Fair Deal/Nursing Homes Fair Deal............a worked example?

Little Eagret

Registered User
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I am finding the Fair Deal website very tough going and hard to figure out.

My dad is well into his nineties and is now beginning to suffer from dementia, I live far away as do my sister and brother. a nursing home may be on the cards.

he has two houses value 200k each, he has savings of about 350k and a pension of 30 k p.a.

Would he be entitled to anything, under this scheme?
 
If your mother is deceased, your father's assessment would be for €77,550 or cost of care, whichever is the lesser, for 3 years, when his PPR comes out of it and assessment would be €62550 or cost of care whichever is less. As savings decrease etc, this can be reassessed each year. Calcs:
30k pension @ 80% = 24000
350k savings less 36k exempt = 23550
200k 2nd house @ 7.5% = 15000
200k (PPR) @7.5% for 3 years = 15000
Total 77550

It's useful to have this assessment carried out on entry to nursing home as the 3 years starts from then.
 
May I confirm that the family's share then is about 21k pa?
I don't understand your question. The above figures would be your dad's assessed contribution so it would probably be better for your dad to pay the nursing home himself until the assessment comes down to less than the annual costs of nursing care.
 
I'm trying to figure out how it works. Say my Dad went into nursing home next month.fee is 1,000€ p.m , this would be paid out of his own resources, when would Fair Deal kick in?
 
Looks like you will be paying the nursing home in full for at least four or five years and a sizeable proportion thereafter.
 
The FD scheme is there to help people who are asset rich in that their home is is worth a lot but have little cash at hand without having to sell up. So for the first three years all your fathers assets are counted to assess what you can afford. After three years his home is excluded from his assets in assessing him. Your father has about 500k in non-home assets so he will be deemed to be able to afford care until such time that amount is diminished. The figures Slim gave above show what he can afford before and after the home asset is taken into account. Does that make sense ?
 
The FD scheme is there to help people who are asset rich in that their home is is worth a lot but have little cash at hand without having to sell up. So for the first three years all your fathers assets are counted to assess what you can afford. After three years his home is excluded from his assets in assessing him. Your father has about 500k in non-home assets so he will be deemed to be able to afford care until such time that amount is diminished. The figures Slim gave above show what he can afford before and after the home asset is taken into account. Does that make sense ?


Sure what's the level before more liquid assets v home assets are taken into account? The Nursing Home is costing 1k per week. So after 3 years that lump sum of savings he has will be gone down to 200k approx+ there will still be a house? I think I'm having difficulty grasping the concept............in the end you pay for the full cost of care the fair deal is a way of deferring payment until the elder is deceased and then its collect from his estate?
 
I have to say I share your confusion about the whole scheme. We are in the very early days of investigating this, but I was under the impression that an assessment of assets is carried out and that assessment determines how much the patient pays towards their care. So, the nursing home might cost €1k per week, and the patient will be asked to contribute towards that cost, depending on their assets. What happens when all the assets are exhausted? His house isn't worth much at all. My father is relatively young, but now requires 24 hour care following a severe stroke.
 
@Little Eagret. Your dad is relatively well off so your dad will contribute full cost of nursing home care until his assessed contribution drops to below the cost of the care. Helpfully, his main residence will only be included in the assessment for the 1st 3 years. Thereafter, his dwindling savings will move him faster towards the point where Fair Deal will actually start paying towards his care. Given that he is well into his nineties, it is possible he may never actually benefit from FD.
@Andarma. Your dad will be contributing to his nursing home care based on his income and assets. If his assessed contribution falls below actual nursing home cost, FD will pay the difference. If it's more, he will pay actual nursing home cost.

It is a complex scheme for sure. Hope that helps.
 
Hi everyone, new to all of this fair deal and was wondering could you help me. I bought my mothers home and put her on with me. She had no money to buy so i paid all. She has become ill and needs to go to a nursing home. Does anyone know how it will work now? she has no other assets and no money. I am willing to pay but is there a way of reasonably doing it without the house being affected?
 
Are there any experts out there offering a fair deal analysis as a service? It’s incredibly confusing for all.
 
Does anyone know how it will work now? she has no other assets and no money. I am willing to pay but is there a way of reasonably doing it without the house being affected?

If your mother owns half the house, you can pay the 7.5% assessed on her half of the house for each of the first 3 years. Your mother would also contribute 80% of whatever income she has.

Or if you can’t afford to pay the amount assessed on the house, you can avail of the Nursing Home Loan for the 7.5% assessed on your mother’s half of the house for each of the first 3 years. Your mother’s contribution in her lifetime would then only be 80% of whatever income she has.

The borrowed 7.5% annually for the first 3 years on the house would normally then be paid on your mothers passing from the sale of the house. But if you are a ‘’Connected Person’’ and meet certain criteria repayment can be further deferred until you die or sell the house.

Have a look at Repayment of the Nursing Home Loan on page 12/13 here;

https://health.gov.ie/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/Frequently-Asked-Questions.pdf

lots of other questions also answered.
 
I think you've found one here! ;).....meaning twofor1!
I also have question on fair deal - says assessable cash assets include cash transferred to another person within the last 5 years. This may be splitting hairs but does transferred mean the same as gifted. Is there any way around this?
 
I also have question on fair deal - says assessable cash assets include cash transferred to another person within the last 5 years. This may be splitting hairs but does transferred mean the same as gifted. Is there any way around this?
Yes, it amounts to the same thing. Disposal of assets within the past 5 years will be reckoned in the Financial assessment.
 
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