Gordon Gekko
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It’s 232,000 with a million or more / at least a million, not 232,000 with only a million!
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It’s 232,000 with a million or more / at least a million, not 232,000 with only a million!And of that 13%, how many of them will have just one inheritor? So that 1m could be split 4/5/6 etc ways.
And of that 1m, how much of it is in a house that has potentially doubled in value over the course of the last 20 years? Majority of my current wealth in unearned - tax free pension contributions and growth and a home that has capital appreciation that I did nothing to earn and therefore paid no tax on. If I put my money into shares instead of buying a house, I would be paying tax. So while I can benefit from the generous pension and PPR tax reliefs, if I crystalise the profit and gift them or leave them to my children as an inheritance, then they pay the tax. Seems fair to me!
Pension contributions and by extension pension pots is invested income (you have to have excess income in the first instance to be able to invest) with the risk associated with same. Why do you think pension contributions are tax free? The state is removing its risk to you when it comes to looking after yourself in old age. The state will recoup the "tax free" contributions when it comes to drawing down your pension as some people will end up paying the high rate of tax on their future pension and even if not the state pension and any other aged related benefits will no doubt be means tested in the future.And of that 13%, how many of them will have just one inheritor? So that 1m could be split 4/5/6 etc ways.
And of that 1m, how much of it is in a house that has potentially doubled in value over the course of the last 20 years? Majority of my current wealth in unearned - tax free pension contributions and growth and a home that has capital appreciation that I did nothing to earn and therefore paid no tax on. If I put my money into shares instead of buying a house, I would be paying tax. So while I can benefit from the generous pension and PPR tax reliefs, if I crystalise the profit and gift them or leave them to my children as an inheritance, then they pay the tax. Seems fair to me!
The pension lump sum (tax free) would be the potential to gift to kids. The taxed pension itself I will live off and will hardly have much saved out of it if I spend it the way I plan to! And my home is the other portion of my wealth I will pass on, the majority of the value of my home being unearned and is well in excess of the capital, interest and improvement payments I made out of after tax money. So I have not paid tax on either of those things. So if I give them away, the recipient will potentially pay tax.Pension contributions and by extension pension pots is invested income (you have to have excess income in the first instance to be able to invest) with the risk associated with same. Why do you think pension contributions are tax free? The state is removing its risk to you when it comes to looking after yourself in old age. The state will recoup the "tax free" contributions when it comes to drawing down your pension as some people will end up paying the high rate of tax on their future pension and even if not the state pension and any other aged related benefits will no doubt be means tested in the future.
if your pension does not perform who is at the loss? You may have invested more into your pension pot then you get out of it. How many pension pots were wiped out following the 2008 financial crisis?
Of course, I made the classic mistake of not looking at the stats. Is there a further breakdown I wonder with more detail in this category rather than just an upper cut off? I might be shocked at the results!It 232,000 with a million or more / at least a million, not 232,000 with only a million!
Exactly!Maybe the State should tax the estate of wealthy older people when they die in order to recoup some of the money it lavished on them in their last few years through the medical care system.
Some sort of inheritance tax perhaps?
Within a few short years the value of my pension was double what it was worth pre crash due to money printing and the resulting flood of cash into capital markets.How many pension pots were wiped out following the 2008 financial crisis?
Wait, can that be correct, that Irish household net wealth is some multiple of €232bn?!It’s 232,000 with a million or more / at least a million, not 232,000 with only a million!
The value of your house rose because of supply and demand. If supply outstripped demand your house would lose value. The value of your house also increased because you upgraded your house, invested in its maintenance etc.Within a few short years the value of my pension was double what it was worth pre crash due to money printing and the resulting flood of cash into capital markets.
The same phenomenon doubled the price of my house. It also halved the value of labour relative to capital as there was no real wage inflation during the same period.
I got rich without earning a cent of it, just like so many other over 50’s who happened to own a home and have a pension before the crash. If you were a cynic you’d think that all the older property owning civil servants, central bankers and politicians were acting in their own self interest!
So make inter generational wealth transfers tax free but tax the hell out of everything else?Scrap inheritance tax totally.
Reduce tax relief on pension contributions and major lump sums instead
So make inter generational wealth transfers tax free but tax the hell out of everything else?
Should be go back to having kings and earls and all that stuff too?
Many in this country and many on this site are almost obsessed with finding new and ingenious ways to tax others (and it's always others) as long and as hard as possible, while remaining blind to the general inefficacy of public expenditure generally and public expenditure waste in particular.
Divide by number of children, then subtract the allowance.232,000 Irish households had net wealth (assets less debt) of more than €1m in 2022. That figure is likely to have grown.
Pretty much only those people who decided to go for a self directed pension so they could earn a packet by investing in Anglo shares, with a bit of AIB and BoI for diversification (a saw a few do that).How many pension pots were wiped out following the 2008 financial crisis?
Not aimed at you at all. In fact, posted in support.I don’t think you can accuse me of being blind to the waste and inefficiency of public expenditure.
I’m also one of the people who will benefit significantly from the current inheritance tax system.
I think it’s a trillion including family homes and €600bn excluding them or something like that.Wait, can that be correct, that Irish household net wealth is some multiple of €232bn?!
| Table 2.1 Summary of results by year | |||||
| Households with asset/debt (%) | Median value 1(€) | ||||
| 2018 | 2020 | 2018 | 2020 | ||
| Real assets | |||||
| Household Main Residence (HMR) | 68.8 | 69.6 | 250,000 | 260,000 | |
| Land | 8.4 | 8.9 | 301,000 | 300,000 | |
| Other Real Estate Property | 12.9 | 12.5 | 200,600 | 236,600 | |
| Self Employment Business Wealth | 17.3 | 15.2 | 18,600 | 19,700 | |
| Vehicles | 78.5 | 79.1 | 8,000 | 10,000 | |
| Valuables | 78.8 | 78.3 | 4,000 | 4,100 | |
| Any Real Asset | 95.6 | 95.3 | 222,700 | 253,100 | |
| Financial assets | |||||
| Savings | 94.6 | 96.6 | 5,000 | 8,700 | |
| Bond or Mutual funds | 10.3 | 13.6 | 10,000 | 5,000 | |
| Shares | 9.7 | 10.5 | 6,200 | 5,800 | |
| Voluntary Pension | 15.8 | 16.3 | 47,500 | 37,600 | |
| Other Financial Asset | 6.6 | 7.2 | 10,000 | 10,000 | |
| Any Financial Asset | 94.8 | 97.1 | 7,800 | 13,300 | |
| Debt | |||||
| Mortgage on HMR | 29.9 | 30.4 | 128,500 | 124,400 | |
| Mortgage on Other Property | 9.4 | 7.2 | 105,400 | 104,800 | |
| Non-mortgage loan | 46.4 | 45.5 | 6,600 | 7,300 | |
| Overdraft | 10.7 | 6.7 | 600 | 600 | |
| Credit Card debt | 39.8 | 26.8 | 1,000 | 700 | |
| Any Debt | 71.8 | 68.1 | 21,400 | 25,000 | |
| 1 Conditional on participation. |
IIRC quite a few got sucked in when the bank shares fell quite a bit and a common view taken was that they were undervalued as a result. Little did they know that that initial fall was the lucky people getting out.Pretty much only those people who decided to go for a self directed pension so they could earn a packet by investing in Anglo shares, with a bit of AIB and BoI for diversification (a saw a few do that).
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