Delays in rolling out vaccine

Paul O Mahoney said:
Comparing a multinational and our hospitals and health service isn't possible as both are completely different.

I don't even know how to respond to the suggestion of getting our health service to " compete" for state contracts the hospitals are owned by the state and their primary role is to treat illnesses not make a profit.
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Most hospitals are not owned by the State. They are funded by the State but they are privately owned. It's not about making a profit, it's about value for money. At the moment there is no incentive for a hospital to be efficient or well run.
 
Paul O Mahoney said:
We've gone off topic.
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Kind of, but the broader structure and structural inefficiencies within the broader health service is and will be the primary driver in delays to vaccinations as more doses become available. Bloated costs and other poor health outcomes are already symptoms of the problem. As things stand there is no incentive to change the status quo and no mechanism to change it even if there was a willingness to do so by the vested interests within the sector.
 
A big disappointment with the delay in producing the astra zenaca vaccine.Luke o Neill was saying that maybe the eu could sue over breach of contract however I doubt that seen as it is a brand new drug and the eu have not approved it yet. If that was the case a drug company could sue a regulator. In any case the astra zenaca share price is actually up today so can't see any litigation on horizon, it would be a very bad precedent anyway when we need these companies to take risks to produce these much needed drugs
 
joe sod said:
Luke o Neill was saying that maybe the eu could sue over breach of contract however I doubt that seen as it is a brand new drug and the eu have not approved it yet.
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The EU & AZ signed a contract, AZ are now saying they will be unable to meet the terms of this contract, so the EU are clearly entitled to sue for breach of contract if they so choose. Whether they will of not is another matter, but even the threat of it may mean they can influence future contracts in the EU's favour.
 
Ceist Beag said:
That sounds about right, given that they have 12 times the population and had an extra month head start.
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If we have administered 170,000 x12.....How does that equate to nearly 6 million vaccinated in the UK. We got our vaccines on the 26th December.
 
Purple said:
In fairness to the HSE etc they can't vaccinate without vaccines.
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I hope that any company producing vaccines will not sell their production to any country who approaches them with a large cheque. I hope the EU have ordered enough, because these companies once they have fulfilled their contract will be free to sell to the highest bidder.
 
@Leo but they also signed contracts with other drug companies like Sanofi. Surely the timeliness of delivery is up to the drug companies I would say, the fact that they did not approve it yet would mean nothing has been breached as delivery has not actually started, might explain why they are doing this now before the eu regulators meeting to approve it. Its just my thoughts I'm no expert, I think they should be cut some slack though, if eu were to try litigation route it would delay other drug companies submitting vaccines, how can you guarantee production of a completely new drug which had to overcome big hurdle in development
 
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Grizzly said:
If we have administered 170,000 x12.....How does that equate to nearly 6 million vaccinated in the UK. We got our vaccines on the 26th December.
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You're forgetting to account for the month head start.
 
joe sod said:
however the timeliness of delivery is up to the drug companies I would say,
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It clearly isn't. Would you sign a contract like that and hand over hundreds of millions in advance without delivery criteria? AZ have themselves acknowledged they will fail to meet the agreed delivery targets.

joe sod said:
how can you guarantee production of a completely new drug which had to overcome big hurdle in development
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Like any development contract, you craft terms based on target date for completion of development.
 
I doubt they signed a concrete delivery schedule for a brand new novel drug. By that rationale no vaccines would be delivered for years because the drug companies would have to ensure that first the regulator's would approve it and secondly they have full production up and running with all the glitches sorted.
 
joe sod said:
I doubt they signed a concrete delivery schedule for a brand new novel drug.
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Why do you think they have said themselves they are going to miss the agreed delivery schedule? The funding the EU gave them in the middle of last year was specifically geared towards supporting the ongoing trials and at accelerating production volumes. When the deal was finalised in August, phase 2 & 3 trials were underway, so AZ should have had a very good handle on timelines from there. Let's not forget AZ's commitment to that deal also got them very valuable indemnities.

joe sod said:
and secondly they have full production up and running with all the glitches sorted.
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That's not how big pharma or any other major producers operate. Production scale is carefully planned along JIT (Just In Time) models to optimise revenue and cash flows.
 
Grizzly said:
If we have administered 170,000 x12.....How does that equate to nearly 6 million vaccinated in the UK. We got our vaccines on the 26th December.
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At roughly the same period after they began vaccinations in the UK, they had administered 1381656 doses (source). We have administered 143000 doses in that period (source). Our rate after roughly 4 weeks is ahead of where the UK was after roughly 4 weeks.
Obviously their rate has gone up now that they have access to the Oxford vaccine but as others have pointed out, we're being restricted in that regard so I don't know what point it is you're trying to make here. The facts seem to show we are performing at least on a par with how the UK was performing when you compare like with like.
 
We really need to stop comparisons, there are so many variables its impossible for any meaningful comparison to be done.

143000 people have now been vaccinated and some have received their second dose.

Obviously we face issues and these were bound to happen we just need to keep going with what we have , hopefully supply will increase and eventually we get the vast number of the population vaccinated in the coming months.

Supply is going to be key.
 
I presume that the first cohort of people in vulnerable groups are harder to get to; the person administering the vaccine has to travel to them. They might only get to two of three care homes a day with a few dozen people vaccinated.

When we start vaccinating less vulnerable groups they will be able to travel to the vaccination center. At that stage the number of vaccines administered per hour will be vastly greater.
 
Purple said:
In fairness to the HSE etc they can't vaccinate without vaccines.
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Yet our minister for health is making announcements, stating that next month they will start vaccinating those over 85. A great man for saying "what they will be doing". Maybe concentrate on the front line staff first minister?
 
Odea said:
Yet our minister for health is making announcements, stating that next month they will start vaccinating those over 85. A great man for saying "what they will be doing". Maybe concentrate on the front line staff first minister?
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I heard him qualifying his statements about the vaccination schedule with the caveat that it is dependent on the availability of vaccines.
 
Purple said:
I heard him qualifying his statements about the vaccination schedule with the caveat that it is dependent on the availability of vaccines.
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So he doesn't really know then. It's like he is constantly "distracting" and talking about what might happen.
 
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