Claiming a refund of Payment Protection Insurance

Discussion in 'Payment Protection Insurance claims' started by Brendan Burgess, Oct 2, 2012.

  1. Gerry Canning

    Gerry Canning Frequent Poster


    Given that most sales occurred before March 2008 , any claim will fall foul of the 6 year rule.
    In effect any ppi/rpi/mrpi taken out before March 31st 2008 cannot be reclaimed.I know that the 6 year rule is being legally challenged ,so I advise everyone to get copy documents now and await that (slow legal) outcome.

    From what I have seen Credit Unions were not serious ppi offenders.

    Th Consumer Codes are of minimal use , given that our Ombudsman mostly finds for Finance Houses.It appears Mr Ombudsman relies on Banks honesty and if Mr Consumer signed = tough !
    I think we have all thought that ,since something is clearly wrong as per the Code Mr Consumer should easily win. Sadly Mr Ombudsman finds 88% for Mr Finance.
    I would not worry about Assurant moving , we can folow them all over Europe.

    More importantly ,
    There are upcoming cases on ppi , that will I hope move cases in this way. Any ppi bought since Jan 2005 can be reclaimed in SPITE of 6 year rule

    I will keep thread updated.
  2. GerryT100

    GerryT100 New Member

    Hi Gerry,

    Thanks for the response. I have not logged on a for bit so missed it initially.

    As far as i know RPI continues to be sold in Credit Unions but i do agree their sales processes are unlikely to have been as insidious and underhand as those of the banks. I was just intrigued why, based on the probable volume of sales. they were out of scope of the review.

    Agree completely about the FSO. Symptomatic of the general view and treatment of consumers in Ireland i'm afraid

    Anyway, will watch developments with interest

  3. Gerry Canning

    Gerry Canning Frequent Poster

    Eugene Mc Erlean former head of AIB Group Internal Audit and a senior advisor to Transperancy International Ireland , in Independent page 2 Business section makes comments about our Regulators.

    He used ppi as an example of poor REgulation.

    On the arbritary 2207 review{Who benefits from this 2007 cut off? Clearly the Lenders and the CEntral Bank.
    Who loses ? The substantial number of customers who were missold ppi policies during the boom}

    He goes on about light touch regulation etc

    I read it all to mean we cannot afford to trust Central Bank/Regulators.==i
  4. Gerry Canning

    Gerry Canning Frequent Poster

    On Uk news yesterday;
    Banks have provided an additional £2 Billion to cover PPI miss-sells.
    Thus far UK Banks have provided £ 23 Billion on this.

    In Ireland Banks should pay out circa e 2 Billion , since ppi was sold in the same general way as in UK. Our Banks have paid out a paltry 365 million?

    This means that , either UK Banks are soft touches.
    Or else our Regulators have not done their job.

    I estimate that of the e2Billion due to Irish customers more than half will eventually come from foreign owned banks eg ACC, Danske,Ge, Boi,Ulster etc.

    Can anyone please give me a reasoned view why our Regulators continue to adopt such a Bank (pleasing) approach?.
  5. FrankJnr

    FrankJnr New Member

    Evening all,

    Until I saw an article by pure chance in the Irish Independent a few weeks ago on the PPI issue here in Ireland, and being honest, I though the PPI issue was confined to the UK only so I never looked into it properly, but, as a result of reading the article I did some digging and I would just like to find out where I stand.

    I have a PPI policy on my Bank of Ireland credit card, and seeing as I usually keep my credit card in positive territory I never really paid much attention to to the payment protection amounts that were going out, however, I used my card a fair bit this year and balance has been creeping up, as a result the PPI amounts have been getting bigger.

    My questions are:

    1) Do I need PPI?

    Should I just cancel it as I've never had to claim it, and like I said, I usually stay in positive territory so am unlikely to ever need to claim.

    2) I've been paying PPI on my credit card since June 1997, and if I don't actually need it, do I have a chance of getting a refund?

    I was fresh out of college and never had a credit card up to that point, so I guess I was a bit naive and signed up for whatever they told me to sign, I don't usually go for insurance unless it is needed so I guess they told me I needed it and I've plain forgotten about it since then.

    I guess from reading posts on this website and on other websites that I'm outside of the 6 year claims window that the Ombudsman is standing over, so should I just cancel my PPI and forget everything paid since 1996?

    Have had mortgage PPI since 2004 but that's another story!

