declare the fact that the inheritance is on the horizon, rents the house and says nothing? (Which is basically what he is suggesting).
     
  7. mf1

    mf1 Frequent Poster

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    "the inheritance is on the horizon"

    Its not. Its here, its real and tangible.

    If he chooses to lie about his affairs ( and this would be classed as a prospective asset) , he is on serious risk of his whole PIA going up in flames

    I imagine he is not the first to think that conveniently ignoring/ forgetting assets is in any way compatible with getting a break from his creditors.

    mf
     
  8. CaraRua

    CaraRua Registered User

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    Thanks. It is a very difficult position to have been put in - to become complicit in a lie and enable the beneficiary to avoid his responsibilities, or to be the one who pushes to have the house sold as per the will and risk siblings turing against you.
     
  9. john luc

    john luc Frequent Poster

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    there is really no issue with the terms of the will so just go with it. your other beneficiaries has to deal with his PIA and even if ye decide to not sell he still has to deal with the fact he has an asset.
     
  10. CaraRua

    CaraRua Registered User

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    Can the executors rent the property out if not all beneficiaries are in agreement?
     
  11. PaddyBloggit

    PaddyBloggit Frequent Poster

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    seems to be fairly clear ... no mention of renting it out until the cows come home.

    Follow the terms of the will.. sell the property and distribute the proceeds.

    The benficiary with PIA issues are their own issues to sort.
     
  12. Jim2007

    Jim2007 Frequent Poster

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    It is not up to the beneficiaries, it is up to the executors to carry out the terms of the will. You should also keep in mind that colluding with the beneficiary to help him defraud his creditors could have serious consequences for the executors as well.
     
    DeeKie likes this.
  13. CaraRua

    CaraRua Registered User

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    We are neither the executor nor the beneficiary with PIA issues. My husband is a beneficiary, who feels he is now caught between a rock and a hard place. Thank you all for helping to give us clarity on the situation. All he wants is the house to be sold as per the will, and the proceeds split equally. He has no interest in being caught up in a web of deceit. But that’s families for you.
     
  14. PaddyBloggit

    PaddyBloggit Frequent Poster

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    But he's not... will states that house is to be sold and proceeds divided. Your husband's hands are tied in this matter... no renting just a sale as per will.

    The person involved in PIA is asking others to commit fraud with him. Put pressure on to get the house on the market and sold asap.
     
  15. john luc

    john luc Frequent Poster

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    can be a testing time but best advice I can give is find a conversation that leaves you all still talking to each other when all this is completed.
     
  16. LDFerguson

    LDFerguson Frequent Poster

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    I think it might make the conversation a little bit easier if you explain to the person that whether or not the house is sold now or in 2020, it doesn't make a blind bit of difference. He has inherited a share of a house. It's worth €X so he has an asset worth €X. If the asset is sold, he has cash of €X. Either way he has €X and delaying the sale of the property doesn't change this.
     
  17. Jim Stafford

    Jim Stafford Frequent Poster

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    mf1 has elegantly summed up the position. if the debtor swore his Prescribed financial Statement when he know was entitled to an inheritance he has committed a serious offence. He should make an immediate disclosure to his PIP so that the PIA can be varied. If he does not, and a creditor finds out about it in, say 5 years time, the whole PIA will collapse and he will be back at square one, with his home now having more equity etc.

    There is established case law that an insolvent debtor cannot "disclaim" or "renounce" an inheritance. He must take it and make it available.

    Jim Stafford
     
  18. demoivre

    demoivre Frequent Poster

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    What happens if the house doesn't sell before the beneficiary exits the PIA in 2020? How is that dealt with in a PIA ?
     
  19. Jim Stafford

    Jim Stafford Frequent Poster

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    The debtor could possibly "sell" his interest in the property to his siblings. He might have to give a discount in order to sell it, and the discount would have to be approved by the creditors etc.

    The PIP could possibly apply for a PIA extension.

    Jim Stafford