National Grid necessary for Satellite broadband

I'm thinking of buying a cottage in a very remote part of Clare which is not - and is unlikely to be due to its location - ever on the national grid! There is a stream close by which is an option for water-generated electrical power, and there is a further option of a diesel generator.

I've noticed a few threads here about areas in Mayo not having Broadband. The auctioneer advises that for this Clare location I would "need to be on Satellite Broadband".

Two questions. Is "satellite" broadband different to "ordinary" broadband (be gentle with me - I'm only a girl and don't have boy-genes for IT). Second question, would there be any difficulties due to spinning my own electricity, so to speak. Would it be sufficient?

For the power consumption of the computer you could check the various manufacturer pages.As far as I know there are some screens and Pcs available that consume very little, check for the "Star mark". I think Dell had a good one. Tapping the stream could make the power suply very changeable, so you would need a battery or some sort of equalizer to buffer the smaller fluctuations like leaves and debris in the turbine,changing water levels etc...The Army uses pedalled generators.....
A small solar panel (PV) loading the battery would be cheaper in the long term. Backed up with a generator it would be sufficient, but the running costs for a generator aren't cheap.Swall wind generators are used on sea,it could be an option.
Sattelite broadband needs a phone connection , either via landline or by mobile (more expensive), make sure you get a good connection with one of them .

Hello Heinbloed.........the cottage has telephone service OK. I've always been very pro solar panels but if there is dull, stormy weather for weeks on end where does that leave the supply! It sounds - from what you say - as if satellite broadband connection in that location might be very "hit and miss". By the way, can you say more about the "pedalling" idea the Army uses? I've used a treadle sewing-machine; is it the same idea? If it's satellite broadband does that mean there are periods when connection is not possible (e.g. when the satellite is the other side of the earth?

Have you investigated the possibility of using a micro hydro turbine for electricity generation via the adjacent stream? I used to work for a company which produced these and I know that some of them were installed in similar setups around Ireland in the past. I think that the design originated in Sweden but can't remember the details at this stage. Neither do I have any contacts for companies who do this now unfortunately but just though I'd mention it.

Thanks ClubMan - I'll investigate the micro hydro-turbine idea. Water-or wind-power would be ideal but I understand from the auctioneer I'd need to establish some kind of lease with the landowners on either side of the stream for the latter.

if you depend on an internet connection you will need 2 way sat which costs 1000 install minimum and about 150 a month and you cannot use it for spype or voip because the sat is 40,000 km away and too slow to respond without timing out .

remote cottages are for those simply who do not wish to be 'connected' to the world Marie, you may find the isolation a bit overwhelming .

also consider 48v dc wiring for lighting etc instead of 220 v ac ( mains voltage) DC can be stored in batteries you see.

Another option might be to investigate the possibility of others in the area being interested in a long range wireless (e.g. WiMax or other long range 802.11) solution which might allow you to connect via a low powered device (e.g. standard 802.11 gear powered off batteries or a small generator etc.). Perhaps [broken link removed] might be a good source of advice and info?

ClubMan said:

Another option might be to investigate the possibility of others in the area being interested in a long range wireless (e.g. WiMax or other long range 802.11) solution which might allow you to connect via a low powered device (e.g. standard 802.11 gear powered off batteries or a small generator etc.). Perhaps [broken link removed] might be a good source of advice and info?

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ClubMan thank you so much! There are some very determined people putting WAN IRC servers (?) on the tops of big big mountains! Exciting stuff. That certainly answers my question about internet access. The information from etel about the limitations of home-generated power are not so thrilling. Thought the days of faintly glimmering bulbs for a few hours a night were a thing of the past. Have to think about all this!

48v is not dim at all. Also see about cheap chinese made wind turbines , get emailing

http://energy.sourceguides.com/businesses/byP/wRP/swindturbine/swindturbine.shtml

or see this page below where you will note that a 1500 watt generator with tower etc , 7 foot blades, 19 ft tower , you make the concrete base and away you go , that costs about 1800 in the US .



