Kids- how many are enough? (not whether to start)

Betsy Og

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Think we had the 'whether to have any' debate a while back. But assuming you've started how do you know when to stop? We've 2 and as neither of us want big gaps its getting to decision time about #3 or leave it at 2 (biological clock issues are a while away yet so that not a factor).

The answer I'm looking for is not necessarily a number but what things to consider.

Pal/Not an only child: So starting with 1, most people would like a pal for them -tick. So that gets you to 2. Go to 3?

Extreme view on the Pal point: Have a 3rd in case anything happens one so you'll have 2 anyway. Bit extreme for me.

Three's a crowd: Two of the 3 will get on better together and the 3rd, likely the oldest or the youngest, will be left out. Also theres the phonomenon of the "middle child" having a tougher time.

Cos they're gorgeous: Dont you adore every one of them and more kids means more joy & fun (that argument, while hard to argue with, would have you with as many as physically possible, in which case the fun might wear out!!)

Gender Balancing: we've 2 boys so people might say it would be nice to have a girl, I can see that but not enough of a reason for me, I could be just as happy with another boy.

Workload: Wife minds the 2, neither at big school yet, so she's wavering and is kinda thinking that she's enough work in 2 and its easy for me be dreaming of a 3rd, I wont end up doing all the work. As an aside, what % of the vote should go to the mother (if its not a nonsensical comment/query)? 50/50? Presuming no-one would say she should have it against her will, how much say should her husband have?, I'd say its 70% mother, 30% father.

Financial: I've seen it written a few times, beware of overproviding for your kids. All the same I'd like to be able to make sure they had been given every chance along the way and that you could provide a safety net if destitution loomed in the future. So adding more decreases the scope for safety nets for all (see more re Future Health - Genetic Issues).

Birth Defect: There are many awful things that could happen, and while the odds are low and it shouldnt deter starting at all, you now have 2 healthy boys and why would you be tempting fate? (Before anyone freaks out I'm not saying you wont love that child just as much & do everything for them etc., but given the choice I doubt anyone would elect for such a circumstance).

Future Health - Genetic Issues: Something only those it affects would probably think about. So on my side bi-polar runs in the family. On a pure numbers game the more you have the more chance one of them will have it. OK treatment is getting better, you might already have the 2 that have it and the 3rd wont. Probably not a huge factor except that it "ups the ante" on the financial risk side, theres a real chance that they may not be able to have well paying careers, so providing them with safety nets isnt a pure theoretical thing.

Why you'd be reluctant to go beyond 3: Car manufacturers conspiracy, you'd have to get a momma wagon.

Save the Overpopulated Planet: One book I read said dont have more than 2 or you're adding to the problem. I dont subscribe to that, living longer is probably more of a factor in population growth so should we have compulsory culling? and Ireland is not overpopulated and, as Bill Cullen might say "Dont gimme dat about der been 1 planeh, we're only livin in bleedin Oir-landth".

Save the pension schemes: With the aging population living longer we'll need 47 people working to keep you in a pension, so how are your 47 coming along? (ok the figures are in jest but basically Ireland, and more particularly Europe, needs more taxpaying workers - heard there's a few extra folks in India & China if you let them in......)

Any other perspectives out there?

(If its of any relevance in these matters - & no doubt there's a womens magazine article that claims it explains everything - I'm youngest of 3, she youngest of 4), & if I had to bet as to what we'll decide (or will be decided ;)) I'd suspect it'll be leaving it at 2.
 
Ireland may not be overpopulated, but we are using far more than our fair share of Earth's resources.
I don't think the Genetic problems thing is quite correct. If child births are independent, then the odds of having a problem are the same for each birth. (like flicking a coin - it's always 50/50, regardless of having 5 heads in a row)
 
Ireland may not be overpopulated, but we are using far more than our fair share of Earth's resources.
I don't think the Genetic problems thing is quite correct. If child births are independent, then the odds of having a problem are the same for each birth. (like flicking a coin - it's always 50/50, regardless of having 5 heads in a row)

True, but if you're trying to avoid, say, "heads" then the more times you flick the coin the better your chances of "heads" coming up at least once
 
Well, yes Betsy good point. If you don't flick the coin at all.
 
Three is the straw that breaks the camels back, that's what I was told when I had two, I didn't take any notice and went on to have number three.

Small things like ,most holidays are for 2 plus two.
Hotel rooms take two plus two.
An extra suitcase in the car,could mean you need to hire a bigger car when abroad.

You could end up with three different collection times ,from schools.Which means its hardly worth your while to go home after collecting the first one, especially if you are any distance from the school,so end up trying to keep number one amused until number two gets out and numbers one and two amused while waiting for number three.

It can be stressful having three doing homework.,three asking questions,three waiting for a bathroom.

Three in the back of the car can be a nightmare..as they would be seated very close to each other,as opposed to two who can sit at opposite sides.

Three to pay for after school activity ,three to buy food,clothes ,books,have birthday party's and friends over and then three teenagers.

Three for the baby sitter which is obviously more expensive plus it takes longer to get three settled than two ,and more chance of the babysitter phoning you to come home.

Three to find a minder for or a family member who can take them in an emergency,this can be a lot of hassle as a lot of friends and family have already got a child or two and at least if you have two they are more willing to give a hand out,and have room for them in their car.
Not to mention, communions ,confirmations ,debs etc..

