How do I establish a right of way?

[tirooney]

Hi,
My father has used a laneway beside his house all his life. He is now 75 years of age. He has used the lane to gain access into a field for agricultural purposes. He also has access to this same field through his own farmyard. On this particular lane there are two different private houses and land belonging to four other people. Others on this lane are now disputing my father's right to use the lane saying he made the opening himself. Jealousy would lie behind their accusations. However it is now four people against one. How do we go about proving this lane has been used for the last 60 years at least and that my father has an established rightaway?

Thankyou!

 

[royrogers]

Re: Rightaway

If your father has been using the same right of way for the last 60 years then then the other cannot do anything about it. Your father must be able to prove that he has been using that way for the last 60 years of course.

 

[Marie]

Rightaway

I think the challenge to "prove it" from these four blow-ins is what is troubling the poster's father! How can I "prove" I have walked my dog along the same 'right of way' for the past 14 years if the local Council decide to build across it? That's what's at issue here.

However your dad can satisfactorily "establish" that he has a long-standing right of access via this lane by a combination of his own statement and corroboration by others (e.g. other townspeople/farmers etc.)

Alternatively since they are ignorant arrogant s**ts he could just ignore them and continue to get to his fields as he always has done. If they continue their ill-bred behaviour he or the family could start procedings against them for harassment.

I'm not at all in favour of the "majority rules", one-against-four capitulation. This is bullying, and usually bullies don't stop until you call their bluff. Still my commiserations to this man for his trouble. As Bob Dylan sang, "the times they are a'changin' ".

 

[ClubMan]

Re: Rightaway

Others on this lane are now disputing my father's right to use the lane saying he made the opening himself. Jealousy would lie behind their accusations.

Can you explain how it is that jealousy is motivating their actions?

I think the challenge to "prove it" from these four blow-ins is what is troubling the poster's father!

...

Alternatively since they are ignorant arrogant s**ts ...

...

If they continue their ill-bred behaviour he or the family could start procedings against them for harassment.

...

I'm not at all in favour of the "majority rules", one-against-four capitulation. This is bullying, and usually bullies don't stop until you call their bluff.

On what information do you justify your labelling of these people as "blow-ins", "arrogant s**ts" and engaging in "ill-bred behaviour", "harassment" and "bullying"?!

 

[Vanilla]

The other question is from a very practical point of view- if he already has access to this field from his farmyard, why does he want or need this other right of way to the field? Not getting at you at all, just a query.

 

[90210]

I think it is up to the other party to prove that a right of way does not exist. Since he has had access for a very long period, it should not be too much of a problem to get affidavits from people within the local to back up your fathers ROW. Let them, the other party, do the to the worrying and running, it is up to them to disprove and remove your father's ROW. Make sure he continues to use the ROW and that any obstruction or harassment is reported to the Gardai. This will be invaluable, as aggressors get no favours in court.

or solution B



But if they get shirty I suggest a few baseball bats and a crew of casuals from Brunswick Street to get the point across

 

[Marie]

Re: Rightaway

Can you explain how it is that jealousy is motivating their actions?


On what information do you justify your labelling of these people as "blow-ins", "arrogant s**ts" and engaging in "ill-bred behaviour", "harassment" and "bullying"?!

The information on which I base my response is, as always, in the post to which I am responding, ClubMan! Here's a breakdown:-

(a) the original poster's father has been accessing his fields for decades and the "two who have houses there" and "four others who own land off it" are now (not 10 years, not 20 years, not 30 years, not 40 years.....ago but now, these folks) raising questions about his access. Short-hand from a very busy professional - "blow-ins" - understood by most people as "newcomers, don't know the way things are done, etc. etc." In other words they don't belong to the land; probably don't like country smells and located there from an idealised notion of what "the country" was about.

(b) "arrogant s**ts" and "ill-bred behaviour"; they do not know the law, they do not know how to relate in a civil and neighbourly fashion towards their neighbours. I consider any person (not just this lot) who behave in such a manner "arrogant" and "ill-bred". I avoid them.

(c) however this farmer is (from the original poster's picture drawn with great clarity, ClubMan!) being pressured by these 'others' to access his fields from his own farmyard. Work with me here on exerting a little bit of imagination! He has a farmhouse with a lane running along one side. He has fields at the other side of the lane. A track (established for centuries by his forebears) leads directly into those fields. Or alternatively he could exit the other side of his farmhouse, through the yard, walk down the road, turn left, turn right a quarter of a mile along - and get into his field that way. Are you with me?

(d) last but not least, "harassment" and "bullying". The original poster writes that these folks (we know there are at least 6 of them - probably more!) allege the original poster's father "made that entrance himself". Now we need to exert another little bit of imagination; the posting to AAM Legal thread is because this farmer is concerned he is going to be taken through the courts for trespass, that his knowledge and use of this right of way which saves him time and energy is about to be lost, and that some bright young solicitor will believe the hoard rather than listen to him.

OK?

 

[quarterfloun]

Could the issue be that the farmer is exercising his lawful right of way with a flock of sheep at rush hour when kids are on their way to school? Has he got a big tractor that fires mud everywhere that has set them off? I do not know the situation but having lived next door to "The Addams family" for 5 years I know how difficult things can become. If all parties were to talk this out there may be a compromise - let him establish the ROW legally in return he does not exercise it excessively. FWIW

 

[ClubMan]

Re: Rightaway

The information on which I base my response is, as always, in the post to which I am responding, ClubMan! Here's a breakdown:-

None of your conclusions hold up on the basis of my reading of the original post. You seem to have jumped to a lot of conclusions on the basis of scant or no hard evidence. Perhaps you have jumped to the correct conclusions here but we don't know unless the original poster can clarify.

 

[jhegarty]

Re: Rightaway

won't the blow-ins find it very hard to say he didn't use that entrance 50 years ago....

how would they prove it , I persume they have only lived in the area a few years themselves ...

 

[Marie]

Rightaway

None of your conclusions hold up on the basis of my reading of the original post. You seem to have jumped to a lot of conclusions on the basis of scant or no hard evidence. Perhaps you have jumped to the correct conclusions here but we don't know unless the original poster can clarify.

I'm gratified you don't find my response silly or pedantic. Now that would affect me!