Delaying bank payments by 24 hours would make scammers less effective

Brendan Burgess

Brendan Burgess

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I moved these posts from the thread on the Panorama programme about Revolut - Brendan

A solution, for all banks, would be to offer customers the option that all payments over a certain limit are delayed 24 hours.

If the customer waives that option, then they have no right to refunds.
 
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Brendan Burgess said:
OK, set it up as default and people would have to override it.
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Then people would complain that their house purchase or whatever is delayed due to an anti-fraud delay!

There are hard trade-offs between a smooth customer experience and financial crime prevention.
 
Dr Strangelove said:
Then people would complain that their house purchase or whatever is delayed due to an anti-fraud delay!
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True and agree with the general premise. However what is the limit on inter account transactions via Revolut? (Genuine question)

AIB have a limit on personal accounts of 10k per day, which I assume don't impact a lot of people on a day to day basis.

Completing a house purchase this year, I had to go into the AIB Branch to transfer the remaining deposit (significantly >10k)via a paper form. (To the point that I was super nervous about transferring large amounts of money via a form that I filled out ink wise)

Checks and balances.... which I'm sure are imperfect but there is no way I could do same with Revolut.
 
Wandering_Dazed said:
True and agree with the general premise. However what is the limit on inter account transactions via Revolut? (Genuine question)
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Are there limits for sending a bank transfer?​

Limits depend on destination country and currency

Most currencies have no transfer limits. We’ll show you any exceptions in-app before you send money.
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Brendan Burgess said:
My main account is with AIB and I have found this limit a minor irritation a few times.

And like you, when transferring a large amount in the branch, I was worried that I had put in all the numbers correctly.
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100% agreed! Filling out a paper form with my crappy hand writing... That 10k limit might have contained the loss that the businesses sustained.

Am I correct in saying that AIB caps Business Sepa transfers to 30k per day?

aib.ie

Transaction Limit Information - AIB Internet Banking | AIB

aib.ie aib.ie

Side note in terms of smart device payments they seem to be capped by the bank itself:

 
Wandering_Dazed said:
100% agreed! Filling out a paper form with my crappy hand writing... That 10k limit might have contained the loss that the businesses sustained.
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I've had to do large transfers in branch with PTSB a few times. Tens to hundreds of thousands. In all cases a staff member double checked the form details, a more senior staff member signed off on it, and I was also asked to double check and initial all relevant details. The chances of any mistakes were very low.
 
ClubMan said:
The chances of any mistakes were very low.
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Spot on! I was the same double checking every box, letter and figure.

Which I'm sure we'd agree isn't a thing with Neo/Digital banks whatever you call them. It's just too easy to transfer vast amounts of money across the interweb and it's just gone. With no recourse it seems in certain circumstances, although when you give your keys to your castle financially you are part of the problem.

TLDR a) At least AIB's/others transaction limits might have helped, b) Why did Revolut not flag the transactions and c) If I was scammed I'd from experience, the main banks (AIB/BOI) will deal with it quickly.

Edit: To deal with the erroneous smiley
 
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Brendan Burgess said:
A solution, for all banks, would be to offer customers the option that all payments over a certain limit are delayed 24 hours.

If the customer waives that option, then they have no right to refunds.
Click to expand...
This is what my bank does. Large payments are held for 24 hours, or payments to new payees over a lower amount.
 
Dr Strangelove said:
Then people would complain that their house purchase or whatever is delayed due to an anti-fraud delay!

There are hard trade-offs between a smooth customer experience and financial crime prevention.
Click to expand...
My bank which does this uses SEPA instant, so it's already quicker than, say, AIB without this feature.
 
If there was a general rule that after setting up a new payee customers have to wait 24 hours before being able to pay them, people would just get used to it. Easy, effective & low cost security measure.
 
jim said:
What is SEPA Instant please?
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Payment must go through in 10 seconds or less. If it takes any longer it is deemed as failed. There is/was a limit of 100k per transaction, I assume banks will enforce their own lower limts.
Irish banks are being forced to implement it with the next year.

youtu.be

SEPA Instant Credit Transfer scheme

This short video highlights the benefits and key characteristics of the SEPA Instant Credit Transfer (SCT Inst) scheme. Launched in November 2017, this schem...
youtu.be youtu.be
 
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Wandering_Dazed said:
True and agree with the general premise. However what is the limit on inter account transactions via Revolut? (Genuine question)

AIB have a limit on personal accounts of 10k per day, which I assume don't impact a lot of people on a day to day basis.

Completing a house purchase this year, I had to go into the AIB Branch to transfer the remaining deposit (significantly >10k)via a paper form. (To the point that I was super nervous about transferring large amounts of money via a form that I filled out ink wise)

Checks and balances.... which I'm sure are imperfect but there is no way I could do same with Revolut.
Click to expand...
We have BOI account which allows large payments a day, but for an eft the destination still has to be setup 48hrs and then you have to email in a form, and various calls with different people to confirm are required. It’s a bit of a rigmarole, but we were delighted.
 
tomdublin said:
If there was a general rule that after setting up a new payee customers have to wait 24 hours before being able to pay them, people would just get used to it. Easy, effective & low cost security measure.
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But imagine if your business model revolved around being able to make payments really quickly. In different currencies and to different jurisdictions. And that was literally the main selling point of your product!
 
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