If I had my time back I think I would stick at two,for my own peace of mind,and for their future, especially the way the country is at the moment.But its easy for me to say that as I already have three.
I don't regret it and I'm sure you wouldn't either,But as I said if I had my time back...

Thats my tuppence worth ,for what its worth..
Best wishes with whatever decision you both come too.
 
We have two and our third baby is due this month.
I would agree with some of what thedaras has said regards the logistics of having 3 children over 2. I can see it will make things like holidays, school runs etc a bit more hectic.
However, one of my colleagues said something to me recently that struck a chord. He has 2 children that are now young adults. He said when they were younger, 2 was the perfect number of children but now they are older he is sorry he did not have more children for their sake. Just so they could have more siblings when they are adults.
 
He said when they were younger, 2 was the perfect number of children but now they are older he is sorry he did not have more children for their sake. Just so they could have more siblings when they are adults.

Not sure on that one, I like the "one big happy gang" thing, but I'd see that as applying more when they are younger. After finish secondary and they move out then many siblings more or less go their own way, different colleges in different cities, different jobs, different partners (unless you were with da genderal ;)) and if they had 1 or 4 siblings it wouldnt make much odds at that stage. Depends on the family/individuals I suppose, but hard to know in advance.
 
Have none and help out with your brothers , sisters or neighbours child.

Adopt before having your own.Plenty of children of there that need a good home.
 
I can't imagine having more than the one I have. Though OH has said a few times he would have liked more, we never really discussed it. There were a couple of times I thought I was pregnant, but I honestly wasn't disappointed when it was a false alarm

I am one of 6, yet I haven't spoken to 2 of my brothers in years and barely speak to my sisters or other brother. No falling out, our lives just went off in different directions.

My younger sister is about to have her 4th, I think she is mad, particularly as her eldest just turned 18, there will also be a 10 year age gap between her current youngest and the new baby.

Psrsonally I have never regretted not having more, as much as I love my son I was glad to get the years of just doing the shopping turning into a military operation. Also with things the way there are now I wouldn't want the added stress of providing for another person.
 
I read something a while back that couples that have a 3rd baby should be frowned upon in the same manner as people that drive gas guzzling cars, because of the effect it will have on the enviroment.
 
I read something a while back that couples that have a 3rd baby should be frowned upon in the same manner as people that drive gas guzzling cars, because of the effect it will have on the enviroment.

There are many things that have a more negative effect on the environment, its all about choices. What about all the environmental damage done by building a motorway - land destruction, cement manufacture etc etc?, but yet we chose to build them because the benefit outweighs the cost.

Unless you're doing specific to help the environment then chances are whatever you are doing is damaging it, so should we do nothing for fear of damaging the environment???

Theres also an element of the flip side of personal responsibility, the usual problem is no-one takes any responsibility, but theres a new strain of "You, alone, should rights the wrongs of the planet, so you must take all dis-proportionate measures because it all helps". Flip that, if you want more kids then have them, because thats important, thats worth it. By all means choose a less gas guzzling car, fly less (or not at all) etc. etc., all "realisitic" choices where the "cost" is acceptable.

A bit like the Kyoto thing, Ireland lashing itselfs because of CO2 emmissions is next to pointless unless and until all major polluters (China, India etc) are doing something about it, until then Irelands "sacrifice" is immaterial to the problem and is just another unnecessary cost (like we need that), and putting us at a competitive disadvantage to others. Rant over.
 
Once there's more of them than of ye ;) !

And, with more than two, it must get harder to treat your favourite child preferentially :D !

Gaps in age has to be considered side by side with this. Three or more seperated by a year or thereabouts each would, I imagine, be 'easier' to manage that, say, 10, 8 & 3.
 
I have 2 kids.

Some weeks, on the days when they are not too much trouble, I hanker for a 3rd.

On the other 6 days I curse the day I met their mother!

;)
 
I'm one of 7 and now that we are all grown up (almost, the youngest is 10 then it's ages 21-35) it is so nice to have each other, as friends and companions and there to chat, we live near enough to each other, pop in and out of our parent's home and visit each other's homes and ring each other. I really love having a large family (2 youngest were adopted) and I love them all for different reasons (one of my sisters is genuinely the funniest person I know and a real pick me up).
Although I know when my OH and I decide to have some that 2 will be plenty for all the reasons outlined above by thedaras. For us it's not the number of children but the "when to start" that's the issue. Right now it'd be tough to give up my freedom / holidays without a junior coming along/ quiet weekend afternoons reading the paper......I presume in time that I wouldn't mind trading that in. I'll spend the next 5 years anyway just us two.
 
Adopt before having your own.Plenty of childeren of there that need a good home.
I was under the impression it was extremely difficult to adopt in Ireland. One couple I know of have spent thousands of euros and years trying to adopt from all these different countries, so far without success.

I don't have any personal experience of it though.
 
When we only had 1 we competed for her affection ... Now we have 2 it's me and mr hp united against the common enemy ( the smalls) ... Would happily fill the house with little ones ... But you get what heaven sends!
 
The answer I'm looking for is not necessarily a number but what things to consider.
IMHO, to give children siblings is a great thing. Unless the mother is over 35 or the parents are predisposed to genetic issues then birth defects are not really a factor. The overpopulation/environmental argument is a nonsense. Ireland is sparsely populated and we need a average of 2.1 children per woman over her lifetime just to maintain the indigenous population. I'm not confident in pensions, ultimately you may have to rely on your children for support. The more of them there are the less onerous the task will be on each.
 
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