I just got another quote...foam fill...€2000. The sales guy was totally against bonded bead because a) the adhesive in bonded bead corrodes the electrical cabling of wires within the cavity b) the bonded bead will still fall out to some extent if I open a wall later for windows c) if the insulation boards that I already have in the house are not absolutley flush against the wall then the beads (that are dropped from a height) will be 'trapped' behind the boards and not fill the cavities properly. He tells me "99%" of houses have this problem and that is why the foam is a better solution. Is any of this true?? I don't trust the guy to begin with (but the company he represents are all above aboard and certified etc). His original quote was €2250 and I got him to drop it to €2000 in ~20 seconds....then I knew he was really screwing me!
Cavity Wall Insulation
- Thread starter pnagle
- Start date
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z102
Guest
You found out what was obviously. The electric cables are usually laid in so called "chases" within the intirior wall of a double walled structure. So there wouldn't be any contact between the EPS beads and the PVC insulation of the cables. On the continent they don't have the requirement to lay the PVC coated copper cables in extra ducts to shelter them from the impact against styrene. Not in the Netherlands, Austria or Germany where I have seen PVC in contact with EPS installed. Though I'm not an electrician , so take my views with care, I'm just an observer.
The ESB wants the meter box installed within the wall - what's idiotic but Irish standard - and connected with a duct. After installing the meter box and after the electricians fix the fuse box they draw the mains cable through that duct and connect it to the meter. The ducting will protect the cable against direct contact with the EPS, so you're fine with the Irish legislations.
Kick out that foam installer, but use a soft boot, he mightn't know any better.
When employing the bead blower than fix in the written contract that you might want to check his work with an infrared camera and- if he had failed on some spots- he must do his job up to standard without extra costs.Any reasonable company has that stated in their guarantees/contract anyhow.
The ESB wants the meter box installed within the wall - what's idiotic but Irish standard - and connected with a duct. After installing the meter box and after the electricians fix the fuse box they draw the mains cable through that duct and connect it to the meter. The ducting will protect the cable against direct contact with the EPS, so you're fine with the Irish legislations.
Kick out that foam installer, but use a soft boot, he mightn't know any better.
When employing the bead blower than fix in the written contract that you might want to check his work with an infrared camera and- if he had failed on some spots- he must do his job up to standard without extra costs.Any reasonable company has that stated in their guarantees/contract anyhow.
TheGreenMan
Registered User
- Messages
- 17
pnagle said:
I had heard this the other way around, ie that the expanding foam insulation degrades PVC but the bonded bead did not so I would double check this.
Reading [broken link removed] from SEI it says:
Polystyrene insulation should not be placed in contact with
PVC-coated electrical wiring, otherwise the PVC may degrade.
Also, steps should be taken to ensure that any electrical wiring
covered by the insulation does not overheat.
PVC-coated electrical wiring, otherwise the PVC may degrade.
Also, steps should be taken to ensure that any electrical wiring
covered by the insulation does not overheat.
Do you know what was used in the foam fill?
i got this done on a 3 bed bungalow in Dublin for €650 last year. would imagine a 2 stoey house should be less than double that.
It was the beads.
The guy drilled his holes and showed me inside the wall on a little tv screen he had attacthed to a tiny camera. They checked for obstructions and if they found any they drilled another hole underneath so the beads would fall to the bottom.
The attic was already insulated.
Noticed the difference that very night. The house usually cooled down an hour after turning the heat off before but stayed warm for ages after we got the insulation done. I figure the heating is half the time it used to be now.
Thats rubbish about the stuff falling out of the walls. there is glue injected with them and after an hour you can see how solid it gets in the vents.
You actually have to but a hole through it for your vents when it sets.
These are the guys who did it for me
http://www.abbeyinsulation.co.uk/
It was the beads.
The guy drilled his holes and showed me inside the wall on a little tv screen he had attacthed to a tiny camera. They checked for obstructions and if they found any they drilled another hole underneath so the beads would fall to the bottom.
The attic was already insulated.
Noticed the difference that very night. The house usually cooled down an hour after turning the heat off before but stayed warm for ages after we got the insulation done. I figure the heating is half the time it used to be now.
Thats rubbish about the stuff falling out of the walls. there is glue injected with them and after an hour you can see how solid it gets in the vents.
You actually have to but a hole through it for your vents when it sets.
These are the guys who did it for me
http://www.abbeyinsulation.co.uk/
TheGreenMan
Registered User
- Messages
- 17
babydays said:Do all houses have cavity walls (my house is from 1970)?Or is it possible that we have bricks with holes in them that are supposed to form that function?
