SEPA caused my fortnightly mortgage payment to be missed. Got called from Bank

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biggerry

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I have a mortgage with BoI and make fortnightly repayments. I was left a voice message on my mobile this afternoon asking me to call "urgently".

I called the number and spoke to an advisor who told me that my last mortgage payment was returned by the bank and asked if I could give them a debit card payment instead. I was surprised by the payment being refused because there should have been sufficient funds in the account. I said that I wanted to check the balance of this account first and that if there wasn't enough money there to meet the payment, I'd be happy to pay via debit card. The advisor was reluctant to do this but I insisted on calling her back once I checked the account.

I checked the account that the mortgage is paid from and sure enough, there was more than enough to meet the repayment so I called back and spoke to another advisor. This time the advisor told me that after the SEPA changeover, they were having issues with some accounts where mortgage repayments were made fortnightly or weekly and were being returned unpaid. She asked me if I'd like to pay with a debit card instead and again I refused. My point to her was that there was more than enough money to meet the repayment and I didn't see why I had to pay when the issue wasn't my fault. I even offered to send her a screen dump of my account to show that there was enough money there. She checked with her supervisor and she came back and said that they'd submit another request for payment on the 17th and I said that that was OK and that they could submit it now if they wanted.

I then asked if this missed payment would show up on my ICB report as a missed mortgage payment. She wasn't sure so she checked with her supervisor again and came back to me and said that it wouldn't. I asked her if a confirmation of this could be emailed to me but she said they didn't have the facility to send emails. I told the advisor that even though I had no immediate plans to borrow in the future, I didn't want a missed payment to show up on my record in case I did need to borrow. If a financial institution saw a missed payment they wouldn't entertain my application. In the end, they agreed to send me a letter to state this fact.

What I don't understand is why they looked for immediate payment if they knew that there could be an issue with SEPA processing some payments?

Just making people aware of this in case you get a similar call from BoI.
 
Biggerry;

They do not have facilities for e-mails! Hmn, Get out the Quill & inkwell ?

If you don,t get the appropriate letter promptly. I Suggest you write and explain and re-request it.

Even if you do get it, before you look for a new loan off any lender get your own ICB , Irish Credit Bureau Record. From ICB , Newstead,ClonskeaghRd, Dublin 4 , costs Euro 6. The problem is that if Icb shows a missed payment ,you will be declined immediately and worse you will not know why.

Hopefully no missed payment will show.
 
I intend getting that report Gerry Canning. I might even ask BoI to pay for it :)

But seriously, how often are the ICB records updated? Any idea how long I should leave it before I order mine?
 
I wouldn't worry about the ICB record. Banks will almost never report a single missed payment because it could be due to anything including system issues. Get one for peace of mind if you want but don't worry.
 
biggerry said:
I have a mortgage with BoI and make fortnightly repayments. I was left a voice message on my mobile this afternoon asking me to call "urgently".

I called the number and spoke to an advisor who told me that my last mortgage payment was returned by the bank and asked if I could give them a debit card payment instead. I was surprised by the payment being refused because there should have been sufficient funds in the account. I said that I wanted to check the balance of this account first and that if there wasn't enough money there to meet the payment, I'd be happy to pay via debit card. The advisor was reluctant to do this but I insisted on calling her back once I checked the account.

I checked the account that the mortgage is paid from and sure enough, there was more than enough to meet the repayment so I called back and spoke to another advisor. This time the advisor told me that after the SEPA changeover, they were having issues with some accounts where mortgage repayments were made fortnightly or weekly and were being returned unpaid. She asked me if I'd like to pay with a debit card instead and again I refused. My point to her was that there was more than enough money to meet the repayment and I didn't see why I had to pay when the issue wasn't my fault. I even offered to send her a screen dump of my account to show that there was enough money there. She checked with her supervisor and she came back and said that they'd submit another request for payment on the 17th and I said that that was OK and that they could submit it now if they wanted.

I then asked if this missed payment would show up on my ICB report as a missed mortgage payment. She wasn't sure so she checked with her supervisor again and came back to me and said that it wouldn't. I asked her if a confirmation of this could be emailed to me but she said they didn't have the facility to send emails. I told the advisor that even though I had no immediate plans to borrow in the future, I didn't want a missed payment to show up on my record in case I did need to borrow. If a financial institution saw a missed payment they wouldn't entertain my application. In the end, they agreed to send me a letter to state this fact.