    Thanks in advance,

  6. Gerry Canning

    Gerry Canning Frequent Poster

    Frank Jnr.

    It looks like the 6 year rule on Statute of limitations will be overruled via the Dial early next year.
    PPI, even if you keep it, does not have a good payout % . I suggest review and probably cancel.
    There are High Court cases slowly winding their way, I expect customers to eventually win.

    For your info LLoyds Bank in Uk have added another£ 1 billion stg to their mis -selling fund.THat one Bank has set aside £12 Billion!!.ps the Chairman of BOI is ex Lloyds and since he was a senior executive he was caught up in the UK PPI.
    In Ireland I now conservatively estimate , refunds should be near 2.8 Billion.
    However since mostly the (little) people have been hit , I do not see our (dear leaders) rushing to protect them !

    Write and retain everything pertaining to CC & Mortgage PPI ,because when PPI finally blows up in the Banks faces ,those that have hard information will be in a strong position.
  7. FrankJnr

    FrankJnr New Member

    Thanks for the reply Gerry. I've cancelled the PPI on my credit card, but have left the mortgage PPI in place for now, one thing at a time. When I wrote to BofI asking for my PPI to be cancelled I also asked for a full statement of all PPI premiums paid up to that point, but instead of a statement I got a letter stating that they were investigating my PPI payments, even though I hadn't asked for that.

    Maybe they presumed what would be coming next and jumped straight into investigating?

    I don't know, but I'll wait and see what comes of it, the letter said I would have a response within 20 working days. Nothing heard yet, but I'll let you know what happens.
  8. Gerry Canning

    Gerry Canning Frequent Poster

    Please do keep me informed.

    The Banks had a (tame) Central Bank Review.
    As in your case it would appear when they are asked about ppi they suddenly discover they are checking YOUR case !
    Be very careful of any response you get , what seems to be happening (at least with old mbna) is they write to have you confirm you were eligible to take ppi ,NOT whether you were miss-sold ppi.
    Do not trust your Banks.

    In Uk Banks have paid out £stg 22 Billion thus far.
    In Roi Banks should pay out e 2.8 Billion.
    I a cannot help but feel this 2.8 billion was hushed up until after the Bank stress tests.
    Or is Gerry just paranoid?
  9. Gerry Canning

    Gerry Canning Frequent Poster

    Last edited: Nov 12, 2014
    One thing Banks had managed to keep (hidden) in Law was the 50% to 8o% comm they got on selling ppi .

    Today in UK Supreme Court 2014 0037 judgment.pdf was given in consumers favour.

    In laymans terms and in essence ;where a lender has made exorbitant comm ie the 50% to 80% commoission banks received is considered excessive. The consumer can in effect use that (greedy)commission as another reason to get his ppi refunded.
    It now means that those UK cases that consumers lost because the commission achieved was previously not considered relevant mean they can now re-claim.

    In Ireland , this is yet another nail in our (rulers) efforts to protect Banks from fairness. So with a fair wind our tame Ombudsman,Regulators will be forced to come the conclusion that the same antics Banks got up to in Ireland should mean refunds for ppi missselling .

    We are looking at 3 Billion refunds in Ireland.
    Sorry not refunds , money that was slyly taken and since too many times claims were not paid out =stolen.
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2014
  10. RatesIssue

    RatesIssue New Member


    Similar to frank, I had been paying credit card protection since 1999 and cancelled 18 months back. It has taken BOI that length of time to get a response to me, there response is basically:
    - you selected cpp on your application form, by selecting this you requested a cpp policy
    - all details of the policy were sent to you
    - you could have cancelled at any time
    - the charges were displayed clearly on your statement since inception
    - we offer a goodwill gesture of €200 but accept no liability. Case closed!

    Would you think €200 is as good as it gets or worth waiting?
    I can provide a scan of the letter if its helpful
  11. Gerry Canning

    Gerry Canning Frequent Poster

    Rates issue.
    I would be inclined not to accept the 200.
    Write to Boi, by (reg mail ) and request full breakdown of any and all cpp or ppi you paid on any account and request a full refund .
    That will force a response.
    If they do not respond rewrite and re-request ,enclose whatever small cost to do so , I think it is e6.50 cents.
    There are ongoing heavy legal/regulatory things winding their way through courts etc.

    So to anyone I suggest lodge a claim and await precedent setting legal outcomes.
  12. Gerry Canning

    Gerry Canning Frequent Poster

    Barry Whyte in News 2 in Sunday Business Post reports.