You should be able to check what you're walls are like if you have access to a vent or something that can be taken off the wall. Our house is from the '50s and uses cavity blocks (bricks with holes) and not cavity walls (two courses of bricks with a gap between). I think with cavity blocks only expanding foam is possible as the others like beads can't find their way around all the holes in the bricks.
Thanks for the feedback. Just another question re. bonded beads: the quote I got was for ~€1500 for standard bonded bead, and ~€1800 for a bonded bead that is graphite-coated (?) and gives 20% better insulation according to the salesman. Has anyone any feedback on this graphite-coated stuff and is it worth the extra money?
Z
z102
Guest
The graphit ones are better insulating. They're not just coated but the graphit is combined with the PS even within the bead, use a razor blade and cut a bead open and have a look.
serotoninsid
Registered User
- Messages
- 1,754
Re: Feasibility of cavity insulation in this instance?
Just want to check what people think as regards the feasibility of wall insulation in the following scenario:
Old 1920s house with very thick stone walls; All rooms (with the exception of one room) were 'lathed' & plastered in the 1980's in order to solve a dampness problem ie. water ingress through the wall - and also to improve the finish as walls were crooked. There is very little space between the plasterboard finish and the solid wall ie. just the thickness of the lathe.
Q1.Would it be difficult/impossible to pump foam/bonded bead into this cavity?
Q2. If we carry out this work, would it result in the original problem ie. dampness, reoccuring due to the foam/bonded bead providing a 'bridge' for moisture from the damp solid wall to the plasterboard finish?
Just want to check what people think as regards the feasibility of wall insulation in the following scenario:
Old 1920s house with very thick stone walls; All rooms (with the exception of one room) were 'lathed' & plastered in the 1980's in order to solve a dampness problem ie. water ingress through the wall - and also to improve the finish as walls were crooked. There is very little space between the plasterboard finish and the solid wall ie. just the thickness of the lathe.
Q1.Would it be difficult/impossible to pump foam/bonded bead into this cavity?
Q2. If we carry out this work, would it result in the original problem ie. dampness, reoccuring due to the foam/bonded bead providing a 'bridge' for moisture from the damp solid wall to the plasterboard finish?
babydays said:Do all houses have cavity walls (my house is from 1970)?
Your house may be of cavity wall construction, probably a 2" cavity, but as suggested you could check your meter box location to be certain. As a check you can also measure your wall thickness (at an open window), which in the above scenario would amount to 1/2" plaster internally +4" block+ 2" cavity+ 4" block + 3/4" external render= 11 1/4" overall or 285mm.
D
david ross
Guest
hi
To install cavity wall insulation, your property must have two masonry brick or block walls, with minimum 50mm of space between them. Homes built between 1930 and 1995 are the most commonly requiring cavity wall insulation. If your home was built before this period, the property probably has solid walls. If it was built later, insulation is most likely included within the walls.
Many Irish dwellings have cavity walls that could be filled. You can find out if you too have cavity walls by measuring your walls at a door or window for thickness. If the walls are solid, the measurement will be around 23 cm thick, while if a cavity exists, the wall will be around 30 cm thick. You can also contact the SEI
Last edited by a moderator:
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david ross
Guest
hi,Do all houses have cavity wall insulation(my house is from 1970)?
Homes built between 1930 and 1995 are the most commonly requiring cavity wall insulation. If your home was built before this period, the property probably has solid walls. If it was built later, insulation is most likely included within the walls. Many Irish dwellings have cavity walls that could be filled. You can find out if you too have cavity walls by measuring your walls at a door or window for thickness. If the walls are solid, the measurement will be around 23 cm thick, while if a cavity exists, the wall will be around 30 cm thick. You can also contact the SEI to survey your property in this regard.
Foam cavity insulation has had a poor reputation for years and was as far as I am aware supposedly classed as being not fit for purpose, the reason being I can not recall.
However the foam is NOT IRISH ACCREDITED and is not recognised by SEI for the purpose of attaning grants, if you pay for this type of insulation expecting to be reimbursed to the tune of €400 on the HES scheme then SEI will not pay out pure and simple, I know this for sure as an insulator I know had to be removed from the SEI register as the foam product he used is not on the SEI list.
The polypearl plus has a thermal conductivity of 0.030 ...polypearl platinum 0.037 (better)
However the foam is NOT IRISH ACCREDITED and is not recognised by SEI for the purpose of attaning grants, if you pay for this type of insulation expecting to be reimbursed to the tune of €400 on the HES scheme then SEI will not pay out pure and simple, I know this for sure as an insulator I know had to be removed from the SEI register as the foam product he used is not on the SEI list.
The polypearl plus has a thermal conductivity of 0.030 ...polypearl platinum 0.037 (better)