I am not selling or recommending anything at all here , merely pointing out that the generators are out there and affordable and thats my opinion and nobody elses . Nor will recommend you an installer or electrician

OK

Thanks for this one , etel! They exist, after all.
There is an other company , rather expensive but with CE mark : [broken link removed]
But try etel's first. The "windsave" seems to exaggerate their harvest. But never the less it's working.The pedalling (did i spell that right?) system works indeed like a sewing machine. For a phone connection/sattelite receiver it would provide plenty of electric energy. In bunkers this system is used to provide dozens of persons with fresh (filtered) air plus electricity for lamps and radio. But you have to eat what you want to put into : every calorie counts....maybe the right Christmass present. The oxfam shop had wind up radios for sale, a somewhat similar system , maybe that would be another link to look at. I suppose there must be some manufacturer with the "off the shelf solution" . I think the cia is in the trade as well . Small micro power plants , see http://www.qynergy.com/
I really can't recommend them ,the waste would have to thrown into the Irish sea in a similar way the British power manufacturers are handling it.
As long as the only " power eater" is a weak one ,like a sattelite receiver, it should be all right to use a battery fed by a PV panel , if necessarry you could tap the phone line for back up. This wouldn't be legal I suppose, but the energy loss to eircom would be very small, hardly meassureable. An electrician could provide you with the necessary equipment (transformer) and information.

Marie said:

If it's satellite broadband does that mean there are periods when connection is not possible (e.g. when the satellite is the other side of the earth?

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No - satellite broadband uses geostationary satellites so if you are within the broadcast area and have the right sized dish then it should always available. Some satellite broadband services require the use of the phone line for the uplink (i.e. when sending data from your PC to the net as opposed to the downlink which goes via the dish to your PC). Others use the dish for both the downlink and uplink. In more general terms a satellite broadband link should be more or less indistinguishable from the user's perspective from any other broadband link. If you are a gamer then the higher latencies of broadband will not suit you. Also some satellite broadband setups exhibit noticeable delays when initially browsing as the intermediate proxy compresses and caches data but once you get going it should be OK.

This is tremendous stuff - thank you heinbloed, etel and ClubMan. Looking at all this it seems 'do-able' sitting here in the city but just one more question. After obtaining the necessary equipment would the setting-up need very specialist expertise (e.g. costly professionals drawn from Limerick or Galway or Dublin)? or is it a level of expertise where I could do much of the installing and setting up myself with assistance from a local electrician/technician/buff?

To set up what precisely? A satellite link or a wide area 802.11 link along the lines of IrishWAN?

The whole kaboodle, including tower and 7' blades for the wind-turbine!

Hang on - you're talking specifically about the electricity generation issue here? I would assume that the vendor of this sort of equipment would provide or refer you to a suitably qualified engineering and electrical contractor to do the installation. I thought that you were talking about the broadband equipment (either satellite or other wireless gear).

That too ClubMan. It's beginning to sound as if getting a requisite power-supply and satelite/wireless gear will cost as much again as the cottage (which doesn't even have a bathroom or lav and I'm focussing on this!!!! ). Am I right in thinking wireless is the one to go for then?

Marie said:

That too ClubMan. It's beginning to sound as if getting a requisite power-supply and satelite/wireless gear will cost as much again as the cottage (which doesn't even have a bathroom or lav and I'm focussing on this!!!! ).

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Well if you want a hot shower , ever, and want to pump water from a well the electric issue is concurrent with the water issue from my point of view.

Lets ballpark the figure to give you an idea , €5k for an adequate wind generator sounds right to me. If you are on the coast of clare you will have more downtime than in east clare, strong winds stop these yokes working as much as no wind . Ask the irishwan mob about generators as they must have hit this problem before although not the output you need for a house.

Marie said:

Am I right in thinking wireless is the one to go for then?

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If there's no chance of getting DSL on your phone line, dial-up is not acceptable and presumably cable is not an option then some form of wireless would seem to be the only realistic option. If that's the case then it would seem to be down to satellite, WiFi of some sort (e.g. WiMax if/when it rolls out or medium/long range 802.11 a la IrishWAN etc.), 3G etc. It sounds like getting some form of power generation might be the bigger/costlier job here especially if you're talking c. €20K for a wind generator (judging by some of the links posted). You'd probably need to take a project planning cost/benefit analysis approach to this in order to weigh up the different fixed and ongoing costs and the benefits to see if it's worth it.

Thanks everyone! It looks like setting-up costs of 20K - 25K for the whole project and of course months of work and co-ordination, and this does all factor into the affordability of the cottage. I hadn't realised that high winds were as much a potential problem as lack of wind (which was my worry!). I also have a niggling worry that although manufacturers claim wind-generators are maintenance free it might not be quite so simple! Much to think about.

Are there any grants for installing alternative energy systems?