Curious about time off Funerals

This came up recently where I work.

A long serving member of staff (30+ years) lost a parent. A few people went to the funeral which was a fair distance from the office so most of a day off. We mainly work from home so most would have been able to check emails etc by late afternoon. I’m sure some did and some didn’t.

Anyway it was always a given that time off for something like this was not annual leave. This time a request to log it as AL was circulated. I was shocked. It didn’t impact me as I was actually already off that week and didn’t attend the funeral but I’ve done it in the past. Sometimes it’s local and it’s an hour or so off. Others are of course further away.

people generally go if they were reasonably close to the person concerned. And of course if they don’t have commitments that can’t be moved. The benefits of the traditional funerals here is that there is a removal the night before where people can pay respects.

Just wondering if time off for such matters is commonplace or is annual leave the norm? Surely if it’s a couple of hours you make up the time easily and no one bats an eyelid.

In the case of the recent one few attending would be getting paid overtime for instance so a bit of give and take would be expected. We record hours for H&S or whatever reasons but that’s not linked to salary.

I’m not aware of anyone taking advantage and new joiners to the office etc going. Although most of the office did go when a colleague died about a year ago, but we got no memos about that one.

Some companies will have their bereavement policies well documented but paid leave is typically only paid in the case of the loss of a direct family member.

Where the work and workplace are quite flexible and typically allow staff adjust their hours to work around external commitment time for attending things like funerals or other appointments can be accommodated, but that's at the employer's discretion. Expecting that to extend to most of a day off though is pushing it too far and risking restrictions on that flexibility.

Annieindublin said:

We record hours for H&S or whatever reasons but that’s not linked to salary.

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You record them because your employer is legally obliged to do so (Working Time Act)

Was there a removal the night before and could people have gone to that? There is an element of common sense here which most employer's would follow, in my case, someone senior would always go if it was local to "represent the company" and possibly some close colleagues as well but the lights have to be kept on in the business also. In fairness, if it was the other side of the country, most people also would not expect anyone from work to attend.

Any sensible employer in Ireland accepts the culture of attending funerals & allowing reasonable time off.

I'd expect an employee to let their manager know & for the manager to ask that the employee has cover/ completed work.

Excessive time off would be dealt with as a performance issue should that arise.

good point. If someone seems to attend a lot of funerals then a chat is needed. And funerals are a big deal traditionally in Ireland.

I do wonder where our HR memos are coming from, they have a weird tone lately. I suspect a few new HR professionals from a different culture who are bringing their experience is the cause.

Usually would go to the night before if possible (unless very close) but raising an issue out of it will not engender much good will to the company.

I don’t think that anyone was taking advantage of the previous informal position and going to funerals weekly.

After many years service in a company I’d expect more that a token representative to show up at a funeral of a spouse or a parent.

Annieindublin said:

I do wonder where our HR memos are coming from, they have a weird tone lately. I suspect a few new HR professionals from a different culture who are bringing their experience is the cause.

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Is it civil service?

No it’s a private company.

I usually work late (that day or another day close to it) to make up any time I take to go to funerals in office hours.

Annieindublin said:

Surely if it’s a couple of hours you make up the time easily and no one bats an eyelid.

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But, you said yourself that it wasn't just a couple of hours in this case...

Annieindublin said:

A few people went to the funeral which was a fair distance from the office so most of a day off.

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Yes I know but that’s the exception rather than the rule. Mostly it’s Dublin for a few hours.

And frankly years of service should count for something, and it was only a few people, people who had all worked with her for over 2 decades.

And also would mainly be on salaries that don’t include payment for overtime.

Swings and roundabouts I feel. And a touch of humanity

That's the problem with exceptions, fail to address them and they become the rule. A couple of hours now and then is one thing, but they were likely prudent to call out the need to taking leave here or before long some would feel entitled to take a whole day for each distance acquaintance that passes.

Anyway I was just curious about whether other companies had actual policies or just accepted the cultural norm of attending when you can reasonably do so bearing in mind how close you are to the person.

As I mentioned we lost a member of staff once and they pretty much closed the office. And when a senior member lost a spouse all the senior people went and it was the other end of the country, no memos after that one.

Just occurred to me, I hope that they removed the bereaved person from the mailing list. Be awful to come back to work after a bereavement and see that memo in your inbox.

Annieindublin said:

After many years service in a company I’d expect more that a token representative to show up at a funeral of a spouse or a parent.

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Personally I wouldn't go to a funeral unless I knew the deceased. The time to offer condolences to family members is at the removal/wake.

I don't really understand why you think 'the company' should send representatives. It's up to individuals to decide whether they want to express their sympathy or not.

Annieindublin said:

the cultural norm of attending when you can reasonably do so bearing in mind how close you are to the person.

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That is the issue, it's not the cultural norm to attend funerals of people you clearly don't know.

_OkGo_ said:

Personally I wouldn't go to a funeral unless I knew the deceased. The time to offer condolences to family members is at the removal/wake.

I don't really understand why you think 'the company' should send representatives. It's up to individuals to decide whether they want to express their sympathy or not.


That is the issue, it's not the cultural norm to attend funerals of people you clearly don't know.

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I don't know what country you are from but in Ireland it's common practice to attend the funerals of coworkers spouses/parents that you have worked with for decades.

I’d go to a funeral if I knew the bereaved rather than the deceased. I think that’s a more usual criteria. Like the deceased won’t care but their widow or orphan might appreciate the show of support.

And when I lost a twin I was pleased to see my colleagues show up in force. It was easy as it was a weekend. No time off required.

And as I expected and appreciated the CEO turned up too.

I think it reflects poorly on the company, and the owner.
But its probably within the letter of the employment contract to ask them to take it as AL.

In my experience people appreciate the gesture of respect.

Though I will say I'd only go if its someone I knew/know well. I wouldn't go if someone was in the office for years and barely talked to them.

It‘a a personal and normally sensitive matter that is best left to common sense and an informal arrangement between managers and staff.

Anyone who’s ever been bereaved appreciates the kindness of those who turn up to express their sympathy. Written policies and instructions on the circumstances in which a person can do so without having to take leave seems a bit cold.