What I don't understand is why they looked for immediate payment if they knew that there could be an issue with SEPA processing some payments?

Just making people aware of this in case you get a similar call from BoI.
Click to expand...


De Ja Vu!

I got the exact same call today. Payment should have been taken yesterday but wasn't.

It will now be taken on the 17th with usual fortnightly payments being taken on Tuesdays now instead of Wednesday.

I had the same concerns as you re. ICB report but she assured me it wouldn't and would note on the file that the error was theirs ... again SEPA blamed.

I'm going to write to them to ask for confirmation of this.

One thing that puzzles me .... she was able to see the account where the funds were to transfer from and was able to see that there was sufficient funds in the account. They could have sorted this without contacting me.

Wonder how many more got this call today?
 
Why when the banks know there is a technical problem do they not just run the payments again as they are going to do on the 17th. Why bother the customers whose fault it is not.

I would absolutely want written confirmation that it will not affect the ICB reports.

What bank does not have email access?
 
Sunny/Big gerry;

If bank do not confirm as verbally promised , call your icb in 2 months in that by that time any issue will show.
I would worry , because when I worked in finance I had customer did not pay on 25Th their due date , yet he was from 1st next month put on icb as 1 down.In todays market he would not get finance.

Should as Sunny says be ok , but then again ?
 
All my Direct debits with BOI now seem to have a delay, of about 2 days where the money does not debit. Is SEPA just a longer process?
My mortgage payment was paid on the due side but took 2 days to complete from BOI. Now my gas bill has shown the same.
 
Bronte said:
Why when the banks know there is a technical problem do they not just run the payments again as they are going to do on the 17th. Why bother the customers whose fault it is not.
Click to expand...

Because many people expect funds to get taken out on a certain date and get very upset if funds come out even a few days later as they might not realise that the payment had been missed and suddenly go overdrawn. Better to contact customer and agree with them how to handle (take payment immediately by card, wait and take two payments next time, something else).

And just because it's your bank taking the payment for your mortgage doesn't mean it should be treated differently. What if your mortgage was with a different bank and so they couldn't see you had the funds? What if it was Sky or your gas bill? Banks should not be dipping into your accounts without explicit agreement and that includes changing any agreed upon collection dates.

The conversion from sort code and account code to BIC and IBAN is not as smooth and simple as it should have been. At my job we're coming across lots of weird cases for certain banks and branches where the IBAN is not a simple translation as it is for the majority of people. So when the conversion isn't done properly then the collection fails under SEPA (as company has sent incorrect IBAN) and the company and customer is left in the above situation.

The simple way to check if you are likely to be affected this is to look at the last 14 digits of your IBAN from your bank statement. If they are NOT your sort code and account number then you are non standard and chances are companies are going to experience problems converting your direct debits to SEPA. You could be proactive about this and contact your DD payers to give them your IBAN in advance but that depends on whether the company is ready to take it. You can also use this tool (https://ipsosepaservice.sentenial.com/ipso/oneShotIRL) to check your details are converted correctly. Again if the BIC and IBAN produced based on your sort code and account code do not match then you're more than likely to experience issues.

SEPA collections also seem a lot stricter on checking details. So if you are not the bank account holder for the collection (e.g. It's for your bill but coming out of an account owned by a family member) or if you've changed your name of given it differently to what you gave your bank, then this used to work but now may not if the company does not have the exact account details.

Ultimately it's the company collecting the DD who is responsible to get this conversion correctly so you should not be left out of pocket, or with bad credit marks, in case of issues. I would expect most companies to show a fair amount of leniency on this if they are at fault.

Saying that, being on the other side and working for a company doing our best based on the information we have, I can appreciate how payments are being missed through no fault of the company either. The banks and IPSO are supposed to give conversion information and they are not always accurate.

Hope that helps explain things a little. Best to work with your DD collector and your bank to try to resolve any issues that arise.
 
Mrmr said:
All my Direct debits with BOI now seem to have a delay, of about 2 days where the money does not debit. Is SEPA just a longer process?
My mortgage payment was paid on the due side but took 2 days to complete from BOI. Now my gas bill has shown the same.
Click to expand...

Under SEPA, the banks are requiring up to 6 days notice to set up a direct debit and 3 days notice for each month after to make the collection. Previously this used to be one day for both. Companies need to submit files earlier or move collection days later because of this.

So next month you may be back to "normal" because of both 1) the 3 days notice for subsequent collections and 2) companies getting their act together over the whole SEPA conversion.
 
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