Inheritance - brother's estate query.

Discussion in 'Wills, inheritances and gifts' started by Siblings, Aug 3, 2015.

  1. Siblings

    Siblings Registered User

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    This is my third attempt at this question so here goes.

    My brother died tragically in Vancouver Canada on 24th December,2014. No Will and no power of attorney. He had just divorced in August, 2014 and it appears that my two sisters and myself are beneficiaries. Two of us live in Ireland and the other sister lives in UK. Both my sisters have social welfare pensions and families. I have a social welfare pension and another small pension and I do not have children. My sister in UK is a UK citizen, my sister in Ireland is an Irish citizen and I have dual Canadian/Irish citizenship but am resident in Ireland.

    We passed all my brothers accounts, shares etc. to the trustees of a Canadian bank to sort out his Estate. They have now asked us for our bank account detail and SIN numbers. I understand the thresholds for siblings is very low and the tax quite high in Ireland. I do not know what it is like in the UK.

    Not having had experience in these matters - should we see a solicitor, an accountant, a tax expert? We need to find out what the most tax efficient way of receiving this money from Canada.

    Your help is much appreciated.
     
  2. Bronte

    Bronte Frequent Poster

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    There is no point opening new threads on the same issue.

    Do you know how much the inheritance is. I imagine that the Canidan law will be the first place you will be taxed. Presumably there is a double taxation agreement with Canada. You have no choice tax wise that I know of to avoid tax. You need an expert on this, try the Canidian embassy for who.
     
  3. Shane_e_

    Shane_e_ Registered User

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    There's no inheritance tax in Canada.
     
  4. Branz

    Branz Frequent Poster

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    Last edited: Aug 3, 2015
    Yes but you could have at least posted a link such as this
    http://turbotax.intuit.ca/tax-resources/inheritance-tax.jsp
    OP: the link above suggests that the Canadian tax authorities will have done the math and gutted the estate of any tax due to them so the issue is how any money you receive here are treated, and likewise in the UK.

    So before you give the bank details , as there is a DTA with Canada
    http://www.revenue.ie/en/practitioner/law/double/double-taxation-agreements.html
    you should establish from the Revenue here what the story is because if the hit is not to your liking you don't have to take the mula.
    This may not be the case here as I expect it all to be cash so just pay the tax and keep going.
    As Bronte has pointed out there is no tax avoidance options at this point so start with the revenue, no point in my mind paying for their advice!!
    Nobody will open a file on this for you for less than 2,500 euro plus VAT.
    The Canadian tax authorities have done all the work.
    The SI is here:
    http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/2004/en/si/0773.html
    Its not the lightest reading you will find but at least you have a document to read.

    Of course find out what the payment will be first before you talk to Revenue
    Hope this helps.
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2015
  5. trojan

    trojan Frequent Poster

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    Do we know roughly how much value is in the Estate as this must be a key factor as to whether you need professional advice.
     
  6. Bronte

    Bronte Frequent Poster

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    In relation to revenue, you'll have to find someone who is aware of this area, and that might take a few phone calls until you find that particular person. And beware, in any case don't ever rely on revenue over the phone.

    If this is any seizable amount of money a few K will be well spent on professional advice. And get the fee in writing in advance !
     
  7. Siblings

    Siblings Registered User

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    Thank for your responses to this query. The websites you provided are very welcome reading. At this point, we do not know how much the inheritance will be. My brother had just sold his house and had put a lot of his savings into Registered Retirement Savings schemes. Sadly he should have moved these out to a RIFF in his 71st year but through illness etc. this was not done. It looks like he will have to pay a lot of tax in Canada.

    My sister in the UK has been advised that she will not have to pay inheritance tax but I understand my sister in Ireland and myself have to pay interitance tax. I have spoken with the Revenue and they tell me there is a double taxation agreement with Ireland. Also, there is no inheritance tax in Canada. They have informed me to notify them when the funds are transferred into our accounts but at this point I have not released my social insurance number nor my bank details.

