Many thanks for those links. The debate one does specify, living in Ireland. So I wonder if that is also one of the criteria.Why would @ATC110 need to "find out"?
The criteria are the criteria and unless the rules change then an eligible claimant can get both UK and Irish state pensions.
Here is a thread where two posters claim they are in receipt of both.
Here is a Dáil debate from thirty years ago where it is clear you can receive both:
As far as I know once you meet the criteria for a contributory pension in both jurisdictions you can be living on the Moon!Many thanks for those links. The debate one does specify, living in Ireland. So I wonder if that is also one of the criteria.
This is the standard response that "We don't do forecasts".When I showed them the PRSI record, which is 887 A1 contributions, they simply said they didn't know, and it would depend on the rules when the time comes....
Of course they don't know or care! All they care about is whether you are eligible for a UK state pension on a contributory basis or not. There are hundreds of other foreign pension arrangements for people who've lived and worked in the UK in the past.My doubt about it, is simply down to the conversations I've had with the international pensions people in Newcastle, as they simply said they didn't know.
Whether I use the old or new way of calculating, it does qualify. I'm not sure which date they mean 'started paying social insurance' date. As in, Ireland or UK. But either date would still qualify. Though the average would be much better using the Ireland start date!
Could you explain this?I moved to Ireland in 1999, and until the rules change , that is the "started paying social insurance" date for working out the average. UK date irrelevant.
The Irish state pension is averaged from when you first started paying PRSI.Could you explain this?
Thanks
I understand that, I mean the sentence quoted specifically-it doesn't make senseThe Irish state pension is averaged from when you first started paying PRSI.
So if I rock up in Ireland aged 57 I could easily have a full pension aged 67 whereas my wife who had a part time job in SuperValu aged 17 would be heavily penalised.
How would you accumulate enough credits for a full pension in ten years?So if I rock up in Ireland aged 57 I could easily have a full pension aged 67
It’s because of the maximum entry age, minimum contribution period and averaging rule. That person would have an average of 52 contributions per year for 10 years from age 57.How would you accumulate enough credits for a full pension in ten years?
So 1999 was the date I started working here and paying Irish social insurance. Sorry if that was unclear. I wasn't saying 1999 was the relevant date for everyone.I understand that, I mean the sentence quoted specifically-it doesn't make sense
I paid Class 2 in arrears but had to prove to HMRC that I was now employed overseas and compulsorily insured@jasdpace@gmail. Did you find out yet whether payment of voluntary national insurance contributions for years when you were working abroad can be paid at class 2 (instead of class 3) even when paid in arrears?
You might be better off having two partial pensions rather than combining contributions for one?Also, does anyone know whether years in which you made the mandatory class S PRSI contribution of Eur 500 because you had unearned income over Eur 5k (but didn't have any other employment) might be classified as "working" for the purposes of UK national insurance voluntary contributions (qualifying for the class 2 rate)?
Yes, if I hadn't been employed the more expensive Class 3 rate would have applied for ongoing annual payments. It's still a great return though.Thank you for the information, @ATC110 . Do you know if it made a difference that you were still employed at the time that you made the payment?
I would check with HMRC-I had a combination of Class 2 and 3 in the arrears statement and opted to buy the Class 2 years only based upon having enough time before retirement age to annually buy Class 2 VICsIf I was working for some years and not working for others, could some years of arrears be paid at class 2 and others at class 3? They sent out an email to me stating what years I could pay voluntary contributions for, and how much they would cost (all at class 3) but never asked if I was working during those years.
The DSP pension department will ask if you have worked in the UK or another EU member state and use those contributions for pension calculation purposes. When ready to claim your pension, I would still check if you'd be better off claiming two separate pensions thoughI didn't think "combining contributions for one" was possible. My understanding was the only type of "combining" is that years worked in certain other countries could count towards the 10 years needed to qualify for a pension, but the actual amount you receive from any country will only depend on the contributions in that country. So if you work 5 years in the UK and 5 years in Ireland you qualify for a pension from both, but both will only pay you for 5 years of contributions.
If your medical card is subject to a means test, the UK pension will form part of that though?In my case I think it might be better to not claim a partial pension from Ireland (and so forgo any benefits from my Irish contributions) as it will cause me to lose the medical card that I would get from having a UK/EU pension without receiving Irish welfare. A medical card might be more valuable than a partial Irish pension.
use those contributions for pension calculation purposes.
The EU pension medical card is not subject to a means test. See "Entitlement under EU Regulations" here:If your medical card is subject to a means test, the UK pension will form part of that though?
There is an example on https://www.gov.uk/new-state-pension/living-and-working-overseas where someone who worked for 7 years in the UK and 16 years in an EEA country will qualify for a UK pension (as the total is more than 10 years) but the pension they receive from the UK will only be based on the 7 years that they worked there.
Additionally, the Irish DSP says that you can send your information about work in other EEA countries to them and they will apply for the pensions from those countries on your behalf. I am quite sure that it is not possible to instead combine them into one country's pension (you can't get an Irish pension equivalent to 20 years of contributions by combining 10 years in Ireland and 10 years in the UK - only two pensions for 10 years each from Ireland and the UK).
What about other income/capital you may have?The EU pension medical card is not subject to a means test. See "Entitlement under EU Regulations" here:
Medical cards
The medical card scheme entitles certain people to free public health services. This document explains the medical card and how to apply for it.www.citizensinformation.ie
Class S from rental income is certainly classified as "compulsory income" for the purposes of the bilateral arrangement with the UK. Class S income is paid by all self-employed people so it kind of has to be counted this way.Also, does anyone know whether years in which you made the mandatory class S PRSI contribution of Eur 500 because you had unearned income over Eur 5k (but didn't have any other employment) might be classified as "working" for the purposes of UK national insurance voluntary contributions (qualifying for the class 2 rate)?
Pro rata pension proportionate to the number of combined contributions paid being less than the required 2080 to qualify for a full contributory state pension.@ATC110 I interpret that to mean that it works the way that I thought it did: EEA contributions can be used to help you qualify for an Irish pension: if they add to more than 10 years you qualify, even if you worked fewer than 10 in Ireland, but you get a pro rata pension from Ireland, proportionate to the number of years you have worked here.
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