    Coleman Legal Partners hae 5 cases against MBNA in Carrick on Shannon District Court to-morrow Tuesday.
    If successful Coleman Partners have 204 cases to follow.

    I would think MBNA will settle.
    By Mbna settling no legal precedent is set.
    As per Coleman legal 340,000 of us (bought)ppi .
    In Uk Banks/CC companies/mortgages have so far repaid 24 Billion.

    In Roi we are looking @ 2 Billion +.
    There are HIgh Court cases coming up by JUne 2015 , which hopefully will find for consumers.
  13. Gerry Canning

    Gerry Canning Frequent Poster

    .I expect our Banks to be as shifty in management as UK new HSBC revelations.
    In Economist Magazine, PAYMENT PROTECTION INSURANCE claims are the 2nd largest payout by UK Banks coming thus far to circa e 25 Billion.

    Yet at best our Regulators/Banks have repaid only a portion of money wrongly taken.
    Suggest , Get onto your TD,s.I think this is as big as Variable rate issue on mortgages.
    In both cases the (little) people may retrieve some of their funds.
  14. Raging Bull

    Raging Bull Frequent Poster

    Gerry have you ever looked at SI 853/2004 Distance Marketing Regulations its very powerful stuff if used correctly

    Have a look in particular at section 20 (2) b and the reference of code if I am reading this right it basically moves all the Central Bank codes to having a legal basis..., don't think any solicitor has spotted this yet
  15. Gerry Canning

    Gerry Canning Frequent Poster

    Thanks Raging Bull.

    The Distance Marketing regulations have been brought up and found wanting.
    That said, I am getting it checked as I write, because that was 2 years ago..
    There are 2 large UK claims companies with sample cases coming to High Court in Spring..
    From what I hear these are good sample cases.
    I think the statute of limitations will be a bigger test , should ppi open up.
    Thanks Raging Bull for bringing that up because the Banks do not deserve to keep our 2.5 Billion.
    Will keep post updated.
  16. Gerry Canning

    Gerry Canning Frequent Poster

    Raging Bull.
    Just pulled out my info.
    Effectively the distance marketing regulations are only viable for up to 14 days.
    Am told (on a positive note) that some lenders are now sweating over upcoming High Court cases.
    Not sure of what these sample cases contain but I smell optomism.
  17. Raging Bull

    Raging Bull Frequent Poster

    Yes they do provide cancellation rights for 14 days

    The Irish implementation actually went further than the directive 20 2 b essentially says if a financial provider is subject to a code from central bank and breaks it they committ an offence which then allows prosecution in a civil if I am right these codes now can derive legal basis

    20 2 b is not in EU directive but is in Irish Law
  18. Raging Bull

    Raging Bull Frequent Poster

    What Im saying is the Consumer Protection Code on its own will only get you so far as its relevance accepted by courts is a bit up in the air. However it is a code soecifically telling financial institutions how to interact with customers etc.,, clearly in case of PPI it was not followed in a lot of cases

    My point is the irish version of Distance marketing regulations gives insight into provision of information and communications with respect to consumer. There are some similarities to CPC

    So a case taken under breach of of distance marketing regulations and CPC potentially makes the CPC LAW via 20 2 b of distance marketing regulations in Irish version

    Communication can be written and verbal. The written aspect I.e contract would have to be fully compliant with CPC or its a simultaneous breach via 20 2 b under distance marketing regulations

    Hope that makes sense
  19. Gerry Canning

    Gerry Canning Frequent Poster

    Raging Bull,
    What you quote and say makes eminent sense .
    What you say about consumer code also makes sense.

    The problem is in legal application of these protective sounding codes.
    Bottom line is that Mr High Court is going to decide .

    From my view PPI should never have been allowed to get past the unambiguous Spirit of the Law contained in the (nice) sounding Consumer Protection Codes.
    It is nearly unbelievable that Banks have still got away with PPI in Ireland.
    We are today in the hard realm of Letter of the Law.
    Let the High Court judge .!
  20. Gerry Canning

    Gerry Canning Frequent Poster

    Apparently MBNA now AVANT card are writing to customers re miss-selling of Credit card PPI ie customer pays circa 50e per year to have card protected from theft etc.
    Apparently Central Bank are telling them to sort this.

    Fair nuff as it goes.
    However I understand that in responding customers are being told if they sign it is in full and final settlement of any PPI claim.
    Not 100% sure yet but has anyone seen these letters.

    Careful before you sign . please.