    I cannot believe that the inheritance tax for siblings in Ireland is so exhorbitant! We are tempted to move over to UK or go back to Canada!!!
    The Siblings
     
  8. Branz

    Branz Frequent Poster

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    Well when the Trotskyites, communists, socialists and far right folk take power after the next election here under the guise of independents, we will be on the boat with you.
    A lot of older folk I know are now getting out of immoveable assets and into cash/liquid assets in anticipation of 10 or so years of middle class focussed austerity at the hands of this mob
     
  9. Siblings

    Siblings Registered User

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    Siblings again. We have been to see a solicitor and I understand that my sister in Ireland and myself have to pay inheritance tax. My other sister who resides in UK does not have to pay inheritance tax. Also when we handed all my brothers's affairs over to the Trustee department of the Canadian bank to sort out his affairs, we forgot to mention that he is a quarter owner of our family home in which I live. My mother left the house to the 4 of us but I have a right to live in it until I die or marry and it does not look like I will be marrying. This means that my brother's share of our family home will be divided between my two sisters and myself and I was shocked to hear that my sister here and myself will have to pay the inheritance tax on his share. The reason being is that I purchased an investment property as a pension when my mother passed away and my sister has her own home but my sister in UK does not have to pay the inheritance tax.

    The solicitor has written to me stating that
    It is likely that a Grant of Administration in my brother's Estate will need to be extracted in Ireland to deal with his share of the
    property. I might also add that the family home is still in my mother's name (she died 1996). We will be paying hige legal bills in Canada and am wondering if the grant of administration on my brother's estate and changing the title deeds will be very costly. Perhaps we should have advised the canadian authorities but unfortunately we never did so.


    Any help you can give us would be greatly appreciated.

    The Siblings
     
  10. Gordon Gekko

    Gordon Gekko Frequent Poster

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    Gas that Revenue are telling people that there's an inheritance tax treaty between Ireland and Canada when there isn't!
     
  11. Siblings

    Siblings Registered User

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    Siblings again. We are now about to receive our inheritance from my brother's estate in Canada. The Canadian dollar is not doing too well against the Euro and it was suggested that we bring the money into Ireland and put it in a Canadian dollar account in an Irish bank and then convert if an when the exchange rate might improve. Is that the best way to go or should we just leave it in Canada for now?
     
  12. Siblings

    Siblings Registered User

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    Two years later. Two senior sisters have inherited from brother's Estate in Canada. We both paid over 70,000 Euro in Capital Gains Tax and now we receive a letter from Revenue advising us we owe another 7,000 Euro in surcharges. This is such a cruel tax. My other sister in UK does not have to pay a penny inheritance tax. As my brother died tragically in Canada, we handed all his affairs over to his bank in Canada CIBC. They tell me that he paid 156,975 dollars final T1 income tax and 9,345 dollars non resident withholding tax. The bank tell me there is no inheritance tax in Canada and that his estate would have been treated as a sale. My brother had just divorced 2 months before he died and the part of the money we inherited was the proceeds of the sale of his home.

    So it seems he was taxed heavily in Canada and we were taxed heavily in Ireland. Does anyone know if there is any way we can claim back any tax. We are writing to the Revenue to see if we can appeal the surcharges.

    Siblings
     
  13. Siblings

    Siblings Registered User

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    any advice on above
     
  14. Joe_90

    Joe_90 Frequent Poster

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    If it’s income tax in Canada then there is probably not much of a refund there.

    If you paid €70k in Capital Acquisitions Tax your inheritance and did not file the return on time then there is a 10% surcharge.

    Given the complex nature of the inheritance you need to be sure of the valuation date which dictates the date for filing the return.
     
  15. Siblings

    Siblings Registered User

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    We got two lots of money. One received in February, 2016 and the other September, 2016. We should have reported the first in October, 2016 and the other October, 2017. Unfortunately we did not file both until December, 2017 and hence we were hit with the surcharge.

    Anyone know if we can claim anything from Canada. The Trustee department of my brother's bank looked after the administration of his affairs. I notice he was hit with charges for late submission in Canada also.

    We are now looking at 77,000 Euro each which is very tough. Something needs to be done to increase the thresholds and decrease the tax rate, especially for Group B people - i.e. Siblings.
     
  16. dub_nerd

    dub_nerd Frequent Poster

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    Won't happen. Just like you, the vast majority of people have no clue about this stuff until it happens to them. There is little hope of concerted lobbying.
     
  17. tedcrilly

    tedcrilly Frequent Poster

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